For a bit of fun, pick your Vikings players who you would sign for our Super League squad if we were to get there in 2012. Bear in mind that it's two years away, so some youngsters may have developed, while some of the older heads may not be up to it. And please no trolling!

For me:

Paddy Flynn - Still raw but has bags of pace and knows how to finish. Could step up in time I think.

Dean Gaskell - Done it SL before and would be solid back-up.

Shane Grady - Expect him to become a regular in SL within a couple of years, if not with us, somewhere else.

Anthony Thackeray - the most dangerous 6 in the league and has experienced the top level briefly before. He will no doubt have the hunger to make it and a point to prove, while another two years with us should nurture him just enough to be our play-maker.

Steve Pickersgill - If he regains his fitness fully next year, and gets to top form, he could be a good squad player for us by 2012. Has big game experience with Warrington and it cannot be stressed highly enough how important that is.

Danny Hulme - Could be a mainstay in the Vikings side by next year. I wouldn't go with Thackeray and him at 6 and 7 immediately, but he could force his way into the long-term reckoning.

Ben Kavanagh - Has the potential to become a player who will attract the interest of some of the best sides in the country.


Maybes
Dave Allen - A quality player and his ban may be a blessing in the sense his career may go on longer now.
Anthony Mullally - Will need the chance to prove himself before being taken to SL.
Tom Wood-Hulme - See Mullally!
Dave Houghton and Dean Thompson - Wouldn't write them off and it'd be good to see how they progress. Even if they're not quite SL standard by 2012, maybe Widnes shouldn't release them and loan them out.

Add to that list...

Mark Smith.. from a purely sentimental point of view if nothing else. I'm desperate to see Smithy leading the side out in our first game at home to Wigan, Saints or Wire.

Could Varkulis cut it at SL level??
Gannon
Ford - based purely on previous reports of him being a decent SL player

Not a chance of Gaskell going back to SL.

Cull bombed him out of Warrington because of his try scoring ratio and it still hasnt improved despite the drop down in level. A great lad who will give his all but he doesnt cause enough problems in attack, unless you like him pinballing around the play the ball.

There is more chance of Matt Gardner going back as he has been very good to date and I struggle to see Dean getting a place back in on the wings at present.

Im not convinced Mullally will even make it at this level let alone SL. His development seems to be imploding at present. Likewsie Tom Wood-Hulme who cant get a first team spot despite all the injuries in the fornt row.

There will be others who step forward over the next year or so from the reserves and 18's.

Gannon will in all likelihood have gone by then. As will Webster. The day might have passed fror Doran too.

The better chance of survival seems to come from taking a fair percentage of the NL squad with you (We did it, Hudds, Hull KR stabilised off the back of it but it fell apart for Leigh).

With that you would be looking at the likes of Varks, Coyle, Gerrard to go up too.

I think Smith could do it from the bench. We should get another 9 in to start and have Smith using his pace from the bench.

Good thread. If we make it up there, there are a lot of decisions to be made regarding players. I think it's vital we take some of our youngsters along, I can see Grady becoming a fixture and Flynn as well, too early to judge the others.

Smithy needs his chance, he has shown us the loyalty, A.N. Other has it right perhaps.

Gannon will definately be too old by then. I reckon he'll hang up his boots before SL 2012.
Likewise for Webster, can't see him lasting a full season at that level.


If Smith could hack it at SL in 2012, I'd love for us to take him with us. But he wouldn't be first choice for mine. He'll be 32/33 then, so it really depends on what he feels like, and whether he performs over the next 18 months.

