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| Quote ="One True Saxon"So why didn't we respect possession then? Do the players not deserve criticism for dumb footie?'"
there were some dumb plays,throwing the ball about isn't on in those conditions.i will also agree,as i have said before,the pack needs strengthening sooner rather than later,but with ablett having to go in the centres we were a man light in there,and players had to play for long patches
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| Ignoring Buderus while attempting to score and Lauitiiti's attacking the Castleford ball carrier and the times players allowed kicks to bounce rather than attempt to take them on the full:
I'd quantify the knock ons:
Keith Senior - 2
Ryan Hall - 2
Jamie Peacock - 2
Luke Burgess - 2
Carl Ablett - 1
The absurd thing is Leeds made fewer errors (knock ons, forward passes, offloads to opposition, missed penalty kicks to touch, conceding penalties) than they did in the perfect playing conditions of Edinburgh in their previous outing.
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| Quote ="tad rhino"the F.A. have been trying to ban them for years.i have seen photos of injuries caused by them. as adidas plough millions into football they haven't a chance of banning them though'"
I had my calf torn open by our footy boot wearing 10. He trod on the back of my leg as I ran past him and ripped it wide open. The doc at A&E was checking if the muscle sheeth had been ripped and got his whole hand in the gash. They weren't blades but plastic studs (not the PVC kite marked rugby ones).
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| Quote ="DISA"Your kidding right? seriously, you can not possibly have seen the game to come out with that.
Webb missed miles more than the dropped bomb. I dont think he took any bomb on the full. He let most things bounce, causing huge problems. He could not beat a man. He was slow returning the kicks. All in all his performance was woefull.
Senior makes one mistake by flapping at a kick, and you think his performance was worse than Webbs?'"
Disa agree re Webb he never looked likely to catch a high ball and his kick return was laboured to say the least but to Say Senior only made one mistake is wrong.
He ripped the ball out for a penalty back chatted to give Cas another 10 and then let Dixon walk in unopposed for the try that three mistakes in one set of six
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| Quote ="Eccleshill Rhino"So Gareth McGuire scored two tries, saved two tries in the second half and made the play for the winning penalty - so how was his contribution less immense than either Sinfield or Peacock?'" Firstly, I never said Peacock or Sinfield were immense. Nor did I criticise Mcguire.
But no, I don't think he was "immense".
And as for making the play for the winning penalty................ He had a brain fart, made the dumbest play at Wheldon Road since carl Gibson tapped a Penalty in the premiership playoffs and was very, very lucky that Shenton gave away the penalty.
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| Quote ="Eccleshill Rhino"McGuire scored two tries, saved two tries in the second half and made the play for the winning penalty - so how was his contribution less immense than either Sinfield or Peacock?'"
Confirmation if any were needed that you are a fekwit.
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| Quote ="tvoc"Unfortunately for that viewpoint, in a big game he's the only Leeds three-quarter who's likely to pose any threat as well.
What caused Donald's injury last night? A sharp gust of wind? It looked bizarre from the amount of contact.'"
From the replay it looked to me like he banged his temple on the defenders knee. Although the commentry team said they couldn't see it
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| Quote ="G1"Firstly, I never said Peacock or Sinfield were immense. Nor did I criticise Mcguire.
But no, I don't think he was "immense".
And as for making the play for the winning penalty................
He had a brain fart, made the dumbest play at Wheldon Road since carl Gibson tapped a Penalty in the premiership playoffs and was very, very lucky that Shenton gave away the penalty.'"
In reference to McGuire, he was lucky to get away with such a greedy kick. Having said that least he chased the hell out of it, to apply the pressure, which lead to the penalty.
I did think his two trys were technically brilliant. They looked simple, but in those conditions (when Peacock, Hall + Biff knocked on twice) the quality of those pick-ups were outstanding, and proved the difference in the end.
I can think of a similar dumb play down t'lanes circa 98'99 ish. With Harris. We were locked at 30 a piece, nothing on the clock, we had the ball, 40m out, setting up for a drop goal surely? Last tackle came and Harris decided to take on the defensive by himself. Bet about 5 players to be fair, but was obviously grounded and the game was over. Nice.
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| Quote ="G1"Firstly, I never said Peacock or Sinfield were immense. Nor did I criticise Mcguire.
But no, I don't think he was "immense".
And as for making the play for the winning penalty................
He had a brain fart, made the dumbest play at Wheldon Road since carl Gibson tapped a Penalty in the premiership playoffs and was very, very lucky that Shenton gave away the penalty.'"
Funny out of the 4 people mentioned you picked McGuire out - no surprise there
If Shenton had not given away the penalty McGuire would have scored a try - Shenton had no alternative but to give away the penalty. Good play on McGuire's part.
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"I did think his two trys were technically brilliant. They looked simple, but in those conditions (when Peacock, Hall + Biff knocked on twice) the quality of those pick-ups were outstanding, and proved the difference in the end.'"
I'm surprised there's been no mention on here about the pick up for the first of his tries (perhaps it has on forums I don't visit). In ultra slow motion it looked a knock on to me but at a reasonable speed it looked fine. One of those.
The Dixon put down balanced the effect for me. Both had doubts but not enough to rule them out.
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| Quote ="tvoc"I'm surprised there's been no mention on here about the pick up for the first of his tries (perhaps it has on forums I don't visit). In ultra slow motion it looked a knock on to me but at a reasonable speed it looked fine. One of those.
The Dixon put down balanced the effect for me. Both had doubts but not enough to rule them out.'"
Yeah, for me he seemed to catch the ball when the ball hit the mud. Fine for me, it's one of those where once you slow it right down, questions can be asked. Those q's didn't appear at full speed. Great pick-up IMO and the Dixon 'score' is a good use of tit for tat, it all balances out generally.
