Quote ="ThePrinter"Are you still going on Sunday JUST TO WATCH ONE SINGLE PLAYER and then struggle to figure out why Englishmen look like rabbits in headlights against them??? You're the poster boy for the English mentality ting themselves in awe at the mere presence of an Aussie Rugby player......I bet your heart flutters at the sight of Thurston's girlish hair. (BTW I don't care if he is the best player in the world, his hair in the promo pics with Burrow is fu**ing awful unless you're Miss World 1962)'" You bet I'm going tomorrow to see a genuine star quality player and one of the best players in the world of Rugby League in Thurston I'm also going to see several other star quality players in that Cowboys team, just like I did two years ago when I went to see several genuine star quality players among the Melbourne Storm team. I'm definitely not paying good money to watch Leeds or any of the Leeds players. And therein lies the quandary Super League is in --- there are next to no players of genuine star quality. And that's the problem Super League has to address. It's crap. It possesses no star quality players. You may prefer to pore over all your heart-fluttering poster pics of the likes of Sinny & Co, but they ain't star quality and they certainly ain't world class and never have been. Winning all trophies in a crap competition does not equate to greatness. I'm not the only one who is bored shiitless with the tripe on offer in Super League. See here..... www.redvee.net/forums/showthread ... keys-years

Quote ="ThePrinter"Are you still going on Sunday JUST TO WATCH ONE SINGLE PLAYER and then struggle to figure out why Englishmen look like rabbits in headlights against them??? You're the poster boy for the English mentality ting themselves in awe at the mere presence of an Aussie Rugby player......I bet your heart flutters at the sight of Thurston's girlish hair. (BTW I don't care if he is the best player in the world, his hair in the promo pics with Burrow is fu**ing awful unless you're Miss World 1962)'" You bet I'm going tomorrow to see a genuine star quality player and one of the best players in the world of Rugby League in Thurston I'm also going to see several other star quality players in that Cowboys team, just like I did two years ago when I went to see several genuine star quality players among the Melbourne Storm team. I'm definitely not paying good money to watch Leeds or any of the Leeds players. And therein lies the quandary Super League is in --- there are next to no players of genuine star quality. And that's the problem Super League has to address. It's crap. It possesses no star quality players. You may prefer to pore over all your heart-fluttering poster pics of the likes of Sinny & Co, but they ain't star quality and they certainly ain't world class and never have been. Winning all trophies in a crap competition does not equate to greatness. I'm not the only one who is bored shiitless with the tripe on offer in Super League. See here..... www.redvee.net/forums/showthread ... keys-years

just looks like a bunch of peeved fans sad to have slipped from the top of the tree to me william not much else.Cant really say i blame them, having watched champagne rugby with the likes of Long,Martyn,Sculthorpe,Cunningham and the rest ripping sides to bits for years and winning everything this set of players must be a bit of a come down for them.I guess its how Wigan fans felt when their crown slipped.

And really, i can say this from experience of wathcing it live myself, Rugby in the 80s and 90s was of no higher standard than it is these days no matter how much you yearn for those days you need to get real.

Give me ET, Lyons, Hunt, Grothe, Currie, Izzard, Schoey, Hanley, etc over the tedium of Sinny, Burrow, Peacock, Leuluai, Hardaker etc any day of the week along with August to May seasons, proper genuine Kangaroo and Kiwi tours including games against the likes of PNG.

Super League is crap and has ruined the sport.

Fair enough if thats your opinion you are entitled to it. But how on earth do you propose in this day and age we go about bringing over names of the calibre of the Aussies you mention? its impossible with disparities in cash available. Even if we were still playing september to may there is no way Aussie clubs would allow their top players to come over during our winter.Times have moved on.

Probably the best sporting analogy for rugby league in the two hemispheres is British cycling and the rest of the world.

Under Dave Brailsford, GB cycling focused on the one percents. The marginal gains that on their own don't account for much, but put together help you to be ahead of your competition. Players in the NRL do everything to a marginally higher standard, but when combined and put into pressure situations those marginal gains make for significantly better teams.

NRL players grow up being coached to do the simple things to a very high standard before they get anywhere close to being in first grade. There are young players in the Academy systems at SL clubs who have massive gaps in their skill sets. They've got where they are primarily on the basis of their physical attributes and being quicker or stronger than counterparts in their age group. Had they come up in Australia, they wouldn't have got close to a professional contract due to the things they can't do. They would have had to work harder at their game to achieve a degree of success, because the bar is set so much higher than it is here.

