I have no idea who the op post is aimed at.
I don't think I have been too critical of burrow McDermott this season to be honest. My point was against threads like this d!ck measuring threads. It is a message boards with different opinions which makes it more interesting. My point is if you disagree, then disagree when someone makes a point. If someone has an opinion 6 months ago which is then proved wrong.to come back in 6 months time with a "ha ha I was right you were wrong thread is pointless and for me d!ck measuring.

It was aimed at an individual but he hasn't shown himself on this thread.

I didn't say anything at the time, so not really d1ck measuring and, in any event, I'm pretty certain I'd win that contest without a keyboard.



The point has been made, there is no point labouring it any further.

I'm not sure it's a good thing to trawl back to a topic from way back just to make a point but, while we're on the subject of Burrow I'll throw my two penneth in. I have so much respect for the little fella, it's always gonna be tough when you're being hammered by fellas twice your size, but he's never shirked anything. I think he's been a lot better for us recently because he's had some clear directives from the coaching staff. No more crabbing sideways invading your team mates space, he's been more direct and made some good yards from the ruck. He's took a lot more stick, but like I said, he has the heart of a lion. I also think he is the best positional kicker in the team, always into space, never caught on the full, and most of the time a great length. He would always be in my 17, whether he starts or comes on to test tired bodies. He will have a massive role to play at this club over the transitional period, and he's well up to it.

It should be pointed out to make it work it needed Kallum Watkins to make a huge effort in defence these last few weeks.

35 tackles vs Wigan
30 vs Saints
28 vs Hudds
39 vs Cas (when Lilley played the Burrow role)

This is far from ideal and not a long term solution, and the emotion and desire to win the treble with those guys retiring isn't going to be there every week to drag us over line defensively.

Watkins certainly shouldn't be making that number of tackles.

Burrow has certainly shown his value in the last few weeks, and like JJB deserves the chance to continue to play for Leeds until he chooses to pack it in.

Earlier in the season I thought the pack was f******d. And I still think it was. The management seemed to agree, the recruitment of Garbutt was very much needed particularly now we hear about Kylie's heart issue restricting his performance. We also switched Keinhorst into the pack as well to add some youth. It's notable the amount of times out outside backs carted up the ball on Saturday, that was obviously to spell the forwards far more than you would normally see. We also have a guy at 6 who takes the workload of a forward as well.
Peacock doesn't factor, he isn't human.
With Ward and Aiton fully fit, Garbutt adding some fresh legs and Cuthbertson making the opposition suffer with
offload after offload we could compensate for the overall wear and tear in the rest of the forwards. I also think Briscoe came back just in time, he is as strong as any forward.
Bar the really strange tactic of rarely using all 4 subs equally I think BMD did a great job mid season to sort things out, you could see how the team was totally blown at the end on Saturday. But ultimately there is no point having any gas in the tank at the end of the race and finishing second.

I'd agree with all that. But we should not ignore the mentality that's now inherent to this team. However beat up and knackered the players might be, they've yet to concede a single point after the 61st minute in any of the eight Grand Finals they've contested.

That is utterly extraordinary.

He has done so well covering that it had been his position for years and he was won 2 Harry Sunderlands and a Lance Todd there.

Burrow is a fantastic hooker and had been for years. He was fantastic in the run in and had been great for months coming up to that.

I have no idea why leeds fans have been so quick to jump on the Aiton bandwagon and big up a decent three quarters of a year and so reticent to praise a true Leeds Legend who has no won every club trophy available and has been the mom in 3 finals personally.

Burrows simple presence creates space. He pulls defenders in, wins a lot of penalties, makes a lot of yards and breaks, scores a fair few tries and has won big big games by breaking them open in a way nobody in world rugby can.

If no opinions are any more right or wrong than anyone else's I look forward to giving the pilot my opinions on flying on my way to rotterdam in a couple of weeks.

Opinions can be wrong. Those expressed on the relative merits of Burrow and Aiton have been proven so.

jimmy was switched as last man standing and still undeservedly left out of wembley.

was garbutt always due to be signed or was it the injuries?

i said elsewhere burrow played a lot more unselfishly last few games

He hasn't won a Lance Todd trophy and one of his Harry Sunderland awards was back in 2007 when he played at 7.

That's an amazing stat.

Burrow played 7 in the same way Sinfield played 13.

Burrow is also the only player with 2 Harry Sunderlands.

He didn't play hooker though did he as you thought as that was clearly Diskin in 2007. Which cup final did Burrow win the Lance Todd in then???

Yes. In the same way he always does. This is the point. Whether wearing 9, 7 or a some other number Burrows contribution has been his skill set. Not his ability to fulfil some preordained role dependent on what number is on his back. Burrow never played as a 'proper 7' as he never played as a 'proper 9'.

And you are right he didn't win a Lance Todd. Just 3 dream team nominations, 7 super league titles, 3 LLS, 3 WCC, 2 challenge cups, and the only man to win 2 Harry Sunderlands.

As said, Burrow was scrum-half in 2007. In 2011 Buderus was on the field as hooker for 80 minutes. Burrow played (and had vital impact) as sort of a substitute spare half, not a hooker.

Yes I'm aware of what he won (unlike yourself). Trying to make out that somehow he's essentially doing the same role in 2015 as he was in 2007 when we had Diskin at dummy half just because I pointed out his first Harry Sunderland award was at 7 is just desperation.

If you wish. But that's exactly the point being highlighted that for the 2nd thread you cannot understand.

No, you tried to make out that he's won two Harry Sunderland awards and a Lance Todd trophy (which he never has) in this hooking role that he has now. You're just trying to knit-fog to back peddle out of that claim.

Were Alan Tait, Andrew Farrell and Kevin Sinfield not men also?

hey if you keep focussing on that detail people might forget how wrong you were on the substantive point!!!!!

He was first, i forgot our Paul Gallen like 13 won it again after him.

And the premiership final wasnt analogous to the Grand Final was it. Same name but its different isnt it.

I was tempted to leave out Tait and Farrell for the reason you gave but as double Harry Sunderland award winners I felt if I didn't someone else may have.

Still .... Kevin Sinfield.

So Burrow won neither of his Harry Sunderland trophies at hooker, hasn't won a Lance Todd trophy, and wasn't the only man to win two Harry Sunderland trophies. Other than that you're doing well.

its hard to keep track of what he's won.