www.loverugbyleague.com/stats/ma ... centurions I thought the line-ups for this game, early last season were interesting as a comparison with our likely starting 17. There wasn't a massive difference between them on paper and the game was drawn. From there, their seasons went in very different directions obviously, with Leigh ultimately promoted, but Bradford not even making the middle 8s. How do you think our likely starting team compares with these (on paper)? Right now, I'd say slightly better than Bradford, but not quite as good as Leigh. Our back line, from 1-5 looks [ua little[/u unthreatening and inexperienced, especially. Obviously Heffernan, I don't know much about apart from his highlights reel. Are there any obvious lessons we need to take on board, as we try to emulate Leigh? Bradford's experience has got to be sobering for anybody who thinks we're certain to smash this league. That's a pretty strong full-time team they started out with.

www.loverugbyleague.com/stats/ma ... centurions I thought the line-ups for this game, early last season were interesting as a comparison with our likely starting 17. There wasn't a massive difference between them on paper and the game was drawn. From there, their seasons went in very different directions obviously, with Leigh ultimately promoted, but Bradford not even making the middle 8s. How do you think our likely starting team compares with these (on paper)? Right now, I'd say slightly better than Bradford, but not quite as good as Leigh. Our back line, from 1-5 looks [ua little[/u unthreatening and inexperienced, especially. Obviously Heffernan, I don't know much about apart from his highlights reel. Are there any obvious lessons we need to take on board, as we try to emulate Leigh? Bradford's experience has got to be sobering for anybody who thinks we're certain to smash this league. That's a pretty strong full-time team they started out with.

Lesson 1: Recruit as the season reaches the business end ( ala Leigh)
Lesson 2: Pay your players on time (ala not Bradford)

That is all.

the first think that jumps out at me is the amount of experience pro's on both teams. We seem to be taking a very different approach.

Not a bad leigh team but I think I'm right in saying 8 of that team didn't play against Huddersfield in the qualifiers in the game we won promotion.

It might just be we have the best coach at the moment if we had had him earlier we might not have been in this position I know its done but we made to many mistakes in the last 3 seasons time I think to put it right

Line ups mean nothing MR. If they did, Leeds Rhinos would have won every game last year and we would have hammered Oldham in the cup.

Based on personal experience, I think that coaching, mindset, desire, skill, confidence and luck are the key variables for CONSISTENT success in any team sport.

The one thing I don't understand is why we didn't get sheens in straight after we sacked Chester if he had a clause in his contract that he could leave if a head coaches position came up

Leigh's side in that game isn't great, I reckon your side will be better than that. But they built momentum and then signed 3/4 good players to push them home.

Leigh recruited a very experienced & battle hardened squad. They could probably have fielded a full team with more SL or NRL appearances than Campese. Deep pockets needed to follow that model.

Our first attempt at trying to gain promotion started off like a house on fire. We built our team around a young and exciting, unpredictable back line that ran up the points and excited the fans. We took a few SL scalps along the way in the challenge cup. As we approached the middle 8's we started to pick up a few injuries and SL sides had worked out how to stifle our backs and dominate our pack. Both our coach and owner would, throughout the season, belittle our opposition and alienate the club with the RFL and in the media with outlandish statements.

Year two, we appeared to have learned from our mistakes at all levels within the club. By chance the previous arrogant coach had been poached by the Canadian club and we were presented with the opportunity to rebuild from roots to tips. Our owner embraced the RFL and built bridges with opposition directors and the media. Our assistant coach was promoted to head coach and he quickly built an experienced pack that would go on to dominate the league. The style of play was changed to be forward dominated, possession domination style, completing sets and pressurising the oppositions red zone. The season was treated as a "pre-season" to practice the Super League style of play. We regularly rotated the squad to ensure that any player could step in and wouldn't be Afraid of dropping an out of form star player. More than anything we built up a team that saw themselves as a SL side in waiting. They believed that they should be playing rugby at the top table and went for it. Players that decided that they couldn't take the risk of fighting for a chance of Super League rugby with Leigh were quickly replaced by superior players who were prepared to give it a go. It didn't matter that it was June/July, if you were looking to get a contract elsewhere for the following season you were dumped out of the squad and replaced by someone who was prepared to fight to get the club a Super League place. (Make sure you keep enough space on the cap to do this!).

All in all, build a Super League pack from day one, don't get involved in the Championship spoiling tactics, keep building your squad throughout the season and ensure that your fan base believes in what you are doing. The championship is an enjoyable comp, give it the respect it deserves and enjoy the ride!

and replace you next year (only kidding)

Long post, but very insightful and articulate. Many thanks.

I like the "lesson learnt from the failures of the season before" mantra. Let's hope the same lightning strikes twice.

Need to learn from your own clubs mistakes first& never sign a squad like last years if you ever get back in SL.

