Blooding those players could have also have left us 4/5 points down on where we are, and still looking at playing large parts of the rest of the season with many senior players half-fit/not-fit. We are 4 points of 3rd with two games in hand, that’s a lot better position to start introducing youngsters than being 10th and 2 points of the play-offs with 2 games in hand and many senior players playing large parts of the rest of the season with many senior players half-fit/not-fit.

You could also argue, and probably with more reason, that we have lost points because of not rotating, or blooding those players earlier.

We had 2 games in hand at Easter, and were better than 4 points off 3rd. Why not do it then?

It never happened and since they have come in they've shown their worth so i'd say it's 99% that the scenario you suggest wouldn't have happened.
Also like i posted they wouldn't have come in cold either to a decimated team which is a completely worse scenario to step into.

You could. You could argue anything you liked. Its just un-provable speculation on things that didn’t happen.

The only hypothesis we have evidence for is the one McDermott is using. So far its brought us two SL titles and half-way through this season we are 4 points off 3rd with 2 games in hand and a relatively easy run in.
As for why not do it at Easter. Why do it at Easter? What are we trying to achieve here? Success? Titles? Or to give games to youngsters? There is a balance to achieve of course. But clearly we aren’t struggling in getting home-grown players in to the squad.

Indeed. And who's to say whether some of these lads would have featured at all these season had it not been for injuries. So it's pointless to say we should have introduced them earlier if the plan was to not introduce them this season at all surely?

Keinhorst played well last week at centre, which is his usual position afaik. To suggest moving him now to second row would be a bad move IMO.Watkins is out for a few Weeks so leave Keinhorst where he is and give another under 19 forward a bench spot

Really? With a 4 point win at Wigan, a draw at Bradford, and a 6 point win at Warrington, those results could have very easily swung the other way. That’s 5 points right there. And that’s 5 points we could have lost not by the youngsters being poor, not even by them doing well, but by them being not quite as good as the senior players they are replacing.

Also the youngsters haven’t come in cold have they. They have been 18th man, being introduced from the bench, been given less responsibility whilst on the field. They have been introduced to the first team, not just dumped in.

I've no qualms about blooding 1 or 2 young lads v Bradford and NO-ONE suggested we rest 1st team regulars v Wire or Wigan.
By "Cold" i mean with no minutes under their belts in a confident team like we've done in the past.
In terms of senior players they are replacing many have shown poor form or clear signs of fatigue the policy i'm reffering to has served us for over a decade all i'm saying is stick to it and in terms of the pack at least i don't think we have.
Singleton ,Baldwinson ,Sutcliffe (when injuries 1st bit Keinhorst) and even Mcshane should have had more gametime this year than they've had imo and i stand by that.
I'll also repeat looking at our pack and FR in particular we should be rotating more and introducing the younger lads so we at least have 1 or 2 ready to step up or at the very least know where we need to recruit when the elder lads hang up their boots or in Bails;'s rumoured case leave the club.
Delaney is a machine and JJb's workrate is huge aswell but do we need to see them against Cas etc ????

McDermott didn't create the high level competitive environment - that culture was there well before he took over as head coach.

Looking back over this wonderful decade for our club do you not think that the plan was ALWAYS to introduce yioungsters into the 1st team as per EVERY season since 2003??

I've heard Moon has picked up a groin strain and won't be playing.

Sure. I just meant perhaps all these lads weren't in the plan for this year therefore the argument we should have chucked them in earlier was a little irrelevant.

I can believe Singleton and perhaps Sutcliffe were always going to get a shot this season but maybe Minns, Baldwinson and whoever else we see as a result of these injuries may have had to wait a bit longer anyway.

*shrug* I don't know, it's all just speculation as has been said anyway.

All players have at some stage 0 minutes under their belt. We haven’t seen loads of youngsters dumped in with little preparation. Arguably only Minns has, and he coped ok, and he was barely mentioned as cover on the wing by people on here. Singleton has been in and around the 1st team for a year or so and played at Wakefield, Keinhorst has been 18th man and played last year, Sutcliffe made his debut when we had a full compliment of half-backs. WE cant on one hand argue the players are being dumped in the first team then on the other hand they should have played more.