How do you raise that bar? Make it harder for players to earn Academy contracts for a start, by reducing the number of Academies in existence through mergers. Let's take it down to say 8/10 across the country run by the RFL, make it harder for kids to get taken on so they feel they have to work at the deficiencies in their game. Create hothouses where there is pressure and competition for places from both a playing and coaching viewpoint.

Raise the age at which players can sign professional contracts to 18, and strictly enforce it. We all know that 16 year old kids (and in some cases their parents) are getting inducements to sign for clubs and signing "pre-contracts". What message does that send to kids at that age, other than "you've made it"? Give them something to aspire to while they are in the Academies at 16 and 17 years old, rather than feeling they don't have to work hard and kick on.

Rather than talking about raising the salary cap to enable the competition to retain a handful of top stars, work from the ground up to improve the standard of player coming into the competition from the bottom. You don't build a bigger, stronger pyramid by polishing the stone at the top. How good would it be to see 18/19/20 year old players coming into the SL competition capable of executing all the basic skills of the game in the way that say Nikorima did for the Roosters last night? Players aren't born with the ability to execute skills under pressure, they acquire it by having to work hard and practice in order to get to that point otherwise they won't get to play the professional game.

have the aussies brought anyone fat like george rose

As I said earlier Leeds will get beat by a team that will do the basics more accurately and faster than Leeds can - that should not be that hard to coach into talented youngsters. Unfortunately the junior amateur game is all about winning and not about skill development. We have players in an elite competition that can't pass - Hardaker is MOS yet he struggles to pass at all never mind accurately.

great players bill , would you have gone to headingley just to watch ellery or schoey play against ? we didn't get the best of them even with 40 offside tries in a season

et , lyons , grothe , currie , izzard would poss put in my all time leeds teams that i've watched but were here for short spells

best rugby for me has been 2004 and 2005 with ali , senior , bai and the youngsters supporting

I agree re SL but the NRL is miles ahead of where it was pre-SL - watch some of the old origin matches and the difference is huge. Can't agree re winter rugby - SL haven't got the skill set to play in the dry it would be tedious in the winter. The NRL has real star players these days and competition that standard-wise is as good as it has ever been

just had text 1,000 tickets left . thought it would sell out with the clamour for elland rd prev

Agree with much of above and points by Seth and fair chunks of points by Andy. A large part of producing star players like thurston and deeper overall quality is a numbers game. Apologies in advance , if I have the below numbers wrong but recollect someone telling me recently that the number of registered 15/16 year olds playing in Aus is over ten times higher than UK. Approx 25,000 versus 2,000. As others have said our potential thurston are probably in Man city academy along with for example the sons of Kylie L and mcGillvary from giants. Mal Reilly played football until. 16/17 then played RL. these days he would never have worn an RL shirt. Sadly, I have no particular solutions

Having watched the NRL version of Sam Tomkins crumble under the high bomb last night, I hope the management at Leeds have taken note. Our kicking game has never been one of the best despite our success, and if it's as bad as it was last week, I.e non existent, we're in for a long night tomorrow. Seeing Watkins die with the ball on the 6th tackle on our first set and watching Delaney tasked with a last tackle kick was indicative of how poor our options were last week. I'd like to see more kicking from our lot tomorrow, whether it be 40/20 attempts, rockets up into the dark Yorkshire night, or testing kicks along the ground into the in goal or cross kicks for our wingers to compete for. A physical battle is one we're never gonna win, a good kicking game and clever tactics will always be our best chance of success. Fingers crossed we have a bit of luck and they don't hit top form.

The NRL's version of Tomkins? It was the first game Ferguson had ever played at fullback. In contrast NQ's fb Coote is really solid under the high ball. Not saying it shouldn't be part of our tactics, but the lessons you can learn by comparing one team to another are minimal.

Agree with that and with everything that AG said. It isn't that hard to coach the basics into youngsters. It just takes time and a wildly different setup and environment to that which currently is in place in the amateur game.
As you say the basics aren't being taught.

In my humble opinion, the amateur game is failing Rugby League in every aspect.

