It has nothing to do with him being the current PCC, that's just the job he currently holds. It has everything to do with the fact that prior to becoming PCC he was the head of Child Services at the council while all of this was going on !

I'm sure there was an element of the Council/police/social workers etc being nervous of the racial side of it but I think a bigger factor is that these children are generally from poor backgrounds and often from households lacking decent parenting or, as in the case of a girl shown by Look North, girls who have been abandoned by their parents.

To start with it means there isn't anyone there to check up on these girls or be concerned about anything. For instance, I know I'd have gone berserk had my 14 year old daughter been going out with a 24 year old who's just come out of prison. And there is no way I'd have been allowing her out on a night with this bloke.

Also, as they're from poor backgrounds, they often aren't as eloquent in expressing any concerns to social workers or when making a complaint to police. So, coupled with no parents to kick up a fuss, it's much easier for social services and the police to ignore the problem.

Then, as LGJM says, add in the chav/scummer factor along with cuts to council services and a ridiculous target culture in the public sector and to be honest it's no suprise things like this happen.

Pretty twisted perspective of events imo. Move the blame away from the perpetrators onto the victims parents. Did you read the bit about the Fathers been arrested for trying recover their children?

I have been having a quick play with the 2011 census data:

Of the 5272 people in your area who responded, 4874 described themselves as white and English / Scottish / Irish / Welsh / British. Or put slightly differently, 92.5% of people.

22 people said they were Indian or British Indian, one person described themselves as Pakistani, and no-one admitted to being from Sri Lanka. Even if you include that entire Asian block, we are still talking no more than around 50 people. As for Chinese, you have got 13 of those and 146 Poles. I can find no reference to Portuguese, but presume they fall under 'other white', which accounts for 27 people.

The south west, i.e. where you live, has the second highest % of 'white British' people as a region, behind Wales. So don't try and make out that you live in some multi-cultural utopia.



I did 2 years 3 months there. I had a good go at the lingo, got involved in all sorts of local activities, and even had a girlfriend out there. All in all, a pretty decent effort at integrating with the locals.

I now live in London where, in certain parts, it is very easy to forget that you are in the UK.

Very easy for you to come on here and bag people who worry about immigration, when it just doesn't appear to be an issue in your area.

I'm not moving the blame anywhere, it's fairly and squarely on the shoulders of the people who abused these children.

But you can't ignore other issues, such as social services and police not taking complaints and signs seriously, or, in some cases, a lack of proper parenting.

As I said, there was a girl on Look North who was 14 at the time she was abused. Her parents had previously abandoned her to foster parents and the social care system. She had a relationship with a 24 year old just out of prison. Would you allow your 14 year old daughter to go out on a night with a 24 year old just out of prison? Would you let her stay over with him?
There's no way on earth I would.

That's racist

Bad parenting will always exist in every society. Thats why the state steps in as some kind of protection. What do you think is the biggest contribution to these events? For me it was firstly the cultural attitudes to Western women within the Pakistani/Muslim community. These were acts of mass exploitation of the most wicked nature. Calculated and pre meditated by large amount of men. So inhumane that the victims must of been de-humanised in the minds of the attackers. Lets have some sense of individual responsibility for these acts. secondly it was the various parts of the State that failed to take action to protect these girls. The states failures was a direct result of political correct culture with in them. It's seems to me your just uncomfortable discussing the cultural faults of the community the perpetrators come from. Blaming the parents is just a way of diverting the blame.

It's all too easy to just point at the parents and say 'you've failed as a parent'. Nobody knows the story behind how these children ended up in care, how they ended up living with single parents or how their lives have been affected by living in an area of depravation.

The parents shouldn't even be mentioned in this whole episode. What happened to these children was wrong and the blame lies with the perpetrators in the first instance. The council and police if anyone should be the ones who shoulder some of the blame for turning a blind eye.

Listening to a report on Radio 4 today and one case of a 12 year old girl was mentioned. Apparently she was told by a detective that she "obviously consented" to sex with an older man. Given the fact that a 12 year old cannot legally consent to sex, if true, this detective should be tracked down and charged with aiding and abetting child abuse. At the very least he should be summarily dismissed from the force.

You don't simply "worry about immigration" - you're a racist, pure and simple. You've been called out on it in the past and nothing seems to have changed

Yawn. You play this card almost every time, and it is a standard response from anyone of a left-leaning persuasion when losing an argument on immigration. Try and close-down the debate by calling other people racist.

Linking your comments back to the original topic - this is part of the problem with what happened in Rotherham. No-one wanted to intervene, for fear of being called racist.

I've said the blame lies firmly on the shoulders of those who committed the abuse.
I've not "blamed" parents for this.
I've tried to point out what I think are some reasons as to why alarm bells weren't sounded with some of these girls.

I don't know why or how that could be translated into me being "uncomfortable" about the perpetrators or their community.