Baldwinson, Minns and Sutcliffe are 18 years old. Very very few players are getting first team rugby at that age, even fewer in the pack. McSHane is getting game time but I have yet to see a performance from him which demands the shirt for next week. He is 23 and really needs to kick on, that’s down to him though. Maybe Singleton could have got a few more games but he has been a bit hit and miss. Realistically, it’s not particularly a big issue.

I'm sure that's true. But two Grand Final wins don't lie either. He maintained and extended the legacy. His methods are unconventional, at times, but they appear to have often given this team the edge when it matters against very good, conventionally-coached teams.

Smokey-Re Mcshane do you honestly think Burrow has outplayed him all season at 9?
I'm not having a dig in anway shape or form how many games have you seen this year?
For me Mcshane has a better distribution and has had better overall form than Burrow at 9 this year and as for Singleton again imo he should have been in the 17 most weeks.
As for Baldwinson in particular again his form this year albeut at U19 level has been outstanding with EVERY staff member at the Acadamy saying he's ready to step up not just me or a few other "fans".
Whether they are 18 or not shouldn't be an issue we've put Stevie Ward in and Watkins as teenagers and i think some of these younger lads could/should ahve been in earlier.
Obviously we have differing opinions but at the same time i'm not after a p!$$ing contest either thus far i'm sticking to my opinions re-u19's and the squad.

Feeding your winger with such velocity can have that effect..........

Unconventional is one way of putting it.

BMcD has had a very unconventional rotational policy. He has also had an unconventional substitution policy.

He also has more than 50% of his first choice 17 injured.

Are the two related or just back luck?

Which of the injuries are not in all probability one-off impact-related, twists and breaks?

Or, six grand final wins don't lie. The core group of players had already won four from higher league placings before the current coaches unconventional methods arrived and the league placings slipped.

Here's hoping that the coaches unconventional methods lead to a 4th place or higher finish this year, marking the first time in his coaching career he will have coached a team to a high league placing than the previous year.

You'll be arguing the merits of winning the League Leaders Shield next...

McShane has yet to convince that he is a Leeds level player. I’ve yet to come away from a game and think McShane stood out. He looks to be a decent player, but at 23, and if he was playing for say Wakefield, we wouldn’t see people clamouring for his signing.

Singleton looks good but he is very hit and miss imo. At first grade level he has stood out a couple of times and looks a prospect. But he has also been swallowed up in games as well and looked nothing more than a prospect.

Of course age makes a difference. Baldwinson, Minns, Sutcliffe even Ward are very very young by RL standards. They could be destroyed by being pushed too far too fast. Its not just being in 80mins of first grade games that these lads need to be capable of. They need to be able to withstand first grade training and conditioning and 80mins of first grade RL. That’s a lot to ask of kids. Maybe Ward and Watkins injury troubles are down to being put in at such an early age?

Also think about what you are saying again. Baldwinson, Minns, Sutcliffe, Singleton, Keinhorst, joining Watkins, Hardaker, Ward, Clarkson, McShane. That’s 10 players under 23 who are involved in the first grade. 9 of them progressing through the academy. Young players in our academy are getting a shot.

With the exception of London at home I don't think the fixture list this year allowed us to be resting players as it was too tricky. The 2nd half of the season always looked more reasonable anyway regardless of the injury situation. So I don't agree that we should rest starters simply because they've played X amount of weeks on the trot, but rest when fixtures are the right ones which they clearly weren't earlier on which perhaps the London game being a slight missed chance (even though Singleton did play).

Ah but you'll never admit you're wrong will you, you tart ?

You should beat Widnes anyway.
Last week they lost to Wigan who had 10 players out injured.
The previous week they drew with Catalans. That was the Dragons second vist in successive weekends and they never win the 2nd when travelling to France and back here.
Both should have been home bankers for Widnes and they blew both opportunities.
Leeds by 18.

Ah, I see what you're doing there!

We win = well we did the same away last week with 10 men out too.

We lose = you're obviously not as good as the mighty Wigan. Just look at last week!