Wigan play Saints on the 30th. There is no way they can rest players for that game. If we lost to Catalan due to resting players it would be a shame, Lam simply doesn't have the option in the first place. A clear advantage to Leeds.

Yes the golden generation got written off a few times

And a few times that was justified - how many CC finals did they lose? For most people it was the style of rugby especially under McDermott that was the frustration - they won it from 5th twice which would suggest the quality during the season wasn't top notch?

Worth noting that the sides which won the GF from 2011 & 12 reached the Cup Final in both years as well as defeating Manly in in the World Club Challenge in 2012. Pretty successful seasons when you take them in the round although there were certainly some ups and downs. As fans we apply skyscraping standards (some more than others) for success, but I doubt whether many of us would care to measure our own achievements in life by such demanding criteria.

Wigan WILL rest players for the Saints game.

Really? Are the Wigan fans ready to accept a Leeds style bumming from Saints?

Wigan board reckons they've moved Saints game forward a day to 29th. Game on Sky.

https://wiganwarriors.com/blog/2020/09/ ... confirmed/ Wigan v Saints now confirmed for Tuesday. Pretty sure Wigan will rest players v Saints Regards EW

https://wiganwarriors.com/blog/2020/09/ ... confirmed/ Wigan v Saints now confirmed for Tuesday. Pretty sure Wigan will rest players v Saints Regards EW

These are professional sportsman with nothing else to concentrate on other than performing for 80 minutes a week - surely it isn't that much to ask that basic standards should be delivered?

Eh?

Are you saying that the 'golden generation' that won - 3 World Club Championships, 2 Challenge Cup Finals, 3 league leaders shields, 1 triple title winning season and 8 Super League Titles didn't have basic standards?

What I am saying is they lacked consistency - especially during the regular season in 2011 they lost 11 games - they only won 15 and had a positive points difference of c150 very similar in 2012. What does that say - not great during the season great in the play offs?

I’d be surprised if Leeds kept Wigan to within 30 but who knows, Leeds will certainly have to put in their best performance of the season to grab any result

It says that peaking at the right time is what matters in a competition that has a playoff system.

Quite. They were a champion team who got it right when it matters.

And of course year after year they were doing all their training aiming to peak in early february for the world club game and then again for september /october when the play offs came around. If you don't understand how these players are conditioned it might not make sense but it was really hard not to have a physical and mental lull in between times when you were playing all the other clubs who had a more natural cycle to their seasons.

If peaking at the right time is a reasonable thing to do, then I don't have to buy tickets until that peak happens. Good luck paying the players when I only go to finals (pretty cheap hobby the way Leeds are going).

Crikey, how much is your season ticket? Must be a lot if the players wont get paid if you only go to finals.

You are in the entertainment business - look at the crowds at Wigan how they dropped when negative style of rugby started by McGuire and continued with Wane was the norm. Despite winning GF's and CC's. Peaking maybe preferable if you want to win trophies but not so hot for entertainment and customer interest.

So are you saying you would have preferred the club to have not won any trophies but played entertaining rugby (we did both for quite a lot of the seasons we won trophies by the way).

Winning finals and trophies is the end goal and one that brings money into the club don't forget.

We have been very very fortunate as Leeds fans to witness what we have over the last 15 years or so, yet still it doesn't seem good enough for some fans. Granted the seasons we won the title from 5th weren't the best we have played throughout a full season to but to denigrate the actual achievement of winning from 5th and the attitude of the teams that did that seems ridiculous.

Having a solvent business is the end goal - surely?

I agree about the golden era - but that was built on the back of huge investment in playing/coaching on the back of sponsors/supporters revenues. It is no shock that as crowds/sponsorship have dropped off so has the quality of the squad, the coaching and the investment in youth development.

Off course having a solvent business is the end goal of a professional sports club, we were talking about the end goal of the players and coaching staff (your original standards line)

Your line of discussion now doesn't seem to bear any relation to the comment of yours I originally quoted, which was you basically stating that the players and coaches didn't have standards because they lost a few Challenge cup finals and won a few grand finals without playing at their best every week, which I still think is utter nonsense.

My original point hasn't changed - elite professional players should be able to perform the basics to a good standard week in week out. The expansion of the discussion is about the consequences good/bad of the inability to do that.

Its quite simple really what some fans want. If the club can stick to the following guidelines everyone will be happy -

Win every game by a massive score including nilling the opposition
Play every game with a Grand Final intensity
Sack the coach and board members after every single loss
Have a team full of kids whilst signing every world class player available
Bring home a minimum of 4 trophies a season
Oh and the style of rugby must be similar to the Hatlem Globetrotters

Failure to achieve any of the above should be seen as an unsuccessful season and good reason for a full fan revolt on social media.

Easy really.

.

All fans want is team that plays to its potential, is well coached, well invested - winning trophies is by product of all those things. Would you say over the last 3 years any of the above have been delivered?

To answer your points:
Winning - not the be all and end all if it were there wouldn't have the fans there - most teams lose more than they win.
Players only have to play with intensity 30 times a year is that really that much to ask?
There is a time for reflection that says this isn't working - definition of insanity - ask Wakefield fans?
The team needs a balance - when was the last time Leeds signed a world class overseas player? When did Leeds last develop a SL standard half back?
Only 3 trophies to win each year - is the 4th the festive challenge?
Fans want to be entertained - isn't that what rugby is entertainment - its nothing more than that.

Over the last 3 years, no probably not, however you were clearly trying to say that they weren't even when winning trophies

No I never said that - what I said was whilst the golden generation were a great team - along with the great Saints side 2006 - the best in the SL era there were many games when they didn't come close to their potential. As a spectator you don't get a discount when the team simply doesn't show up. So you might well get value for money when they win a final but that is offset by 6/7 games when the team is well below par.