Quote ="Sal Paradise"Have they not won the last 6 WCC challenge games or is that an illusion - its 2012 since a SL club won a game in this format - so let's try and add some perspective and not ancient history - what happened in 2015/16 is far more relevant than what happened in 2012 would you not agree. '" No they haven't won the last 6 WCC games. They've won the last 3, which is frustrating enough although one of those was a measly 4 point win over Leeds. Quote ="Sal Paradise" You are already making you excuses - so I would suggest a case of kettle and pot here!! '" I'd suggest you look up what the phrase "pot and kettle" means before you use it again. But anyway, hoping for a win but predicting a probable defeat against the NRL champions when almost half your first team's missing isn't an excuse and if said NRL team came over with that many players out they've be accused of not taking the game seriously, by you and Wiliam "stuck in the past" Eve to name but two. If Leeds had their first choice 17 out and beat a NQL team missing 7+ first choice players you and that sad old troll would be the first ones on here belittling the win. Quote ="Sal Paradise" The last time we played the Aussies in a game that really mattered they beat us at Wembley in WC. '" I think you're getting confused, unless you're now claiming the 4N doesn't matter? www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/29798697 Like I said, finger tips... That hardly backs up your earlier post about how much better the super duper Aussies are does it... Quote ="Sal Paradise" Unlike you I see some pleasure in seeing a sportsman that is right at the very pinnacle of the game - if Lionel Messi was playing against Leeds Utd - unlikely I know - I would go and watch and I have no interest in soccer whatsoever. Great players are what sport is about, its what creates interest and drives participation - ignore their importance but I would say you are wrong to do so. Much rather admire a truly great player than get excited about one that is a pale imitation of the real deal.'" Wow. Do you realise just how much of a patronising **** that makes you sound? Of course i'm looking forward to watching JT do his thing but there's still a trophy up for grabs so i'm there to support my team first and foremost, however much the odds are stacked against them. I could care less about Football so no, I wouldn't go watch Leeds UTD even if Messi was there. Sorry if that makes me a lesser person than you. And please do tell... Who's this "pale imitation of the real deal" you're referring to? .

Quote ="Sal Paradise"Have they not won the last 6 WCC challenge games or is that an illusion - its 2012 since a SL club won a game in this format - so let's try and add some perspective and not ancient history - what happened in 2015/16 is far more relevant than what happened in 2012 would you not agree. '" No they haven't won the last 6 WCC games. They've won the last 3, which is frustrating enough although one of those was a measly 4 point win over Leeds. Quote ="Sal Paradise" You are already making you excuses - so I would suggest a case of kettle and pot here!! '" I'd suggest you look up what the phrase "pot and kettle" means before you use it again. But anyway, hoping for a win but predicting a probable defeat against the NRL champions when almost half your first team's missing isn't an excuse and if said NRL team came over with that many players out they've be accused of not taking the game seriously, by you and Wiliam "stuck in the past" Eve to name but two. If Leeds had their first choice 17 out and beat a NQL team missing 7+ first choice players you and that sad old troll would be the first ones on here belittling the win. Quote ="Sal Paradise" The last time we played the Aussies in a game that really mattered they beat us at Wembley in WC. '" I think you're getting confused, unless you're now claiming the 4N doesn't matter? www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/29798697 Like I said, finger tips... That hardly backs up your earlier post about how much better the super duper Aussies are does it... Quote ="Sal Paradise" Unlike you I see some pleasure in seeing a sportsman that is right at the very pinnacle of the game - if Lionel Messi was playing against Leeds Utd - unlikely I know - I would go and watch and I have no interest in soccer whatsoever. Great players are what sport is about, its what creates interest and drives participation - ignore their importance but I would say you are wrong to do so. Much rather admire a truly great player than get excited about one that is a pale imitation of the real deal.'" Wow. Do you realise just how much of a patronising **** that makes you sound? Of course i'm looking forward to watching JT do his thing but there's still a trophy up for grabs so i'm there to support my team first and foremost, however much the odds are stacked against them. I could care less about Football so no, I wouldn't go watch Leeds UTD even if Messi was there. Sorry if that makes me a lesser person than you. And please do tell... Who's this "pale imitation of the real deal" you're referring to? .

Sad, bitter old man in harking back to the "good old days" when "I were a lad" and "everything was better" - SHOCK.

You're a walking, talking cliche William. The game's moved on, if you don't like it then go find yourself a new hobby but please do us a favour and stfu. Go get yourself an allotment or something... I hear they're popular with the old folks.

I agree with some of what William says and disagree with other bits. But it wasn't SL that ruined the sport. It was the 15-20 years prior to it that nearly killed the sport and something that we're still recovering from.

"Rounded view" coming from somebody going to watch one or two players in what is TEAM sport. I go to watch TEAM performances not individuals. Yes afterwards we can highlight and praise the things a certain player did but it's a TEAM sport for me when I watch it.



