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| Injurys, injuries, injuries....Sick of hearing about them. That 17 tonight had enough big game experience to at least make it competative. Out played and out coached by a team that have a plan and stick to it, regardless of there personnel..Prop hit-up right, prop hit -up right, mckeeken hit-up right, set play left with option to hit lead runner or fullback out the back, its not rocket science, its just a well coached team with very few stars but who all know there job. Conversley, we throw the ball around aimlessly, like its about to explode, with never a hint that theyr building to anything, hoping for one of our stars to do something special.
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| Cas missing first choice halfs, their fullback, and as a result of changes their centre two. This along with other big men missing. Yet our coach is the one with the injuries excuse.
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| Quote ="Gotcha"Cas missing first choice halfs, their fullback, and as a result of changes their centre two. This along with other big men missing. Yet our coach is the one with the injuries excuse.'"
who else?
im pretty sure that Ellis is their first choice half btw.
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| Quote ="mattsrhinos1978"Complete shambles of a performance, embarrassing. No plan, no structure, no clue. The players have been awful to a man but mcdermott needs to have a look at himself, its like watching a kids touch rugby team, our starting props took about 5 balls in between them in that first half, you dont win games like that. Castlefords players have been poor but theyv got a gameplan to fall back on which compensates for it to a degree, and at least allows them to function like a professional rugby team.'"
You were doing ok till you said the Cas players were poor.
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| Quote ="Neruda"who else?
im pretty sure that Ellis is their first choice half btw.'"
Gale and Roberts first choice half backs now after Benny failed trial at full back. Last years leading try scorer Greg Eden been missing most of the season. Must admit I doubted Powells selection when he picked Foster in the centre but he got MOM and had Watkins in his back pocket. The pivots just aren't good enough for a team with ambition. Just watch Parcell as a neuteral and his distribution is 3rd rate and its destroying your attack.
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| At least Josh Warrington managed to salvage some pride for the city tonight.
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| Sounds like Watkins' season is done and Walker has cracked a bone in his knee and Peteru has done his other bicep. Parcel potentially out for a few weeks as well.
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| Quote ="Charlie Sheen"Sounds like Watkins' season is done and Walker has cracked a bone in his knee and Peteru has done his other bicep. Parcel potentially out for a few weeks as well.'"
If this is all true we are in a right mess. It's all been said, turgid one man out rugby then hope some off the cuff stuff works. We have not got the quality anymore to do it.
The weighty, grey under panted pitch invader looked fitter than half our pack and showed more deception when he shook off the stewards and went again.
Toulouse played with more flair today. I don't want to watch this stuff anymore.
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| Again, anyone for a few trophyless seasons in exchange for leeds not stinking the place out during the regular season?
If watkins is injured at least moon may return to centre, every cloud and all that.
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| Quote ="newgroundb4wakey"Gale and Roberts first choice half backs now after Benny failed trial at full back. Last years leading try scorer Greg Eden been missing most of the season. Must admit I doubted Powells selection when he picked Foster in the centre but he got MOM and had Watkins in his back pocket. The pivots just aren't good enough for a team with ambition. Just watch Parcell as a neuteral and his distribution is 3rd rate and its destroying your attack.'"
You cant say that about Parcell - on here many think he is the next Danny Buderus.
There was a reason he couldn't get a game in the NRL and that is becoming increasing obvious.
I appreciate the club have other things on their mind and other demands on their finances but this squad now needs some fresh blood or play some of the kids - if Watkins is gone for the season then it might create an opening for Newman
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| Quote ="newgroundb4wakey"You were doing ok till you said the Cas players were poor.'"
I was doing more than ok throughout the post. Cas individually wernt great in that first half, the difference is theyv got a solid gameplan that allows them to function when theyr not at there best, they dont start throwing the ball about aimlessly hoping for the best like we do.
This wasnt a dig at cas, it was more a complement, they can still hammer us without needing to be at there best individually and with there most important player missing.
