I wholeheartedly agree with the point you make about Senior being the best British centre representing a sad indictment of emerging young talent (or lack thereof).

Personally I also think it has a lot to do with the obsession that clubs are having in holding back younger players until they reach a certain age.

You will probably find a glut of talented centres come through soon, rather than a trickle which would be the case if we allowed potential stars to emerge earlier and learn the game quicker.

Only my opinion of course. But thats how it used to work, and suddenly changed over last two years or so.

Yes, I bet Joel Tomkins will think twice before running all over him next time.

I jest of course as none of the current right centre options are top defenders.

Ok, I've become addicted to stats but...

...if you compare Atkins career to date with Chev Walkers Leeds career from 2003 - 2006 you'd get this:

[uTries per game[/u
Walker 0.60
Atkins 0.52

[uAssists per game[/u
Walker 0.17
Atkins 0.10

[uCarries per game[/u
Walker 10.54
Atkins 9.49

[uMetres per game[/u
Walker 89.24
Atkins 73.86

[uMetres per carry[/u
Walker 8.47
Atkins 7.78

[uTackle busts per game[/u
Atkins 2.09
Walker 1.91

[uBreaks per game[/u
Walker 0.94
Atkins 0.53

[uOffloads per game[/u
Walker 1.18
Atkins 0.93

[uErrors per game[/u
Atkins 0.95
Walker 1.14

[uPenalties conceded per game[/u
Walker 0.34
Atkins 0.52

[uTackles per game[/u
Atkins 13.11
Walker 12.38

[uTackle completion rate[/u
Atkins 92%
Walker 90%

Atkins is marginally ahead on a few counts but Walker is ahead for the vast majority - some by some considerable way.

You must be a wow with the ladies....

TVOC himself has queried the way that OPTA award assists. I can't believe Calderwood scored all those tries outside Walker and so few were down to his centre.

Also, why your recent obsession with an avg per game stat? Not an entirely accurate barometer if one has played far more games than the other.

Surely avg per game stats produce a better basis for comparisons.

Unless I've completely misunderstood your point.

He's right. Every player has games where they are not so great. If somebody has played more games than the player you are comparing to, then it goes without saying he will have had more of those not so great games than the other.

Therefore average per games for somobody playing 50 games, can not be compared to someone playing 200 games.

I thought the same about Calderwood's tries. I guess he scored quite a few from kick chase, quick taps or general support play up the middle and Chev probably had the pace to score off a number of breaks himself.

Completely disagree with your point about average per game stats. It levels out the difference when player 'A' has played far more games than player 'B' by virtue of being an average. In this instance though the difference wasn't staggering (87 games for chev vs 81 for Atkins) but still enough that an average should be used.

What's the alternative measure if you wish to compare players performances?

Fifty or two hundred games shouldn't matter as you're taking the average output per game.

Because the avarages diminish (as Gotcha stated) when the player has a lengthier career.

They're useful stats but, like most stats, do not tell anywhere near the full picture.

Are Peacock and Senior's averages diminishing?

Neither you nor DISA understand O level maths or the basic principles of a mean average

neither you or TVOC understand how little those areas help in the assessment of a rugby players' qualities.

And how dare you insinuate I am old enough to have done O'levels.

He'd have been spot on with me though.

I did O level. I passed too.

Maybe averages weren't on the new fangled GCSE syllabus. It'll all have been computer and lasers by then.

I'm undecided to wether he would be a good signing. Has potential but to me nothing near the potential to be world class, which really is what we need.

I'll come clean (no jokes please).

I did O'levels too

But how many of those "average" stats came from Walker in the second row?

I know I ask a question, but I dont expect you to know. But it kind of shows a descrepancy when comparing to an out and out centre.

Chev Walker's Leeds career:

Played 159 + 24 + 1 (NPS), 86 Tries, 344 Points

The 159 starts breakdown as:

Right Wing - 20
Right Centre - 113
Left Centre - 12
Left Wing - 7
Second Row 7

The sample for the stats are only from the SL Reg Rds. I could filter to see how many SL Reg Rd games Walker started in the second row between 2003 and 2006......... but I'm not going to.

The stats ignore the fact that Atkins has generally played for a poor team, Walker for one of the best over that period. I'd expect a centre in the better team to get better ball more often. Ditto in defence - Atkins would probably have to do more covering and general tidying up than Walker. In addition Atkins is a marked man at Wakey - he's their best attacking threat. Not something you'd generally ever have said about Walker. The stats are interesting though.

Think you need to compare Walkers stats with a similar club (ie Hull KR) than his Leeds stats and see how they compare. I know he was a developing player at Leeds but he was at a team that was challenging for titles and cups and therefore I would expect his stats to be better.

Well put finglas. Didn't think of that.

According to this mornings League Express Atkins has agreed to go to Warrington Wolves from the 2010 season

I was told this on saturday night,looks like wire are splashing the cash again!!

they can splash all they like for me, but they still wont go anywhere. The players will have no pride or passion, they'll just be waiting their wage slips. I can't help but think Warrington are doing what Leeds tried to do in the 90's and that didnt work. look at the teams doing well in SL (i.e. Saints and Leeds). What do we both have in common, a large percentage of the team are born a bred from that team. They not only play well because they are good, but they are playing for their team, the team they love. Saints have the likes of Cunningham, Long and Graham down the spine like we have Burrow, McGuire and Sinfield. All started at the club all want to play for the club