On paper the backs were pretty good just our half backs were injured or bother it was the pack that let us down really but if the halves had played all season we'd have probably still been in SL

We probably would be....having already signed Addy, Scruton and Clark for next years SL..., food for thought when we are been asked to pay SL money to watch pretty far from SL rugby.

I know optimism is the buzz but the club really do not seem to have learned anything at all. Its just carry on as before and hopefully nobody will notice we are playing Rochdale , Oldham and Swinton...

Unless there is a massive sea change, years of struggle await should we be even able to get back up.

And lets not mention the academy decision...Pearson certainly ran rings round us on that one...

I have to agree with that. I was extremely confident we would not even be in the MPG and that was with Campese, Kelly, Sio, Walker, Mantellato, Green, Thornley, Allgood and Larroyer. All of these Super League calibre. To say we can lose them all, replace with players from Bradford, Wakefield, Doncaster and 4th choice halves from Hull and Huddersfield and just have to turn up with a couple of new players available mid season to secure promotion is delusional. I find it strange that my confidence with last year’s far higher quality roster was mocked yet some are thinking promotion will be straightforward. Fortunately Sheens should have some pulling power but the mountain to climb is underestimated by a lot of fans.

You didn't mention Kieran Dixon.

Once we ended up in the middle 8 I said at the time there was every chance we would be relegated, poor coach, a one legged half, another who was behaving like an idiot, no game plan that used Sio as an attacking weapon etc. With this in mind, and zooks post above have we really lost that much? Best prop and both wingers are our big losses imho, gains are everyone who is here is here by choice, we have a top coach, loads of young talent, no Charlie at full back, team spirit (hopefully) now the tit is radders problem. If we start well our great fans will get behind us and who knows, no doubt it will be hard getting back but after the last 2 years I'm looking fwd to being entertained while we try. Top 2 for me with minns and whoever plays outside him scoring a shed full.

You were mocked for the worst set of predictions in living memory

seriously I understand what your saying regards players but I'd rather have a team that's wants to play for the club with a world class coach than a bunch of individuals who can't be d but look decent on paper

We hear every year that we have brought in players that only want to play for us. Usually that they are young and want to prove themselves or "know the club" like Cockayne. The harsh reality is that quality wins games and promotions. Do you think Leigh or Salford are top flight through players whose ambition had always been to play for them? Take Scruton. He's a solid pro but never stood out and dropped down a level for a reason. Yet now he'll be a success for his desire to play for Hull KR and will help run over packs of Salford or Widnes? I hope so mate. But..

No matter who is in charge you'll find it difficult to get any real quality players to commit to you half way through the season with no guarantee of top flight rugby in 2018 without throwing silly money at players plus they will only be players other teams don't want

The biggest mistake anyone at your club made last year was appointing webster but sheens should get much more out of the players at the club. Next year I think leigh will struggle as they've signed no one of any quality other than stewart plus salford look to be weaker than last season and their coach is clueless. Obviously you'll all be confident of finishing above wakey as chester is useless according to every rovers fan I know

Nobody is saying it's there dream to play for Rovers but when you drop down a league it shows who wants to play and who doesn't give a toss and your limited to who you can sign been in a lower league Campese is a lot better player than Ellis but who's going to bring more to the team that would be Ellis because Campese never plays in truth will we miss the players that have left (Sio and Walker apart ) I don't think so

Fine margins got us relegated last season. We beat ourselves in the last 2 games. Everybody should realise that by now.

Players of Super League quality making bad decisions, showing poor composure and errors at crucial times. I saw the same thing in spades today in the England team against the Aussies. Sam Burgess, Josh Hodgson and Mark Percival had shockers.

Campese passing to Ryan Brierley for an interception try. Lunt throwing an interception pass running across a stretched defensive line 20 metres out in the same game instead of an easy pass back to Campo for an easy equalising drop goal. Mantellato throwing a needless hospital pass to Cockayne 15 metres from his own line, leading to a sin binning and immediate try.

Then the MPG. Walker ruck penalty to gift field position 2 minutes from time. Horne then mugged twice at centre in 2 minutes by Josh Griffin. Result = 2 tries.

If that is Super League standard play from experienced SL quality players, none of it was very smart. Give me a team of hungry players who can use well coached game smarts to play high percentage Rugby for 80 minutes like the Aussies and win ugly if necessary week in and week out.

One step at a time please. Let's start winning regularly. Top 4 Championship first and foremost. Add quality for the Middle 8s. We have the right mix of skills and talent at the mo and a coach whose track record suggests he can elevate their collective game smarts and skill sets.

I wouldn't be surprised if Kear is in charge of Wakefield come the middle 8s and maybe Leigh backloaded contracts meaning they can't really sign anyone this season