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| Quote ="Seth"Again, anyone for a few trophyless seasons in exchange for leeds not stinking the place out during the regular season?
If watkins is injured at least moon may return to centre, every cloud and all that.'"
I think we may be getting to the point of having a complete cull ala Lances departure & Powell stepping up.
2/3 quality signings & backing the next batch of our homegrown lads should be the way ahead now imo.
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| Quote ="RHINO-MARK"I think we may be getting to the point of having a complete cull ala Lances departure & Powell stepping up.
2/3 quality signings & backing the next batch of our homegrown lads should be the way ahead now imo.'"
The issue we'll have is McDermott talking us up - he didn't have the gall to last night, but he has been ("we're not far off" etc.) as he did last year, when we won the GF from a mediocre start. If Hetherington keeps the faith and backs McDermott then we could be in trouble in 2 or 3 years time.
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| Quote ="HRS Rhino"The issue we'll have is McDermott talking us up - he didn't have the gall to last night, but he has been ("we're not far off" etc.) as he did last year, when we won the GF from a mediocre start. If Hetherington keeps the faith and backs McDermott then we could be in trouble in 2 or 3 years time.'"
I think and hope McDermott has a bit more pride than that.
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| Quote ="RHINO-MARK"I think we may be getting to the point of having a complete cull ala Lances departure & Powell stepping up.
2/3 quality signings & backing the next batch of our homegrown lads should be the way ahead now imo.'"
I agree
It would be nice if it was powell stepping up again, great coach imo. Despite our form the clubs in a good position, our academys in the best health its been in for over a decade with some genuine star potential in the ranks, stadiums going to be fantastic, the first teams still pretty strong on paper with players any club in superleague would love to have.
I think mcdermotts had his time however, iv never been his biggest fan but you cant ever argue with the trophys. But we'r a squad thats been together for years that play like theyv never met each other, iv seen amateur teams who look more organized. I see yet again he complements our opponents goal line "D" last night, like he does every team we play, wonder if its occured to him that every teams goal line d dosnt instantly become rock solid when they play leeds, its because we throw nothing atall at them in terms of set plays, structure or a plan, like doing somthing early in the tackle count to capitalize on it a couple of tackles later. If our strike players cant outjump, run over or run around there opposite number we'r done because its very rare theyr going to be running through gap off the back of a nice set play.
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| Quote ="mattsrhinos1978"It would be nice if it was powell stepping up again, great coach imo. Despite our form the clubs in a good position, our academys in the best health its been in for over a decade with some genuine star potential in the ranks, stadiums going to be fantastic, the first teams still pretty strong on paper with players any club in superleague would love to have.
I think mcdermotts had his time however, iv never been his biggest fan but you cant ever argue with the trophys. But we'r a squad thats been together for years that play like theyv never met each other, iv seen amateur teams who look more organized. I see yet again he complements our opponents goal line "D" last night, like he does every team we play, wonder if its occured to him that every teams goal line d dosnt instantly become rock solid when they play leeds, its because we throw nothing atall at them in terms of set plays, structure or a plan, like doing somthing early in the tackle count to capitalize on it a couple of tackles later. If our strike players cant outjump, run over or run around there opposite number we'r done because its very rare theyr going to be running through gap off the back of a nice set play.'"
Dont think there is a single person on here that doesnt agree with those comments Matt but does anyone actually see McDermott going anywhere? I know I dont.
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| Quote ="Marty Grrrrrrrrrr!"Dont think there is a single person on here that doesnt agree with those comments Matt but does anyone actually see McDermott going anywhere? I know I dont.'"
Yeah agreed, i cant see him leaving any time soon.
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| Quote ="Gotcha"I think and hope McDermott has a bit more pride than that.'"
I dont think "pride" comes into it tbh imo he needs "pushing" because i dont ever see a scenario where he walks on his own accord.
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| McDermott has been a winning coach at Leeds I cannot say I have enjoyed his style of play - there have been some fantastic games/wins but on the whole the style of play is boring/turgid.
