I thought Brent Webb was very good again overall.

It's obvious why he got MOM, he was directly compared to his opposite number - the jittering wreck that is Richie Owen.

Bet Mathers is sing in a corner somewhere.

Agree totally, Mathers may have is faults but he is 10 times the player Owen is and a ever will be.

Good man. You know I always had faith in you

Before his injury I thought Owen was going to make a great player. Either the injury has taken it's toll, Owen has begun to believe his own press or he's mixing with some bad influences darn t'lane (maybe all three) and now Owen has gone so far backwards he does look like a joke.

Sad really, maybe if he's a good boy father Christmas will bring Owen his talent back at Christmas. Unless owen has upset Father Christmas.

Well he's getting his run at full-back that he wanted.

Careful what your Christmas Wish is, it seems.

Like it when Owen tried to go all 'Webb' on us, passing to his winger in-goal. That worked...........for Leeds.

While I wouldn't have given MOM to Webb I thought he had a good game, yes there was some poor passes but for me his positives outweighed the negatives. He looks alot better this year than last to me, even kick returns he looks alot more interested and dangerous than he has in the past

Owen did look a prospect before his injury and while he's not looking so hot now I don't understand why Richard Mathers would take any great comfort from that.

Apart from when Warrington were about to get rid he's never come near to his distant Leeds form, IMO.

This.
The injury seems to have set him back years and he is looking very ordinary now i also remember you rating him higher than Shenton in terms of potential and raw talent pre-injury seems both are set to be confined to the "ok" ranks.

Mathers may glean some self satisfaction from the manner of his discarding at Cas from the fact that, whether Mathers is at his Leeds best or not, he's still playing a million miles better than the player who took his position. Also, the club may have backed the wrong horse for reasons other than form if rumours turn out to be true.

Mathers wouldn't be human if he didn't allow himself a wry smile at the least.

More rumours G spill the filth!!

Not a chance.

www.engagesuperleague.co.uk/stat ... eason=2012 Leaving rumours aside, I see nothing much in those yet to suggest Castleford backed the wrong full-back for 2012 and beyond although his early promise for me was shown on the wing.

www.engagesuperleague.co.uk/stat ... eason=2012 Leaving rumours aside, I see nothing much in those yet to suggest Castleford backed the wrong full-back for 2012 and beyond although his early promise for me was shown on the wing.

I assume they are stats? Fair enough. I based my opinion on what I've seen of each of them playing rugby this season. I haven't looked at the stats. Won't be doing either.

To be fair tvoc viewing both Mathers and Owen in games thus far for me Mathers has looked much sharper with and without the ball AND he's grazed his knees aswell=LAD!!

I've just had Ian on the phone again, he wants to know if this extends to all stats.

I've seen Owen V Salford and Leeds and Mathers V Widnes and Bradford.

If I had to chose one over the other from that sample it would still be Owen ... just about although as a full-back he's a lot of improvement to make.

Tell he he owes me a big thank you for crediting him with extra carries having watched him Friday (I said I thought he made 3). Kirke's biggest fan me, exaggerating his work rate.

It could just be Opta being mean again.

I thought he made more than the two carries also, not that I was counting or anything.

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Edit: Check carried out and if Opta have only credited Kirke with two drives they have made a mistake depending on what they term a carry.

He took a carry in the first set after he replaced Peacock around the 30 minute mark - although Hemmings said it was Peacock - no they don't do they? He took a carry in the next Leeds set.

His third and final carry came in the opening set of the 2nd half.

Out of the 2 in question I only see one as a full-back.

I didn't see a right lot of Kirke on Friday, don't know how many minutes he was on, but 3 carries is pretty poor. How many tackles out of interest?

Hardly your fault shag.

Looks like my initial observation was spot. With that in mind are we willing to accept my immediate and random thoughts as being more accurate than Opta? If so, I don't expect them to be scrutinized going forward.

Kirke and clarkson both had poor stats for the game, both for me should be given some time in the u20. Not too worried by clarksons form, sure he can turn it around long term

That takes me back a bit, probably to about 2003 when I first started reading the board. la

You wish. You may be more knowledgeable than most on here, but un-scrutinized? I don't think so.

Kirke replaced Peacock while Sinfield was convertiing the Watkins score. The substitution was reversed in the 47th minute.

I made that around 18 minutes either side of the break. It coincided with a very sloppy period by Leeds categorised by poor handling when in possession and poor discipline when not. While the three carries doesn't sound a great deal (and isn't) it would also be interesting to see a comparison to the other Leeds players out there during that spell.

Unfortunately no-one will put any effort into doing such a thing because it's much easier not to.

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Yours and mine both on this occasion then, although I actual imagine you sat somewhere with a post-it note and biro headed up 'Ian Shirke drive/s'.



If we are it's only a sad commentary on the collectors of statistical data that some pundits and posters like to put great store by. I find them to be sadly lacking when put to the test.



I've been trying to ignore your post match commentaries since Danny Buderus arrived.

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Phil Clarke during the aftermatch analysis programme showed a missed tackle stat of Castleford 18 Leeds 8 and Castleford 3 Leeds 10 for breaks. Opta on Monday report Castleford 27 Leeds 11 and Castleford 1 Leeds 9 for these categories.

Do Sky not use Opta?

Opta are also reporting Castleford conceded 5 penalties, I can show they conceded 6:

9th minute - High Tackle, Dixon on Leuluai
39th minute - Ball Steal, Chase on Jones-Bishop

48th minute - Grapple Tackle, McGoldrick on Hall
71st minute - Offside, take your pick
74th minute - Ball Steal, Emmitt on Peacock
76th minute - Re-start not travelling 10 metres, Dixon

It appears from the individual counts against the Castleford players that the 71st minute generic offside is the one that has been missed/ignored.

This is pretty basic stuff. If they can't be trusted to accurately reflect penalty counts it doesn't leave much hope for the rest, IMO. Still it gives Phil Clarke and others incapable of reading the game somewhere to hide.