You can talk about expected league positions but for me it's the performances.

It's one thing losing because the other team was just better, but too often now we're losing because we're falling way short of what we're capable of.

That is a coaching issue and, agreed there's no benefit of getting rid now, but end of the season we should consider our options.

What really gets my goat is after yesterday's sh@t show the coach coming out and laying the blame solely at the players feet, covering his own hide not a great way to get the lads on your side and also making himself cheap.

If the squad is good enough for top 4, why are you happy with what we are producing and why is that not down to the coach.
I’m sure yesterday was better on the radio but it was utterly abysmal live

When and where did he say that? If anything he seems very loyal and protective of the players. To a fault, I would say. Compare that with Watson at Huddersfield, who thinks nothing of hanging players out to dry in front of the media. Whatever you think of Smith he has resisted the temptation to single out individuals. He must have been sorely tempted yesterday.

I agree. but then a lot of the blame lay with him too

Absolutely. The buck stops with the coach. If the club gives him more time (I think they will) he's got to use this low point as a springboard for change. If he can't do that then he will be a goner.

GH needs to bite the bullet and go the extra jockstrap. We need Kear and we need him badly.

Does anyone on here really know the ins and outs of what's gone on contract wise with the current players? I certainly don't, but the body language and general can't be bothered attitude from many seems to suggest a number have been told they're out at the end of the season or their contracts, whenever they are up, won't be renewed and that they can look for another club. If that's the case, and given that the club can't just cancel contracts, isn't that what most on here have been clamouring for? Underperformers with the wrong attitude being shown the door, and that attitude being confirmed game by game? Professional sport is a complex business with many moving parts. Very rarely, if ever, is a problem solved in the long term by one action. On the flip side, a knee jerk reaction that doesn't address the actual issues can set a club back years.

I’ll be biting jockstraps if we bring in Kear

It's tempting to think that (and I have) but the senior players most on here expect to depart - Fusitua, Sezer and Tetavano - are all out injured. Maybe Austin is on the outs, but if he is he certainly hasn't stopped trying. If anything he's trying too hard. Bentley maybe a lose cannon, but I've not seen him lack effort.

Agree largely with this. Personally I'd retain Austin. If he is guilty of anything, it's trying to do it all himself. Perhaps in his mind he feels that no one else is stepping up. On the wider point of contracts not being renewed, perhaps the list contains more than the usual suspects? Over a longer time horizon that a year, granted, but with the push that they find other clubs sooner rather than later.

And maybe that is the case. My worry is that whilst other clubs seem to be aggressively getting their business done we are biding our time. I guess none of this would we really worry me if we were winning 2 out of every 3 games, but we aren't - so I look for positive news elsewhere.

I don't disagree. I'm just trying to look for reasons why we may be where we are. As I've said in other posts, shades of Wire last season. Perhaps the reasons are similar. Perhaps they aren't.

How do your know where biding our time? You’ve got no idea what’s going on behind the scenes

His post match interview and I quote " I said to the blokes in there do you want to fight or "Tap Out" what kind of protection is that to a fault? At least Powell took some bullets last year,not your Mr Wonderful Smith who needs to take a look in the mirror. I've seen some crap performances but that was straight awful.

Fair points, Batley. He arrived last year and took us from bottom to the GF with a style of football that left most of us baffled but also very pleased. There was some great rugby mixed with tremendous, character filled back to the wall performances. I remember a couple of pieces in the Aussie press suggesting that he could be the next great NRL coach.That should not be forgotten. I expected that this year, with a full pre-season behind him, we'd see a more hard nosed high intensity approach. That has not materialised and in fact he has doubled down on last year's eccentricities. 15 games in, despite a few memorable flashes in the pan, it hasn't worked. He might be stubborn (not a bad trait in leaders) but he's not stupid. He will know something has to change. He's still a very young coach and there is time yet for him to get past this and come up with a refined and successful strategy.Let's see how he rises to that challenge. I might not say this if I thought the next Graham Murray was out there waiting to pick up the telephone, but he isn't, and in all the many calls for his head over this last 24 hours I haven't seen one available or viable replacement mentioned.

Stop trying to lecture people Arthur, the simple facts are we're not good enough. You can't go for grand final to this in a few short months.

We are the laughing stock, soft touches of Super League. But let's just float along and pretend it's all just fine. What happened to this once mighty club?!

Go back and listen again. He said that about himself as much as the players. Did you go yesterday? I did. He could have mentioned a couple of completely game changing errors from Martin, a couple from Austin - I could go on because the list is very long. None of this excuses his part in yesterday's result, which is substantial. Just because I don't relish kicking a man when he's down doesn't mean he's Wonderful Mr Smith. Maybe you need to take a look in the mirror.

I do apologise if lecturing means disagreeing with your opinion. I've been watching them a long time and I remember a couple of decades when were the leagues biggest soft touch. I've learned patience. Who's your next coach, Brad?

much the same as his qualifications for being a winger , no go forward unless put in the clear and unfortunately not had same centres as cummins

how do we know Handley wants to play full back?

There you go again, just unnecessary and arrogant.

FWIW John Kear doesn't sound like a terrible acquisition to me me.

Hey up,this is my first attempt at posting on this forum
The one stand out thing this Leeds side does really well is handing the advantage back to the opposition. Do not know if there is a table for giving needless penalties away , but I reckon t'rhinos will be up there.Losing to a depleted wakey side with only 12 men ( 2nd half ) still takes some believing

welcome.
and you are correct. plus when you are passive and invite pressure it's a recipe for disaster. teams like wakey and cas you go at them, put your foot on their throat and done let go.
no us. we let them attack and gain confidence

It won't let me quote your post about Handley Tad.

Basically, Rohan has said a few times in interviews that Handley is keen to play FB and the club believes he has the attributes to develop there. The same has been said by Craig Harrison and John Bastian.

IMO he should only be at FB when needs absolute must.