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| Quote ="Eccleshill Rhino"If Shenton had not given away the penalty McGuire would have scored a try - Shenton had no alternative but to give away the penalty. Good play on McGuire's part.'"
I don't think McGuire scores there, not unless Shenton disappears.
Had Sherwin held the ball (and he should have) was it still a good play by McGuire rather than setting for a drop attempt centre field on the next play?
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| Quote ="tvoc"I don't think McGuire scores there, not unless Shenton disappears.
Had Sherwin held the ball (and he should have) was it still a good play by McGuire rather than setting for a drop attempt centre field on the next play?'"
It was an aimless punt downfield that worked because a) Sherwin made a complete hash of trying to collect it - if he'd just booted it dead the game would have been over before the drop out was taken, and b) McGuire, having no doubt realised what a cr*p option he'd taken, chased the hell out of it to try and make up for his brain fart.
McGuire got lucky, to try and proclaim it now as some piece of visionary genius is fanboy revisionism of the highest order.
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"Yeah, for me he seemed to catch the ball when the ball hit the mud. Fine for me, it's one of those where once you slow it right down, questions can be asked. Those q's didn't appear at full speed. Great pick-up IMO and the Dixon 'score' is a good use of tit for tat, it all balances out generally.'"
On the one angle it looked like he touched the ball on the way down with his left hand (I think it was), I gave it up at that point only for Wakefield official Ben Thaler to see beyond that and go forward to the touchdown.
Similarly with judging Buderus being outside the 10 metre while clearly in front of the kicker later in the half or did the ball playing the Castleford defender put him onside.
One of these days I'll get around to learning some of the rules.
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| Quote ="tvoc"Similarly with judging Buderus being outside the 10 metre while clearly in front of the kicker later in the half or did the ball playing the Castleford defender put him onside.
One of these days I'll get around to learning some of the rules.'"
I thought Thaler got that one spot on, despite the protestations of the muppets on Sky. He wasn't within a ten metre radius of the Castleford player when the ball struck him (or if he was, it was only fractionally), therefore he's onside and play can continue.
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| Quote ="Andy Gilder"I thought Thaler got that one spot on, despite the protestations of the muppets on Sky. He wasn't within a ten metre radius of the Castleford player when the ball struck him (or if he was, it was only fractionally), therefore he's onside and play can continue.'"
That was my interpretation of Thaler's initial ruling on the offside also. So was Buderus hard done to or did he indeed knock on short of the line?
Probably, so he'll have to wait a while longer for his first try for the club. I thought it was a brave attempt considering Feather's bulk was about to land on his outstretched arm, not that he would have considered that.
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| Quote ="Andy Gilder"I thought Thaler got that one spot on, despite the protestations of the muppets on Sky. He wasn't within a ten metre radius of the Castleford player when the ball struck him (or if he was, it was only fractionally), therefore he's onside and play can continue.'"
Didn't the kicker get in front of Buderus? He could also have ruled that the ball played the man, so play on, and once the kicker had gone infront he was then onside.
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| Quote ="Andy Gilder"It was an aimless punt downfield that worked because a) Sherwin made a complete hash of trying to collect it - if he'd just booted it dead the game would have been over before the drop out was taken, and b) McGuire, having no doubt realised what a cr*p option he'd taken, chased the hell out of it to try and make up for his brain fart.
McGuire got lucky, to try and proclaim it now as some piece of visionary genius is fanboy revisionism of the highest order.'"
I am not saying that what am saying is something had to be done to try and win the game Sinfield had two aborted attempts at a DG - worse case senario a draw so he took a reasonable option in circumstances a grubber in wet conditions the chances of a mistake were 50/50 it came off for him - luck/good play bit of both.
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| Quote ="Eccleshill Rhino"I am not saying that what am saying is something had to be done to try and win the game Sinfield had two aborted attempts at a DG - worse case senario a draw so he took a reasonable option in circumstances a grubber in wet conditions the chances of a mistake were 50/50 it came off for him - luck/good play bit of both.'" That is a fair comment to be fair as we are not great at kicking DG's under pressure.
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| Quote ="G1"That is a fair comment to be fair as we are not great at kicking DG's under pressure.'"
It's one I agree with, Cas would have made sure they put plenty of pressure on Sinfield if he was in position to take a DG. I think McGuire saw JJB and tried to get him on to the kick, it was the last throw of the dice.
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| The pass for the 2nd drop goal attempt was as bad a pass as I have seen
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| Leeds are not really known as a drop goal taking team but they've still kicked more (54) during the SL Era than they have conceded (41) and Kevin Sinfield is Leeds' most prolific with nineteen to his credit. Other options in the 17 at Castleford were McGuire and Burrow with two each.
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| Quote ="tvoc"Leeds are not really known as a drop goal taking team but they've still kicked more (54) during the SL Era than they have conceded (41) and Kevin Sinfield is Leeds' most prolific with nineteen to his credit. Other options in the 17 at Castleford were McGuire and Burrow with two each.'"
Shame we ain't got Danny Ward anymore to boost those figures up.
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"Shame we ain't got Danny Ward anymore to boost those figures up.
'"
That's certainly true.
Here's the full list (FWIW):
Kevin Sinfield - 19
Graham Holroyd - 10
Iestyn Harris - 7
Ryan Sheridan - 4
Rob Burrow - 2
Francis Cummins - 2
Andrew Dunemann 2
Tony Kemp - 2
Danny McGuire - 2
Daryl Powell - 2
Anthony Gibbons - 1
Danny Ward - 1
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"Shame we ain't got Danny Ward anymore to boost those figures up.
'"
Did you not see his attempt at Murrayfield? Out of practise these days, he even admitted afterwards it's probably going to be the last one he attempts
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