1. James Ford – Yes (as a Centre)
2. Dean Gaskell - No
3. Richard Varkulis - possible
4. Toa Kohe Love - No (too old)
5. Paddy Flynn – Yes
6. Anthony Thackeray Yes (if only his kicking game was better he’d be a top SO)
7. James Webster No (too old)
8. Steve Pickersgill – Yes (Injuries permitting)
9. Mark Smith – Yes (with another good quality hooker)
10. Jim Gannon – No (Unfortunately will probably miss out due to age)
11. Lee Doran Possibly (as a squad player)
12. Dave Allen – Yes (He’s done well since his return. He’ll get even better imo)
13. Chris Gerrard – Don’t know (I’m not too sure where he even fits in now never mind SL)
14. Thomas Coyle – Yes (a handy squad player)
15. Shayne Grady - Yes
16. Gareth Haggerty - Yes (Injuries permitting)
17. Ben Kavanagh – Yes (Has a good step for a big lad. This is dangerous close to the line. A bit like Sam Burgess)
18. Scott Yates – No (I don’t think he’ll make it as a FB and there doesn’t seem to be any other option for him, unfortunately)
19. Matt Gardner No (has improved but I just can’t see it tbh)
21. Matt Strong – Possibly (He’s done no wrong but could do with getting bigger and more game time)
22. Dean Thompson – Yes (has shown real promise very quickly)
23. Dave Houghton – Yes (Getting better with every game)
24. Danny Hulme – Possibly (far too early to say, but the signs are good) 80)
25. Anthony Mullally – Don’t know

That leaves us my definates:
1. New Signing
2. New signing
3. James Ford
4. Shayne Grady
5. Paddy Flynn
6. Anthony Thackeray
7. New Signing (we need to make this the star signing and must be a good tactical kicker)
8. New signing
9. Mark Smith
10 Gareth Haggerty
11 Dave Allen
12 Ben Kavanagh
13 New sighing

Squad:
New signing - top quality hooker to spell, or be spelled by Smith.
New signing - another experienced prop
Thomas Coyle
Steve Pickersgill
Dean Thompson
Dave Houghton
Danny Hulme


That’s a minimum of 6 new signings but, we may actually need 8 or 9. Coming from a £300,000 squad to a £1.6 million squad, we may need more than 6 to compete, and PC may have to be a bit more ruthless than me. Obviously some of the possibles could be kept to fill out the squad.

I would keep

James Ford
Paddy Flynn
Matt Gardner
Shayne Grady
Dean Thompson
Anthony Thackeray
Danny Hulme
Steve Pickersgill
Ben Kavanagh
Dave Allen
Dave Houghton
Anthony Mullally
Gareth Haggerty
Thomas Coyle


The rest will be released or retired IMO, SL is such a huge step up.


I make out that we would need 12 coming in, out of the above only a few would get in a regular SL starting 13 imo.


1. New Signing
2. Paddy Flynn
3. New Signing
4. New Signing
5. James Ford
6. Anthony Thackeray
7. New Signing
8. Steve Pickersgill
9. New Signing
10. Gareth Haggerty
11. New Signing
12. New Signing
13. Dave Allen

14. New Signing
15. New Signing
16. New Signing
17. Ben Kavanagh

Quote VM
"I make out that we would need 12 coming in, out of the above only a few would get in a regular SL starting 13 imo.


1. New Signing
2. Paddy Flynn
3. New Signing
4. New Signing
5. James Ford
6. Anthony Thackeray
7. New Signing
8. Steve Pickersgill
9. New Signing
10. Gareth Haggerty
11. New Signing
12. New Signing
13. Dave Allen

14. New Signing
15. New Signing
16. New Signing
17. Ben Kavanagh"

As an outsider I would have to agree with VM's view of the squad. Grady has looked one of your best players from what I have seen of you this year and I reckon if he continues to progress he would be a capable SL player, Flynn too. Allen is class imo and should be playing SL now (no disrespect to Widnes).

Another question is, from the 14 players mentioned above, who would be willing to go full time?

Out of the players you'd keep quite a few are young and IF we do get into SL it will be another 2 years in their development so by then they might be ready, I was thinking of Thompson,Houghton and Hulme specifically.

Haggerty wouldn't be a starting prop IMO he's best at coming off the bench.

I think we need to go down the Aus route for a SH and prop.

For me, no one in the Widnes side could hack it in SL.

For Leigh, Only Chris Hill has an outside chance. The rest of our squad have no chance.

The gap is far too big in my opinion, but the 3 year gap of non promotion will have an obvious affect.

No doubting that Widnes have potential SL players, but to make the step up after 3 seasons in our division will do them no good.

Just my opinion of course, but you can probably count on one hand the amount of players who could make the step up in Champ and C1.