I sort of assumed that we were all of the opinion that the people who committed the acts are those responsible, I was attempting to discuss another aspect of the situation.

The council, social workers and the police are rightly taking flak over this issue, that doesn't mean they are "to blame" for the girls being abused.

On another note I see lawyers are involved and after £100K per 'victim'.

Based on this figure, the total payout would be around £140 million. And probably bankrupt Rotherham Council and South Yorks Police.

Good post. These girls will not be offered any real opportunity to mix with, or make a contribution to, wider British society.

And this is the problem. Multi-culture often = mono-culture. Where people are brought up with, and stick to, their own kind.

You can't go saying you can't mention parents as it's only the perpetrators to blame and then say the council and police shoulder some of the blame.

If the police and council are "to blame" in some cases for turning a blind eye then in some cases some parents are undoubtedly "to blame" too.
Or the perpetrators are solely to blame.

Personally I place the entirety of the blame on the perpetrators but we must also hold those to account in the council, in social services, in the police, in the Asian community and, in some cases, parents or family members who should be looking after and caring for their child better. Unfortunately some parents don't care that much for their kids and some can't be bothered to parent properly. I don't for one minute think they deserved this to happen or it's their fault but then neither is it the police, the council or social services fault.
It's the fault of those who committed the acts. But there are issues surrounding it that need discussing too.

Such as the responsibility the Asian community has in self policing, the social workers not picking up/not acting on alarm bells that should've been ringing, the council and central government in not funding police/social work properly and for a target culture, parents and families who don't look after their children properly and the police who find it too easy to ignore certain things when it's too difficult, they don't like certain types of people or might affect their crime stats.

Like I said, the people to blame are those who committed the acts but all the issues I mentioned are big problems in society and government which don't work as well as they should.

Not again - why do you need to resort to this? Perhaps you could address how come a number of people in WIncanton appear to have lied on the census or is that you have not posted factual information? - not for the first time.

Excellent. Both institutions appear, based on reports and allegations, to be rotten to the core.

Resort to what? Calling VR a racist?

I called him on it simply because, not for the first time, he's exhibited his racist and xenophobic views.

As for the Wincanton census information, I have no idea why it doesn't seem to reflect the ethnic mix of the town. But if you want to check for yourself, you're welcome to pop down here and get your hair cut at Eddie, the Portuguese barber. We can then go for Portuguese coffee before an Asian meal. If you're really good, I'll introduce you to the Sri Lankan couple and their children who live round the corner from me

Given that the numbers being quoted as "fact" are simply extrapolated from a small sample of case files then any legal actions would then force a complete examination of all of the known (actual) facts and a more accurate number arrived at - as has been pointed out earlier, being "vulnerable" does not necessarily equate to being gang-raped on a nightly basis nor does it constitute conclusive evidence - not that it stops the written media from assuming so.

In what way did he exhibit his racist and xenophobic views?

Perhaps the barber and others choose to do business in Wincanton but on the whole don't live in the town?

I'd like to know why these crimes aren't also regarded as race hate crimes and prosecuted accordingly .

It's obvious they deliberately targeted non Muslims for their vile deeds.

"Muslim" isn't a race, nor are they targeting a specific race for their crimes - see the previous comments regarding any asian girl who would comply to their grooming.

I exhibited my racist and xenophobic views by daring to challenge the idea that the UK is some sort of multicultural utopia, when everyone but a complete idiot can see that it isn't.

Under the doctrine of multiculturalism we have created an environment in which people are encouraged to lead separate lives, away from mainstream society. What is worse is that we have tolerated, and even encourage these communities, many of which are run completely contrary to our values. (By way of example, it is only now that we are taking issues such as female genital mutilation and forced arranged marriages seriously).

As for being accused of being a racist - this is the Sin Bin where a self-appointed left-leaning intelligentsia rule the roost and woe betide anyone who disagrees with them.

Mr Fish does have a barber from Portugal you know



Do those who promote multiculturalism think that genital mutilation is an acceptable part of a society with a multitude of cultures? Why do they consider raising the issue as a example of a racist attitude?

I agree with your last point - unfortunately this clique has ruined the board for everyone, this board is now a pale imitation of a once vibrant place where views of all angles were expressed.

What has happened to Mintball?

I'm intrigued. Who exactly are the members of this "intelligentsia"?

In what way do they "rule the roost"? I mean, they post, you post, that seems roost equality on the face of it. Are you saying they rule you? HOW exactly is their rule imposed on you? Are you banned? Obviously not. Are your posts deleted? On the face of it, not.

What woe is it then that betides anyone "who disagrees" with "them"? What woe has betiden you, now that you have disagreed with at least one (I presume) of them?

Or is it just that you claim the freedom to post whatever you want, but can't handle it when anyone posts to the contrary or challenges your posts?