Correct mate. Total liability for me at the min

How fickle are our fans?

Webb had a dreadfully poor game but statements like "he should never play again" are ridiculous.

IMO, the coach made a blunder by shifting a very in form Hardaker to give Webb the full back jersey on reputation and not form. That's McDermott's mistake, not Webbs. That said, Hardaker is still a young player and in the eyes of our fans went from the "best young centre in the league" to deserving of being dropped at that position to the best full back in the world. It will only take a slight dip in form before many of you who have said Webb should "never play again" will be calling for "Superman" to replace Hardaker.

Agreed. I can't see how Zak can be moved from the full back role before Wembley and probably before the end of the season, but Webb has been remarkable for Leeds in the past and I am sure could be again if he was given the chance. Rightly, though, he is unlikely to get that chance unless Hardaker is injured.

Webb's performance last night was disappointing. But for me it was not half as upsetting as having support the same club as the scumbag Leeds fans who cheered when he got injured at Warrington.

G1, I'm not basing this on last night

His form for the vast majority of this season has been poor. A penalty machine who cant pass very well is what we have seen from him this season

It's sad to see

Basing what?

A desire to never again see him play for Leeds?

Can't get my head around that. As MJM has said, he shouldn't play full back ahead of Hardaker (and shouldn't have done last night) but injuries and form could still leave Brent with opportunities that I would be delighted to see him take.

FWIW, IMO, early season, when we were in the mire, for all his errors (and he wasn't alone) he was one of our most creative forces. Ryan Hall might not have had any tries before June had it not been for Webb.

When we were desperately poor over the first half of the season, Webb was our only creative threat. The tries we did score more often than not came through him, playing as an extra halfback.

Given Webb's deterioration in fullback defence, Hardaker does look like a better pick at 1 at the moment, but without McGuire it should be a no-brainer to have picked him in the halves last night.

Incidentally, we scored tries from kicks to the corner and an interception last night, but nothing from creative ball-in-hand play. The one-out rugby mentioned on another thread was most noticable inside Wakefield's half, where we could have done with a player like, say, Brent Webb to create the gaps and options that nobody else seemed to manage.

On paper, a reasonable-looking game to re-select Webb. Less so in practice although he wasn't on for long enough to be the scapegoat that some are making him out to be. The game was still winnable well into the second half.
On a different track, defences are now very savvy to Lunt going for the line from acting half. Every time he gets held up over the line it takes all the impetus from the remainder of that set.

Brent Webb could play for Leeds again but without a change in attitude I personally don't think he should be allowed to represent.

He started poorly but somehow still managed to get worse with every successive involvement. In a season full of dumb plays the one on twenty-five minutes will be hard to top.

As i stated in a pre-match thread,i didnt have a problem with Webb coming back into the team last night at full back and thought it made it an easy decision for Mac to make with players unavailable, to switch zak back to centre.

However,for the last couple of seasons now this side has aproached many regular round games with a poor attitude and discipline of which Webb has been one of the main culprits.Last night being a perfect summary.

But like i also said Webb has had a great career at this club and i cant think of a time he has let us down in a big game, infact he seems to thrive in them.I do think Mac needs to keep him on the back burner for now but if the time comes during the cup final or play offs when it really matter, then i would have no worrys seeing Webby in the team.

I could only watch the game for about 15 minutes last night due to SkyGo issues, but was watching long enough to see him do his party piece and give away a penalty when in possession

I've always thought that Brent Webb's performance mirrored Leeds'. Read that what way you like but when Webb plays poorly, Leeds play poorly.

When Webb plays well, Leeds are hard to beat. If he's physically still got it (which I'm not in a position to judge), and he's mentally switched on I'd select him in the cup final squad as I think he offers more than almost any player, it is a risk though.

I can honestly say IF we have a fully fit squad for the CC final then i wouldn't take the gamble in playing Webb.

Have to agree.

Webb DID offer something earlier in the season, with his cut out passes been the only service Hall got. However, his petulance and inability to properly tackle seems to be even worse than at any other time previously.

When the opinion is generally here offered that he 'should not play again in a Leeds shirt' I think it is on everybody's assumption that there will be no injuries or drop off in form in the present back line options (inc Keinhorst). On that basis he shouldn't IMHO.

Things do change though.....and it has to be said it is worrying how little the team seems to be able to utilise its pretty impressive back line.

Either way we have to get used to Webb not being around: is there still justification for playing Sinfield at SO without the extra half back FB ? Ward would seem to me to offer better options alongside McGuire at HB; Sinfield back to LF.

JP has been slow at getting up to PTB for quite some time now, I seem to remember commenting on it a couple of season ago. Yes he does rather plod forward but when in contact he continues to make ground taking 2 or 3 opposition players with him so he still puts us on the front foot. This ability was again evident against Wakefield whose pack you say "well handled" him. If well handling him meant allowing him to make so many metres then they "well handled" the rest of our pack even better yet you have chosen not to comment on this.

That JP carries more often and makes more ground than his forward colleagues and puts in huge tackling stints as well seems to carry no weight with you. You say he should be rested more yet the other props do not have JP's stamina and are only capable of shorter stints. JP is not an impact player and for him to spend longer on the bench will not improve his speed but only reduce his high work rate which is and always has been his main asset. We cannot wind back time and make JP younger but we can allow him to continue to do the hard work while looking for the younger players to make the impact.