I think everyone seems to be in agreement. The young ones haven't done a lot wrong and if they improve further in the next 18 months then no reason why most of them shouldn't be given an opportunity. The only player I think I would disagree with is Matt Gardner, he doesn't take a lot of credit, but I think he's done really well for us and maybe worth a shot - if we get there. Jim Gannon is another I give a go to - if he wants to carry on that is. He seems to keep himself in really good nick and as things stand, doesn't look like he's on the way down as yet.

The only younger players that would be at risk would be Scott Yates and Mathew Strong -they are not [ithat[/i young anymore and haven't yet established themselves as top Championship players, never mind SL players. I think both Yates and Strong would be 24 by then, but 18 months is a long time and if I was either of them, I'd still believe there is enough time to show what I could do.

To say noone could hack it is a bit harsh. Unless by hack it you mean stand out or be a star. If you look at the Cas and Hull KR teams they still have players who played in their promotion years, so it would be prudent to think some would still be able to make the step up.

I agree with most of what you say but i think Matt Gardner deserves a chance.He has played well for us this year.Some of our yougsters could be even better in 2yrs time.Ste Tyrer and joel tomkins where not outstanding for us in the championship and are doing good in superleague now.Richard Myler was good and did not think he become a top notch player.So shows if got better players around you, and fulltime it would make a difference.

Thackeray and maybe Haggis...

I'd hope we'd do a similar thing to Hull KR and faze out almost all of our NL player over 2-3 years max..

I'd also HATE to see us take any player to SL based on sentimental reasons.. If a player is not good enough - and lets face it if they haven't secured a move to a SL club in the 5years we've been in the lower league that is a fair indication they aren't upto SL standard

Nes

OOPS i meant joel tomkins the secondrower.Not the scrumhalf.

I always thought Gardner was most confident under the high balls out of Flynn,Ford and any other players who have played winger/full back over this season's games.

At Leigh Hill, Bibey, Lulu, Nash and the 4 DC lads. Would also take Higson, Meekin and Ridyard as possibles.

SuperLeague????

Ford - as a centre
Flynn - wing
Thackeray - halfback
Pickersgill - bench frontrow
Smith - bench 9
Allen - squad player
Grady - squad player
Hulme - squad player

Doesn't make good reading does it?

Gaskell - nowhere near good enough
Varkulis - nowhere near good enough
Kohe Love - too old
Webster -not good enough, too old, too slow, too predictable
Gannon - too old
Doran - nowhere near good enough
Gerrard - nowhere near good enough
Coyle - not good enough, overweight and not suited to top level
Haggerty - nowhere near good enough, lazy
Kavanagh - not good enough, lazy
Yates - nowhere near good enough
Gardner - nowhere near good enough
Strong - nowhere near good enough
Thompson - not gonna be good enough
Houghton - not gonna be good enough, no athleticism
Mullally - no idea whats happened to him

Did I say not good reading? I mean bl00dy frightening!

You have a squad needed to compete in The Championship. You'll have a new squad when you get into Super League. Why waste a SL squad in The Championship when you don't need to? Simples

I do worry that if we are granted a licence, then year 1 could be very damaging in the short term so much so that it could be hard to recover from. A major player turnover and the chance of a new squad taking time to gel. This could seriously affect the younger players at the club in terms of confidence.

I think there'd be a need to recruit a new coach. That might surprise people I know.

But i'm talking about keeping Cullen and the current backroom team but adding a new face that is known for bringing people together. Somebody in the mold of Frank Endacott (I know what you're all gonna say).

What I mean, is a person who has good interpersonal skills that can get the lads bonding. I dont get the impressionthat Cullen is that sort of bloke. He seems very stern and set in his ways and not somebody who is easily approachable. I may be wrong, but thats the persona he has.

To me the franchise winner takes the bulk of the losers squad and imports better. It is then hoped that the winner can produce their own after a couple of years

Have you been watching rugby leaugue for long? If not then you must be a visionary. Give SOC a call - he'll be wondering why he gave PC the job before speaking to you

.

Yes I see that. The quality is definately a worry. I really hope we can produce some talented kids. Some great young players coming through at the moment. I suppose the true test of our development of players will be seen in a few years.