He has been unfortunate with injuries this season but I think everything has a time span - so either a host of players go or the coach goes.
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| Quote ="Sal Paradise"McDermott has been a winning coach at Leeds I cannot say I have enjoyed his style of play - there have been some fantastic games/wins but on the whole the style of play is boring/turgid.
He has been unfortunate with injuries this season but I think everything has a time span - so either a host of players go or the coach goes.'"
I'd probably go with getting rid of a fair few players. We have won plenty under Mac, but as with 2016 We've lost some quality golden generation players, had a bad run of injuries and lost a lot of games, and as in 2016 some are calling for the coaches head I'm not saying Mac is with out fault but he can only put out what's available to him. I hope we see Leeds having the confidenced to give some of the youngsters a good go. I can't see us doing much this year but if the precipitates a clear out of the under performers and the emergence of some quality home grown tallent, I'll be happy. But I don't expect us to win every year........... Just most years
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| going to shock a few but I'm defending the coach on this one. the only think I can criticise him for is his pig headedness with persisting with moon at 6. can't pass, no kicking game no influence.
he can only use what he has and the person who has let ALL our second rowers get old and way past it at once deserves his share of stick too.i love JJB but he's so far off the pace it's embarrassing.
if, and I say if, it's time for a change do it now with so many players off contract so a new coach can get in who he wants.
we, and me , have been proved wrong before. I'd give it a bit longer yet.
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| and those Cas folk are having anti whino's fest on FB
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| I wonder if some of them have been told they are not being retained hence the not bothered display yesterday
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| Quote ="lionarmour87"I wonder if some of them have been told they are not being retained hence the not bothered display yesterday'"
No idea tbh but they look unfit unorganised & devoid of anything.
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| Tad makes some fair points but we should remember that Moon has done better than any of the others tried at 6 and we should not forget he was voted runner up in the player of the season by the fans. He is not a game manager but is an effective runner and his up and under kicking has led to quite a number of tries.
However I think we have lacked a game manager and on field leadership since Sinfield left the team and we should have signed a quality 6 when it was obvious Sutcliffe was not up to the job.
We currently have key players that are out of form like Moon, Ferres and Cuthbertson (who although he made a lot of tackles against Cas he did not make one offload against Warrington) and Parcel has been below his usual excellent form not helped last night by picking up an early injury).
Last night was an awful performance by the team as a whole and was not helped by Myler being fouled out of the game and early injuries to Parcel and Walker who looked weak on defence perhaps due to his injury. Watkins's injury did not affect the result but he was not at the races up until then in any case. I do hope his injury is not serious as last night apart he had been having a good season.
The long term injuries to our forwards, in particular the front row, has dulled the edge of those that have had to cover the middle defense which showed up last night. You can get by for a few games without your big men in the middle but not for half a season. We have lacked the bulk and strength of Garbutt and Galloway all season (the latter should have been replaced) and Peteru has missed most of the season. Cuthbertson and Mullally have missed a 5 or 6 each, Sutcliffe had been injured for 10 games, Ferres has missed 7, Ward 4. Add to that the injuries to Dwyer and Keinhorst and now we have to do without Singleton, Watkins, Peteru, Parcell and Walker who has already missed 7 and you have serious problems.
These are not just excuses as these injuries greatly reduce the chances of a wining matches as even with decent reserves the lack of a settled team has a negative effect with constant changes. In our case our fit reserves are inexperienced youngsters who cannot be expected to do long minutes without a rest.
To start against Cas with 19 year old Oledski (who I thought was our best player) and Peteru who got injured again with only Cuthbertson on the bench as a prop and you start with a major disadvantage.
We will have to recall Keinhorst for the Cup match and with the top 4 now a slim chance perhaps we should give the likes of Newman, Broadbent, and Holroyd a run.
We also are lacking in real pace and do not make enough clean breaks and our kicking game is not up to standard. Only Wakefield have made less attacking kicks than us and we have yet to make a 40/20.
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