Not wanting to prompt responses like the dire "Has Denis Betts improved the Squad thread" on the TIW Board. I see this as quite a logical thing for the Club to do. Denis has that 3 year assurance as to his future and he can continue with his long term vision, which has paid dividends and is really the only way a Club like Widnes can move forward in a planned way.

We just dont get the bums on seats to generate sufficient revenue for several big signings each season and whilst I am sure more could be done to market the Club, it is a shame that there hasn't been a more positive response from the people of Halton and beyond.

We tried speculating with the Gareth Hock signing, which hardly registered at the turnstiles, so evolution will have to be the name of the game.

My guess is the financing of the Club is all about fine margins and 2014 budgets will probably have been set based on a small anticipated increase in crowds, which of course we didn't get, then we got hit by the crowd trouble, which can't have been great for attracting fresh sponsors. then the fine itself will have hit hard. The Club presumably is set up to make a modest trading loss that is made good by the directors, when the gap ends up as being tens of thousands of pounds more than anticipated, that has got to be found!

Whilst it would be great to have several top drawer signings each year, I am content with to see a few quality additions arrive and to see young players and established players kick on with their development, rather than going bust by overextending ourselves.

In a way we have gone back to basics like the Widnes teams of old with home grown and developed players. We are fortunate that we have managed to bring in quite a few quality players from elsewhere to help make up for the time it takes to get our "home trained" production line up to speed and we have got to be realistic that not every home developed player is going to make it, so we have got to maintain a mixture.

Denis has shown a level of devotion and commitment to this approach and whilst he may have a few tactical deficiencies, I doubt there is anybody better at getting the best out of the squad and creating a strong team ethic!

The best marketing in sport is done on the pitch.

We had an excellent opportunity to market our club in the challenge cup semi final and we blew it big time both on and off the field. We've done well since then getting club of the year, but we need a quality product on the field to be getting 8,9K gates regularly.

Not gonna happen AJ,the town is just too small.I know Warrington managed to add 4 thousand to their gates but they have a much larger population to go at than we do and with the best will in the world there is little to no interest in the surrounding areas.The best we can do is to attract the 500 or 600 stay aways who are interested in the team and the game but no longer attend but even that is proving difficult.That and enticing more supporters of the opposition team.
Regarding the contract extension it would be nice to see Denis getting the best from more of his players like he did with Leuluai and Flynn.Players such as Kav,Johnson and Craven.A decent kicking game wouldn't go amiss either.

Whilst I'd like to think I'm realistic, it's quite sad and pessimistic to assume that even with a successful team we can't increase the attendance. Warrington have a much better team now than they did in their latter years at Wilderspool, hence higher attendance. A team that regularly competes and wins will get fans back. Marketing campaigns will only get short term gains unless the team can keep the fans there.

Does anyone have our average attendances in the late 80's? I know it's a different game but our last significant successful period in the top division would surely have increased the gate?

Cas enjoyed this last year, Bradford are a perfect example of their attendances when Noble was there and their attendances last year. I feel we're on the right road, but until we can compete in the top 5 and have good cup runs we may struggle to attract new fans long term.

Quote ="AJ Viking"Does anyone have our average attendances in the late 80's? I know it's a different game but our last significant successful period in the top division would surely have increased the gate?'" Some on here www.redvee.net/viewpage.php?page_id=216 Between 1988 and relegation in 95 we dropped from around 8.5k to 4k How many of these fans were added by Jiffy's arrival from Union compared with earlier years is worth considering but I've no idea of figures before this. He was a major signing. Remember my Mum telling me it was on the TV news one morning before school. Apparently it was the quickest she'd seen me get out of bed since birth. The target for super League under franchising was 10,000 average. I can't honestly think we can get anywhere close to that in the near future, maybe back to 8,000 or so when winning trophies. For most of us 7000 or so would be sustainable but for how long. Let's face it, SL do not want us, Cas, Wakey and possibly KR around long term. We are only in SL because some expansion attempts have failed and we had good money invested to replace them. We're propping up the SL until they can get rid. One way to avoid this is winning trophies regularly but how can we compete with the income generated by Wigan, Leeds, Saints, Wire, Hull and Cats? Would love not to be pessimistic but I do not believe small town RL clubs are on SL's agenda long term. Gateshead, Toulouse, London and Wales are all waiting to replace us and if you add in Scotland, Ireland, the Midlands and the South West as targets then we fall way down the desirability stakes. I think ideally they'd like only 3 NW clubs and change to represent the catchment areas of Merseyside, Central Lancashire and Manchester and they'd expect us to head east or west for a team to follow like we tend to do in soccer. So I'll see you in ten years time when we all become Dublin Dodgers' away contingent. All together now.... C'mon you Greens!

Quote ="AJ Viking"Does anyone have our average attendances in the late 80's? I know it's a different game but our last significant successful period in the top division would surely have increased the gate?'" Some on here www.redvee.net/viewpage.php?page_id=216 Between 1988 and relegation in 95 we dropped from around 8.5k to 4k How many of these fans were added by Jiffy's arrival from Union compared with earlier years is worth considering but I've no idea of figures before this. He was a major signing. Remember my Mum telling me it was on the TV news one morning before school. Apparently it was the quickest she'd seen me get out of bed since birth. The target for super League under franchising was 10,000 average. I can't honestly think we can get anywhere close to that in the near future, maybe back to 8,000 or so when winning trophies. For most of us 7000 or so would be sustainable but for how long. Let's face it, SL do not want us, Cas, Wakey and possibly KR around long term. We are only in SL because some expansion attempts have failed and we had good money invested to replace them. We're propping up the SL until they can get rid. One way to avoid this is winning trophies regularly but how can we compete with the income generated by Wigan, Leeds, Saints, Wire, Hull and Cats? Would love not to be pessimistic but I do not believe small town RL clubs are on SL's agenda long term. Gateshead, Toulouse, London and Wales are all waiting to replace us and if you add in Scotland, Ireland, the Midlands and the South West as targets then we fall way down the desirability stakes. I think ideally they'd like only 3 NW clubs and change to represent the catchment areas of Merseyside, Central Lancashire and Manchester and they'd expect us to head east or west for a team to follow like we tend to do in soccer. So I'll see you in ten years time when we all become Dublin Dodgers' away contingent. All together now.... C'mon you Greens!

I congratulate Betts on a well deserved contract extension. I also agree fully with the comments and sentiments of Wirral Viking and Dug Out. I fear a lot of Widnes fans are going to be disappointed if they are expecting us to improve on last years successes. Yes we have strengthened but other sides have done so even more. Only Wakefield and possibly Castleford are weaker or no stronger. London and Bradford have gone. What Betts has done with the money available to him has been very good. He is working on a shoestring budget. Even in our glory days we only attained 7,500 average gates. To get that would be good but other than the fans that are watching no one else appears interested or cannot afford to watch, understandably watching sport on TV instead which is cheaper if you find yourself in that situation. Economic times are tough for most people in our area. I expect to be in SL again in 2016 after another exciting season. Let us just enjoy being in the competition. Come on you Vikings!