I go to plenty thanks, maybe you go to more games than me but maybe that's because you've got so little else going on in your life that allows you the freedom to go





No it's spot on. Enough players of ALL positions have come over and failed or just looked OK at best in the past that it goes to show a lot of it is in the heads of goo goo eyed guys like yourself. Problem is you'll point to certain ones in those pivot positions to try and make a point and ignore others......was the previous Hull HB Aussie combo of Holdsworth and Miller as good as their current English HB combination just one example.



Thing is no one is saying the top Australian club sides aren't better. It's the foolish idea that anything other than Australian must be deemed sh*t.

Irony is, is that obviously the players in the amateur game aren't of the same quality as those in SL, yet you've praised William for being a big supporter of the amateur game.......hypocritical of him to say SL is unwatchable for him because the players aren't as good as the NRL players yet enjoy watching amateur players who aren't as good as SL players.

And I pretty much guarantee back in the 80's whilst you were enjoying those days they'll have been some old miserable gits b*tching and moaning about how much better RL was back in 60's......your comments say much more about you than the state of RL.

You attend so few games I would be embarrassed to call myself a RL supporter - so don't try and demean those of us who spend our hard earned on supporting the team home and away despite the opportunity cost of doing so!!

In a game there are a few bits of individual brilliance - that is what you remember about a game - what do you remember from watching the Saints semi on TV - I bet it was Sinfield's 40/20 that is why we keep going to games - small nuances of individual brilliance!!

I am sure you have watched the last two WCS games on the TV as you will the game tomorrow - one thing even you should have noticed is the best players in the key positions seldom ever get to SL - have any of the starting 1.6.7.9.13 of Brisbane, Roosters or NQ ever played in SL?

No one is suggesting the SL clubs are rubbish - but even Stevie Wonder can see - there is a significant gap in standard between the NRL and SL - about 30 points if the last two games are anything to go by - the fact you fail to acknowledge that says much about your understanding of the game.

William is a great supporter of the amateur game - it has many faults but without it you would not have the likes of Sinfield, McGuire and Peacock - just think how much better they would be if the amateur game had the resources and support its enthusiasm deserves. William recognises how hard these clubs work so he attends a host of amateur games - pity you haven't got enough about you to do likewise. Not much chance given you can be bothered to attend the games of a team you claim to support so passionately

Quote ="loiner81"No they haven't won the last 6 WCC games. They've won the last 3, which is frustrating enough although one of those was a measly 4 point win over Leeds. I'd suggest you look up what the phrase "pot and kettle" means before you use it again. But anyway, hoping for a win but predicting a probable defeat against the NRL champions when almost half your first team's missing isn't an excuse and if said NRL team came over with that many players out they've be accused of not taking the game seriously, by you and Wiliam "stuck in the past" Eve to name but two. If Leeds had their first choice 17 out and beat a NQL team missing 7+ first choice players you and that sad old troll would be the first ones on here belittling the win. I think you're getting confused, unless you're now claiming the 4N doesn't matter? www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/29798697 Like I said, finger tips... That hardly backs up your earlier post about how much better the super duper Aussies are does it... Wow. Do you realise just how much of a patronising **** that makes you sound? Of course i'm looking forward to watching JT do his thing but there's still a trophy up for grabs so i'm there to support my team first and foremost, however much the odds are stacked against them. I could care less about Football so no, I wouldn't go watch Leeds UTD even if Messi was there. Sorry if that makes me a lesser person than you. And please do tell... Who's this "pale imitation of the real deal" you're referring to? .'" Pale imitation - there isn't a genuine world class/great player in SL - all those that you call great are pale imitations of the very best the NRL has to offer - the WCS has shown the gulf - even you must be able to see that. Sam Tomkins is possible the best player in SL he struggled to retain his place in the NRL - the Warriors were fighting to keep him when he decided the comp was too tough for him. So when was the last time we beat the Aussies is a world cup or a series - 1972 so get real about how close we are when it really matters and yes I am saying the 4N doesn't have the same significance as the WC or a three match series - it mattered so much to the Aussies they decided not to bother in 2015!! Kettle and pot - you accused me of potentially making excuses if the Aussies got beat but in the same breath suggested Leeds have little chance because of injuries - I would suggest kettle and pot are very apt!! Tomorrow is a glorified friendly with a trophy a bit like the Lazenby Cup for grown ups - do you think if Leeds lose this it will mean as much as losing the CC or Gf - of course not. It has no gravitas that is why it is great to focus on other things than wether Leeds win or not - I would suggest you take a similar view point otherwise you might go in to a serious decline

