How does the saying go ' start listening to the fans and soon you will be sitting with them'.

I often don't agree with his team choice, his game plan or his interchange use.

However, I've never won anything and since he came out trophy cabinet needs a full-time cleaner.

He isn't here to be loved, he is here to keep the club winning. Hard to really knock him.

My point is though that not a lot has changed since his first season, obviously at the start of 2011 he looked absolutley hopeless and has proved himself better than that but a few problems still remain.
Given we have won 5 major trophies in his time here isnt it surprising that we have only finished in the top 4 twice?
I dont know if that means he has over achieved or under achieved tbh
Even last season, which some fans have called the best Leeds team ever, we still lost a lot of regular season games, and have yet to go through a season with him without at least one poor run of form
Compare that to the 2004 team under Tony Smith that absolutely blasted nearly everyone in the league finishing top by a record margin, with arguably a lesser team
To put this in perspective, Anderson and Wane have managed to finish in the top 4 every season, even though they have lesser squads and I would still call them lesser coaches

I dont think its as black and white as you make out, for me there are legitimate grievances to have with Mac, and I havnt seen many on here that seem to be blindly against him without reason...

I've been bewildered by McDermott on many occasions but he coached us to an amazing treble last season, so yes I'm happy with him. I don't particularly care if we have an off-year after that.

I spoke with Brian McDermott during a tricky period in 2011, and found it an uneasy conversation with him appearing to get quite defensive, much the same as his persona during media interviews around that time. Despite our success in his first 2 seasons I couldn't quantify what positive impact he'd had on the team, or if he'd just been in the right place, with the right players, at the right time. Five years down the line I've got used to his uneasy manner and the trophy cabinet is full. I like the way he commits himself 100% to the job, and obviously thinks deeply about what he does day in day out. Despite a tricky start to the season I think it would be wrong to question his judgement, he has credit in the bank. Whether he is a good coach can only ever be an opinion, there is never a factual formula to determine how good a coach is. There may be better coaches elsewhere with the "wrong" team that will never have chance to manage a big club like Leeds, but McDermott could also be the best coach realistically available. I've disagreed with his sub rotation and game tactics on many occasions, but I'm sure that could apply to any incumbent coach when things aren't working . I'm happy for him to carry on developing as a coach, that is an ongoing process and not just applicable to the players.

I think it should also be mentioned that imo at least, the standard of SL coaching is at an all time low, so its not like we could replace him with a guaranteed world beater
He clearly does some things well and can motivate players when we need it most, there are just some things I find really frustrating, and I dont understand how he hasnt figured out his mistakes, hes like bloody Arsen Wenger
The main one obviously being only using one sub in the first half (and sometimes not using a sub), it cost us last year against cas, and noone mentions it but he did it AGAIN in the WCC and we unsurprisingly got blitzed in the second half

He has immense self belief, I'll give him that. He also seems to instil the belief that he's right into his players too with the result everyone's 100% committed to any game plan. Which, as we've seen, can take a side a hell of a long way.

Bloody hell he won the treble last year and coach of the year and still gets flack , some of your lot are as bad as ours if not worse

I can't believe that this thread even exists. RL a game played by 17 men and 17500 coaches.
His record says it all.
Whatever his playing roster, BM has bought more trophy's in a few years than I have seen in the rest of my 30 odd years watching
Obviously losing a fantastic captain and one of the best props Leeds has seen in many a year is going to be a hurdle to get over. Let him get on with his job and we will see by the end of this season beginning of next how well his plans go.
How many times did Sir Kev say BM is the best coach he has ever played for. I can't recall him ever saying that about anyone else during his tenure at Leeds

If you're going to compare a coach to what we did in 2004 then no coach will be good enough (whilst great that year both Saints and Wigan had shockers in terms of rivals).

Whilst you point out 2 top 4 finishes in 5 years, it has been 2 in the last 3 years and would've been top 4 possibly 1st in 2014 had we not thrown it away by playing weakened teams vs Bradford & London around the Cup Final.

Whilst the table doesn't look great at the moment, if we can pick up 4 points from 4 this weekend then it'll look a lot healthier on Tuesday morning.

