AND HE CANT GET A START BECAUSE????
he is classed as a squad cheaper filler upper!!! not a starter

The backs this season would be sufficient if they included Raynor. The season so far has shown that without him we have to play people out of position - exacerbated more as soon as Calders was out. We would be coping much better with Calder's absence if we could rely on Raynor being on the other wing.

But I think that with Raynor gone (and I know you've explained the timings of the circumstances that led to this) with a month to the start of the season the other options in terms of experience and stability looked flimsy. And has proved so.

I think we would have looked less exposed at Wigan, could have won at Salford and would definitely have won at Crusaders if Raynor was playing. We'd still have lost on Monday though



Maybe Hull could not have helped the way things panned out with Raynor in the end, but I still think they should have grasped the bull by the horns earlier knowing the seriousness of the charges against him.

We have a few set plays that we seem to run over and over again, I think a lot of the blame is that we're slow and predictable with very poor execution of these plays, after all I've seen other teams run the very same plays and they've been carried out with aplomb.

See the hall try from the scrum against (admittedly poor) quins for a good example

Who are you going to pick on next week seeing as we're now onto the loose forward position?

You've burnt more players than Humphrey Bogart.

I said all along that however good a player Long is he was never going to be the magical solution to the huge problem we have had over the past few seasons with getting our outside backs on the ball, we needed a 7 to improve our kicking game and direct us around the field, but just as important was signing a player with real ball handling ability, in whatever position it could be incorperated, this didnt happen in my opinion, and still having Raynor or a replacement of suitable quality would have not made a difference.

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I think he has to take a large proportion of the blame to a degree, not necessarily for the poor execution, but for the personnel he has involved in these plays: The early passes are crucial to getting an edge time and space wise and this is where we fail miserably.

Sick of seeing prop forwards stood at 1st receiver in the oppos 20 metre area

Yup! We have a prop passing to a prop who then takes time to get upright and play the ball, moved from acting half slowly to another prop, onto a half back who then gets murdered or commits the offence himself.

You've seen agars plan A ?

Raynor being gone has meant playing Briscoe on the wing. Where, as I may have mentioned before, he played well enough last season to get picked for England.

That's it. The only change. No others. At best having Raynor would have meant being able to use Briscoe instead of Hall when Calders has been injured. I really do think this is being hugely overplayed in terms of seriousness and impact on our performances.

As far as replacing Raynor is concerned, where was the money coming from for a replacement? We spent our cash on the pack this season. The whole point with the way Raynor was handled was to try and minimise the financial impact of having to pay him off since that money counts on the cap.

Didnt you score a try last friday off a play with a prop at first receiver?

While Briscoe is a good choice as winger in attack he's sadly been found lacking defensively there. And that's where the weakness is. 'Cos other than Whiting (who should be deployed better elsewhere - he's too talented to be wasted on the wing) all our patch-up "wingers" are weak in defence.

And that's where Raynor would have made the difference. His and Calderwood's experience and strength protecting the wing is the shortfall - not the attack.

Its been one of our better weapons for a number of seasons now.

But you all know deep down he aint going any further - He has played off half and Loose Forward for us - compare him to young Myler on Sunday and our own Jordan Turner at Loose Forward (Future) He has less pace than Richard Whiting and he gets slated on here but he at least offers the utility option and has in my opinion been our most consistant player this season. I hate to say it but am disappointed with Washbrook to say the least cos I thought he would make it. Hope he proves me wrong.

Not sure what all this debate is about. When we have had Long and Horne playing they have looked good together and we look a real threat. Okay Long has picked up a few knocks but those knocks could happen to anyone.

As for the wingers, we have two very good ones plus some useful cover and two young lads knocking on the door too.

I don't see a problem with this years squad, we had 7 out on Monday yet still put out a strong side that nearly beat an in form Wire side.

Only took 9 games

Imo Right now he's nothing more than 'solid': Sure enough he has a fair turn of pace, reasonable strength and size but for me he doesn't use it to full effect (as yet)
Don't get me wrong, I think he's a more than able replacement, he's just not the superstar that some people are touting him to be.
And how can you say he's a top loose forward when we haven't seen him play there yet?

Long and horne have only played together in 3 games haven't they? looked good at saints, both did little in the 2nd half against hudds due to injury and horne was very quiet in the derby

They do have a 100% record though





Judging by both their injury problems we'll see little of them together

They do look good together, we do need them to stay fit but the same goes with any halfback pairing.

People talk about a lack of cover at halfback, Leeds are the champions and what cover do they have? If they lose McGuire or Burrow there is no replacement to come in. We at least have some cover.

I wasn't sure there was a plan at all

sinfield?

To be fair, both mcguire and burrow have very good injury records

hulls lucky to have him, id have him back at saints anyday, shame about his injury :/ but anyone can get injured playing this game, i think hull look a better side with him in the squad!

So if they lose their halves all they have to fall back on is Sinfield. Which then leaves them short of a 13.

The point is sides very rarely have cover for their halves, we do have some cover so we are in a decent position.