Quote ="loiner81"No they haven't won the last 6 WCC games. They've won the last 3, which is frustrating enough although one of those was a measly 4 point win over Leeds. I'd suggest you look up what the phrase "pot and kettle" means before you use it again. But anyway, hoping for a win but predicting a probable defeat against the NRL champions when almost half your first team's missing isn't an excuse and if said NRL team came over with that many players out they've be accused of not taking the game seriously, by you and Wiliam "stuck in the past" Eve to name but two. If Leeds had their first choice 17 out and beat a NQL team missing 7+ first choice players you and that sad old troll would be the first ones on here belittling the win. I think you're getting confused, unless you're now claiming the 4N doesn't matter? www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-league/29798697 Like I said, finger tips... That hardly backs up your earlier post about how much better the super duper Aussies are does it... Wow. Do you realise just how much of a patronising **** that makes you sound? Of course i'm looking forward to watching JT do his thing but there's still a trophy up for grabs so i'm there to support my team first and foremost, however much the odds are stacked against them. I could care less about Football so no, I wouldn't go watch Leeds UTD even if Messi was there. Sorry if that makes me a lesser person than you. And please do tell... Who's this "pale imitation of the real deal" you're referring to? .'" Pale imitation - there isn't a genuine world class/great player in SL - all those that you call great are pale imitations of the very best the NRL has to offer - the WCS has shown the gulf - even you must be able to see that. Sam Tomkins is possible the best player in SL he struggled to retain his place in the NRL - the Warriors were fighting to keep him when he decided the comp was too tough for him. So when was the last time we beat the Aussies is a world cup or a series - 1972 so get real about how close we are when it really matters and yes I am saying the 4N doesn't have the same significance as the WC or a three match series - it mattered so much to the Aussies they decided not to bother in 2015!! Kettle and pot - you accused me of potentially making excuses if the Aussies got beat but in the same breath suggested Leeds have little chance because of injuries - I would suggest kettle and pot are very apt!! Tomorrow is a glorified friendly with a trophy a bit like the Lazenby Cup for grown ups - do you think if Leeds lose this it will mean as much as losing the CC or Gf - of course not. It has no gravitas that is why it is great to focus on other things than wether Leeds win or not - I would suggest you take a similar view point otherwise you might go in to a serious decline

I liked to know why you think you know how many games I go to both professional and amateur, you stalking me?

Ferguson has spent more of his career at FB than he has at Centre indeed he only switched to Centre when he joined the Chooks because they had Minichello then RTS playing there.

I really don't agree with all this rubbish on the amateur game, and the Aussies youngsters are better than ours. Yes, there is coaches that win at all costs rather than development, but that happens at Super League too.

We match the Aussies all the way with lads up to 16. We have quality players in this country, and a lot of those amateur coaches put a lot of hard work in to aid that development. Where we lose it big style is the development of players once signed pro with clubs, 16-19. For some reason that quality is often coached out of them, and instead they are played in unfamiliar roles and have to work to a robotic system.

Some come out of this still with their natural quality intact. We still have these players in super league, we have plenty. Plenty of Super League players could walk into NRL sides given the opportunity, but as a percentage of players in the game that isn't anywhere close to how many NRL players would walk into our sides. But Super League is a far better competition than given credit for at times. We will just always have those average players making up the numbers, and it is those average ones where we are behind the Aussies.

Said it plenty of times, over the last decade Leeds have had plenty of average players, but also quality players, and we have been lucky that those average players have managed to get a performance out to work with the quality. That doesn't always happen.

See, this post sums up pretty much everything that's wrong with the sport over here. Fans like you who belittle our game time after time are a disgrace to the sport to be honest.

This rabbit in the headlight thing that Printer mentioned is true but it goes deeper. Eddie Hemmings did everything but curtsy the other night when interviewing Wayne Bennett, it was embarrassing. Yes they're better than us - at club level - everyone knows it but the way people like you, some in the media and many of our players act it's no wonder we keep falling short and if and when we do get close or pull off a win there's always an excuse like "they weren't trying" or they had too many players missing....

To say the 4N means nothing and to compare the WCC to the Lazenby Cup is just offensive to everyone involved in the game over here and down under.

Maybe you should think about joining William down the allotment... Preferably one where there's no wi-fi signal.