Yea but its him that picked the teams that threw it away in 2014, we could have been top if managed properly

For those saying this thread souldn't exist, or is unfair, I dont think fans should blindly follow the coach even though he has been successful, I also havnt seen anyone so far that want his head in the way that people call for Wane or KC out on their boards

This also has virtually NOTHING to do with our recent form, we will improve, I am confident of that, this thread is more about his coaching style

Yes. He likes to keep his best players On the pitch as long as possible which means at times you end up with the unused sub and guys looking worn out. Sometimes he will get it wrong - cas at end of last year. However, his record is exceptional and in essence shows he knows much more than i do and has probably forgotten more than I know.

Yes but presumably so does everyone whos coached for more than a decade?


I do hope that I get proved wrong with some of the things he does, and in 5 years every coach is leaving 3 subs for the second half
Im just racking my brain this week as to why you would pick Galloway and walters over singleton or Garbutt? Walters is somewhat understandable as you need mobile defenders to counter gale on Roberts in the middle but Singleton is more mobile than Galloway surely?

I do admit though that there are times when backroom issues that we dont know about effect his decisions, for example he has worked hard to keep Hardaker and Ablett happy, praising them even if they miss a load of tackles, this may be down to them being in contract negotiations or maybe they just seem low on confidence, whilst Singleton and Garbutt may just be getting a kickup the backside in fairness
Similarly I think Watkins was named as our best player last year by Mac over Cuthbo or Zak basically to give him a (deserved) pay bonus

Don't you think Garbutt and Singleton may have been rested as we now have to play 3 games in 8 days? Having a couple of props fresh for that would seem a good idea wouldn't it?

why rest the same props 2 weeks in a row?

Gotcha - what is it that BM wanted that GH didn't deliver this year?

Personally I'll admit I was wrong about BM. I think part of it is that he continues to seem genuinely odd.

I also have a sneaking suspicion that there may have been a conscious decision not to aim for a fast start this year given the injuries we already had in the squad combined with the clear fatigue factor which nearly cost us the comp at the end of last year.

So anything Mac does he's damned, anything he doesn't do is inaction and is also damned.

Hmm.

Agenda?

With the third game in being for a WCC and a clean sweep of available silverwear I'd really hope that wasn't the case. The fade in 2015 was probably just an inevitable consequence of getting no time off during the season and an argument for a future thirteen or even eleven team comp introducing forced rests on a rota.

Hard to fathom the singo garbutt one. The Lord Brian moves in mysterious ways or perhaps he is the new messiah.

It will be an interesting game on Monday - should be an easy win.

McDermott's stock is falling fast even with some of his most ardent supporters - injuries have been severe but no more severe than for Cas and the team put in a shocking performance against a side they should have been capable of beating.

The team just look a rabble without direction at the moment - whilst you always new with Sinny/Peacock they could match anyone I am not sure that is the case now - was the success because or inspite of McD

well i guess we will see over the next couple of seasons. I'd like to think not but the team he has still on paper is as good as any in SL at the minute still and should be top 4 no problem. You have to cut him a bit of slack imo for the slow start due to the injuries but now bodies are back you expect results to follow. I personally can live with a mediocre season this year because of how good last year was and transition and all but with the players he still has at his disposal Mac should be able turn it around if he is good enough, if he feels he needs an organiser then that's for him to identify and sort out with GH for next season no excuses really.

If the rumours are true and he wanted rid of Burrow and get a half back in but was over ruled then I would agree he should be given a bit of slack.

What is hard to take is the poor performances of many of the players - they just don't seem committed?

I'm not sure i would say not commited, but it certainly seems like a few of them just expect things will just happen without laying the platform first. Also, would like to add our work at the ruck is just awful at the minute, scruffy as hell and teams are just controlling us from there.It's happened every single game bar the opener against wire, and needs sorting asap.

I though that too, easy meters every time.

I'm not sure i agree that the players are not committed. There was no lack of effort last night just no organisation and creativity. This coupled with several senior players out of form leads to displays like last night.

I don't think commitment is the issue, there's still plenty of people putting the work in. Teams are putting loads of effort into stopping the offload game, and we don't have a plan B. Cas scored two tries where they made a gap for someone to walk through untouched, when was the last time we did that?

I also agree with Biff, we do not win any ruck atm no matter how many numbers we put in. Not saying we need to be uber wrestlers but we need to better, at the minute it's leading to penalties and worse, quick ball for the opposition.