Turning to selections. With injuries, a suspension and some rested players McD had a restricted choice for selection. With Webb fit again it would have been a suprise if he had not been be picked having been a leading player, at FB, in our recent successes including this years WCC. To play him out of position would also have been a risk. We now know he had a shocker but Webb is the sort of player that can also win matches and without McGuire I guess the coaches had planned for Webb join the attack on the left side SO link position that he does so well.

Hauraki was picked I guess as a rotation and I do not think you can blame the coach for having 2 players being such liabilities on the field that he had to pull them both off within 35 minutes.

I think Ward (started at SO and not a 2nd rower anyway) was at centre for only about 5 minutes between Webb going off and Keinhorst coming on.

I don't think Mac would have used Burrow after he had been fouled unless he thought he had recovered. This incident was another important factor in reducing our attacking effectiveness. But I guess you blame the coach for this foul too!

We play our best when he's not even in the squad, if the last seven games are anything to go by.

Are you saying to me that the other Props aren't capable of doing 5 more minutes of extra gametime to reduce JP's work-load? Seriously because if that is the case god help us when he gets injured and id sack either those other Props or our conditioner!
JP gets mentioned simply because of the length of time he was on when he was clearly blowing out of his backside and less effective ,he can still be explosive over a shorter stint or isnt that possible??
Also id rather he got a much quicker ptb and less 5m per carry than the other way round which again he's still capable of over a shorter stint surely??
Im fully aware of what JP brings but to get any more longevity out of him running him into the ground during the regular SL fixtures will do us no favours whatsoever.
The pack overall were dissapointing and out-played by their opposite numbers.
Onto Webb he was left out last week when fit so why change a winning team in a position we have covered that has also worked so well for nearly 2 months?
No doubting Webbs contribution over the years but lets not also forget we had more threat from FB when ZH switched there which was also the start of this winning run including a CC semi which he starred in.
Webb has played SH before so why not stick him there with Keinhorst at LC leaving Ward at 13 etc.
Again Hauraki is down to the coach we had the option of Kirke or Clarkson as the other BR who both have been in better form one for the 1st team the other for the U20's alongside Hauraki.
The return of RB was ridiculous 99% of RL players will say the are ok to return after such a knock the coach should of said not today fella he was banjoed big time bringing him back imo was wrong.
It will be interesting to see the 17 for HKR hopefully we can file this under blip and move forward because at times this year we haven't recovered from a comprihensive beating very well.

I am saying that I do not buy your assumption that giving JP another 5 minutes on the bench will somehow speed up his PTB which has been slow for a couple of seasons. He is a player that thrives on work....it is his game style. Age has of course slowed him down but not his stamina and he still offers the most offloads in the pack. I am also saying that most of the pack would not achieve as many tackles or make as much ground as JP in these extra minutes on the field and none of them are exactly dynamic off the bench. Why not allow him to keep making his big contributions in his own way and concentrate of others for your quicker PTB.

Also why do you keep saying JP is blowing out of his backside or "arris" as you prefer. Did he upset you by farting near you or something? Is that why you keep picking on him.



Webb was given an extra week off as there may have been doubts about his fitness.

Poor Brian Mac he just cannot win with you. You wear out keyboards posting you demands and critiques that he should rotate the pack and then when he does it doesn't suit you. Hauraki was terrible but was in on rotation not form to give the likes of Clarkson a rest.

I cannot comment on Burrow's fitness to return as I am not aware of the facts! I would assume though that the coaches took the advice of their medics.

Poor Brian Mac he just cannot win with you. You wear out keyboards posting you demands and critiques that he should rotate the pack and then when he does it doesn't suit you. Hauraki was terrible but was in on rotation not form to give the likes of Clarkson a rest.

When was Clarksons last 1st team appearance?
I'm going by what ive witnessed in the u20's and Clarkson is by far in better form re-Brian Mc i already said above his call to drag Webb off was to be applauded.
The team are on a 6 game winning run which included a fantastic Semi win against the hot favourites during which ZH played a blinder at FB so why upset that new found confidence and combo with Webb re-taking that shirt especially as BW is leaving?
Also re- the Pack again ARE you saying JP wasn't tired or blowing 25 minutes in?
The rotation is spot on when done with the right players in the right places and imo this time he got that wrong with givinh Hauraki a start over Clarkson and picking Kirke at 13 when he'd had a better impact elsewhere over the last 6 weeks.
Do you not think its better to play players in their natural places as much as possible and if it doesn't happen and results in a performance ala monday is it JUST the players selected fault or a collective blame just as it is a collective celebration when we win?
This keyboard is in fine fettle but thanks for your concern and ill post my opinions on players ,performances the club etc etc just as everyione else does.
If everythings fine and dandy with you and they can do no wrong then good for you i prefer to tell it how i see it at that particular time and in that individual game with no agendas despite what you say , you dont have to agree thats you're perogative and own opinion.

I just re-read the thread title and am relieved Puig Aubert no longer posts.

SAUCY.

Have you had the Mr Sheen out on the glass coffee table G?

2 game ban

We've been playing better without him so no biggie in my book.

webb has been a brilliant servant for leeds, but at the moment the team is better without him, that unfortunate but there can be no sentiment in sport.

the only way i can see webb playing at wembley is if ablett and delaney are both out

sorry to say it but he was at fault in the Wigan Home beating as well. He's lost it mentally now

The ban should mean that he's no chance of being in the team for the CC final apart from injury. BM would be crazy to pick a guy who's played so few games and move Hardaker in the process unless he absolutely has to. I'd also bet that we'll get absolutely thumped at Cats anyway as I doubt most of the team will try that hard and will probably try to avoid getting hurt (completely the wrong attitude IMO).