some people on here, on both sides of the arguement,seem intent on comparing smith and bluey so i thought,if its possible!,to discuss how we remember smith.

for me 2004 was supurb and smith was the reason.his rotation and man management was magnificent and ensured we were fit when it mattered.
2005 was a different matter.there was no rotation and the players were flogged so much in training that steve walsh was forced to leave after telling smith about this. at the end of the season one senior player told me that smith was the best coach he had ever played under but couldn't understand why players were worked so hard and had no games off.the players,he said,were shattered come play off time and had nothing left.
in the CC final a lot of people blamed smith forplaying senior. i don't. yes he was the coach but the medical staff and the player also should be taken to task. tha decision was more than just smiths. the decision,to play against a team who's strength was a big pack and big bench,with no props on the bench was,for me, crass and stupid. why he did this is anyones guess but for me this was a far bigger cause of leeds loss than playing senior.
2006 saw leeds play with second rowers at prop.smith wasn't helped by wards sacking but even with ward leeds were light in the forwards. we were never out of the top 3 but a shocking,gutless display against the giants saw the cup go out of the window and in the play offs we limped out of the play offs at the first attempt with another shocking display.
2007 saw leeds amble along until august when the team suddenly upped a gear which culminated in a supurd display against saints to win the GF.

i have to admit smith baffles me still. there is no doubt he is a supurb coach yet some of the things he did were very strange. he should go down in history as one of, if not the, best coach the club has had.however he will also be remembered as a man who could, and should, have won more.

I can't really argue with any of that mate.
FWIW i do wish we had the team discipline now we had under smith.
The CC selection/result will divide fans for years imo i personally think that smith AND the players have to take a share of the blame aswell hull fc for being better on the day


For me he is a leeds legend and i have more fond memories of his tenure than painfull ones.

Thumbs up.

Chaps.

All coaches could have methods they use questioned, depending on point of view and results in hindsight. There will always be differences of opinion etc. and that doesn't mean anyone in particular is right or wrong. Also, there isn't anyone on Earth who's perfect all the time and Smith obviously made mistakes. Maybe he did inherit a squad and a group of developing players who were going to win no matter what he did, maybe not. I can only judge by results. I judge by results because I've spent 20 odd years watching Leeds fail miserably at every final, every league campaign and most semi-finals they got into. To see the boys win 3 Championships in 5 years, and play in 4 GF's is my idea of heaven. Smith was in charge when it all started, so that's the only way I can judge him. We were unlucky in 2005 I think. We were the best team by miles for most of the season, but we had lost a lot of players that year and didn't have squad depth we had in 2004. Still we made the CC final (which we should have won - collect a fairly rubbish grubber kick and it's done), and the GF. In the GF we had no Keith and Bradford had drafted in Morely and broken the salary cap. Surely if we had paid less respect to the cap we could have had the extra forward or two needed to match the Bulls in the final.
2006 was awful, but rebuilding (see Saints down seasons when they restructure around their core players). And 07 and 08 are in the bag.
For me we have lived through a golden age, Leeds must now look to find replacements for McGuire, Sinfield, Ali, Keith, Donald, Diskin etc. who over the next 2-4 years will need to have top class players vying for their positions. Lets see how it goes becuase the next guy after Bluey will be the one who has to do this.

Like [url=http://www.southstander.com/fusion_pages/index.php?page_id=17this[/url....

I’ll remember him for 2004 when he took us through that incredible season.

2007 also had memorable games but not as good as 2004 where we was almost perfect in the super league.

Eccentric I think is the word.

I made no secret of the fact that I didn't approve of some of his decisions, but at times he was also brilliant.

He'll always be remembered for the success that he brought the club, so I guess he'll be remembered as a legend.

I'll remember him as the coach in 2004 who finally put a smile on Leeds fans' faces.

He may well have been in the right place at the right time, with an outstanding bunch of developing players, but his superb overall record is there for all to see.

I'm pretty sure he is a big enough guy to admit that he got it drastically wrong at Cardiff in the 2005, which for me is the only real blot on his record.

I also think he departed at the right moment for the Rhinos, and left some very large boots to fill.

Most definitely a Leeds Legend.

Perpignan 2005 flight home....

For what he achieved for the club he should be a Leeds legend, no matter what mistakes he may or may not have made.

For a club with only a handful of championships in their cabinet, to get two under one coach is phenomenal.

He could have won more, but so could every other Leeds coach in our history

a leeds legend in my eyes

Personally i blame Marcus Bai for losing the cc in 2005, what was he thinking!

What, by scoring a great try, did you want him to get two?

Passing behind his own line for a Hull score I think was the point



Smith excellent coach as mentioned previously and tight on discipline

That's precisely how we are thinking.

Just on the statty bit at the end and (I think we've been here before):

The 'points for' total should be 4561 not 4563 (The 2006 figure should be 1036 not 103icon_cool.gif

The 'points against' column doesn't add up although oddly the total is correct. (The 2004 figure should be 531 not 523)

Or at least that's what my spreadsheet is telling me.

__________

Leeds have had three different silverwear winning coaches during the SL Era:

Graham Murray - Pl 65, W 48, D 1, L 16, Pts For 1852, Pts Agst 1122, (Avg Scr 28 - 17) 75%

Tony Smith - Pl 134, W 98, D 3, L 33, Pts For 4561, Pts Agst 2338, (Avg Scr 34 - 17) 74%

Brian McClennan - Pl 59, W 43, D 0, L 16, Pts For 1666, Pts Agst 1004, (Avg Scr 28 - 17) 73%

I liked all three for what they did for the club.

Tony Smith should be remembered as the best coach Leeds have had in 30+ years. Bluey could yet overhaul him, but has some way to go IMO, as breaking the duck in 2004 counts massively in my eyes.

Nice use of spacing long sections into smaller sections to make it easier to read, guys.

Good job.

2004 was a dream season and one that I didnt think I would see as a Leeds fan! But and this maybe controversial, does anyone think that the previous management should take some credit for getting rid of the dead wood and paveing the way for the youngsters to be successful in 2004?

Now Darryl Powell was no where near a good enough coach to take us to the next level but I think he started the ball rolling?

Or am I talking b@llocks, I'm unsure myself just thought it was an interesting discussion point

I have no problem giving DP some credit for starting to revamp the side. I do have a problem with suggestions that there were any signs whatsoever of us being likely to actually win anything under his coaching.

INteresting that the average points against for each coach is the same, but Smiths team scored an average of a converted try more each game, but with little better win ratio.

That's a lame excuse, they managed to get to both finals but then were too tired to finish the job?

with love & affection

Absolutely agree. Powell, and various others in the club at the time, did some great work developing that team, and deserve a lot of credit, but I was never convinced he could get the team to take the next step and actually deliver the silverware. That was what Smith did, and that was what set him apart from most of his predecessors during my time watching Leeds.

Compeltely dissagree. Smith definatley gave us something else, but Powell started the turn around, and IMO would have definately won the trophy the year after. Opinion of course. He might not have done it with the same style however, but the silverware was that mattered.




How does he have a long way to go? He only needs to repeat it this year and he has matched Smiths success in only 2 years rather than 4. He would have done that with a weaker squad and a more evenin of the competition.

The style of rugby might not be as good, thats debatable, but he certainly does not have a long way to go.