One which your club, unfairly might I add, well and truly shares.

As I said earlier the reason they boo at every ground is that no one knows from one week to the next what interpretation the ref you get will be putting on the rules. there is no definitive consistant standard for holding down, simple as! We would never have won on Friday if you let us have 17 players on the field at the same time you were better than us.

But all this don't critise the ref stuff is rubbish, you have to, one of your tries came straight from a quick tap on the twenty that was at least 15 yards to the right of centre. I thought that was against the rules but obviously Mr Alibert felt he should not stop the flow of the game! that blatent disreguard for the rules frustrates the fans and no doubt the management. For me the action of all those coaches you list is down to one thing total frustration with the quality and consistancy of refereeing, it is ruining our game as a spectacle!

Just my probably outdated views of course but some that I think a few more fans who are getting fed up with standards in refereeing would agree with.

Agreed, I was using it as an analogy not as a dig.

The refs are dire at times, everyone knows that but coaches need to get together and go through the correct channels to deal with it. Consistency of refereeing is a separate issue than this for me if Agar can't see the difference between what Wigan were doing and what your players were doing then he shouldn't be a coach. Fans of every club in the country cite certain refs they feel has it in for them, on our board when the ref for the next game is announced you can guarantee the next post will be complaining, whoever it is. It achieves absolutely nothing moaning about it either as a fan or a coach but the coaches job is to make sure his team do everything they can to avoid being at the wrong side of the penalty count, your discipline in the first half at Wigan was atrocious and this needs addressing by Agar as a priority as seemingly Friday wasn't the first time you've failed to control the ruck.

Coaches have been trying that for years. Nothing happens. How long do you suggest we put up with it?


Except on here.

You won't find anyone claiming that any refs have it in for Hull. It's competence that's the issue, not bias. Halibut is just plain incompetent and should not be an SL official. Simplez.

With all due respect, the ref only has one pair of eye's. if they donlt watch the defensive line for off side they are slagged. now, if they don't watch the tackle / play the ball, they are slagged.

Refs, in my opinion, are only poor if they miss something obvious, like the ball carrier knocking on. Even then their view could be obscured.

I think in many sports, because money talks and no one acsepts the blame, the easy way out is to blame the ref.

I personally lilke the comment "You have given us nothing...blah blah blah". The ref is not there to give anything to anyone. If anything they are there to penalise infringments.

As has coaches moaning in public about refs, does that work? Until there are more refs there's nothing to be done other than 'put up with it' and having coaches slagging them off in public is hardly the way to encourage people to become referees.

So Hull have no fans who think refs have it in for them? I've lived here for long enough to know that's not the case.

I know we're never going to agree on the subject but some of your fans have got the right idea. If you don't start playing to the refs its going to be a very long and difficult season, when the ref makes the call you can't pick a player up and try to turn him over. That's what Hull were doing and why they were penalised for it (in addition to numerous grapple tackles). I'll have the DVD by the weekend if you want a copy.

And with equal respect, a few of them need to learn how to use them.

I don't expect infallibility. Refs are human, it's a fast moving game, and things will be missed. Maybe utilising the TJs more would help there. Who knows.

I [ido[/i expect a [iprofessional[/i referee to know the rules and apply them consistently to both sides for the entire 80 minutes. All too often that simply isn't the case.

I don't think Alibert "had it in" for FC, but he was unduly influenced by the home crowd baying for a penalty at every single PTB IMO. Wigan were guilty of holding down too but FC were penalised disproportionately. I'm disappointed that the refs in general are allowing as much laying on as they are.

Frustration will eventually make people try anything. Livelihoods are on the line here.

My absolute preference is for there to be a functional mechanism for coaches to raise concerns and get some redress without having to open their mouths in public. Sadly that isn't where we are, and no amount of wishing it were otherwise is going to change anything.


I said [ion here[/i. You're welcome to check out the weekly Ref thread, but I honestly can't recall the last time we had a debate about a ref being biased.


No need - I made the point myself on another thread about our inability to play to the ref. I know we're crap at it and have been for years. Of course, whether anyone should [ihave[/i to adapt their game depending on who the ref is and what mood he's in is another thing altogether...

I'm sad to say it but your fans made miles more noise in every department than ours.

Are coaches allowed to write to the RFL to voice their concerns? Intresting one. There must be some form of complaints and comments procedure.

Agreed.

Also agree with most of Kosh's previous post but In saying 'playing to the ref' I meant it is getting up when the ref says so rather than either not getting up or pushing the player down when you get up, its a fine balance between what's acceptable and what's not and unfortunately Hull are getting it wrong more often than not in my opinion.

Apologies on the bias bit Kosh, I missed the bit where you said on here.

I've been moaning about refs since the seventies, and writing to various Rugby mags about it since the eighties. I have come to the conclusion that because we tinker with various rules to make the game a better spectacle we end up getting inconsistency due to intreperating the rules; and its the inconsistency that the average fan gets peed off with. I know all fans rant, usually when their beloved team gets beat, but when everyone has calmed down and talks about rugby league over a pint they all usually moan about inconsistency in refereeing. Take the Saturday televised match where on two ocassions a Bradford player was tackled in the air and they didn't get a penalty. The week before against Wigan, the Bulls and the Warriors both had tries given from what looked more of a forward pass than the one Tickle gave Craig Hall against Harlequins but was disallowed.

I think the refs job is a difficult one and maybe we need an incentive to bring more into the game? Someone said the pool is too small, I would agree with that point. Players have periods where form deserts them and they get dropped. refs are human (I think

) and also suffer likewise - they don't get dropped because there's no one of a sufficient standard to replace them, although I thought Childs had a good game on Friday and I've never really noticed him before.

Maybe agar has some balls after all. Fair play to him. He should have done it publicly like justine did then we may have been kept away from alibert for a few months

Both teams and the Match Commissioner must complete an assessment report. There is also the facility to make written representation to the RFL if a referee's individual performance was of concern.

TBH I would have thought that if enough coaches felt it was such a problem, they would already have requested a meeting with Stuart Cummings and his referees to press their points. The fact that no meeting appears to have taken place speaks volumes.

Is impersonating a SL Coach a serious offence?

No worries.

Not until Friday night we weren't. Odd that the same ref gave us far more leway when we played Hudds at home.

Nail hammer head etc.

Changed slightly. MC will make a report if a coach makes a comment or remark about the official either to the official, the MC or in the press conference (which the MC attends). Coaches are reminded that if they have issues, they can raise them formally with the Match officials controller - but in the heat of the moment, many coaches do vent their spleens to the media.

So in short we need to simplify the rule book, increase the number of refs in the pool and also improve their ability to interpret the new simplified rule book. There you go Cummings! Now get on with it.

The Laws of the Game is already a fairly concise document, especially in comarison to soccer, cricket and union.

What I think is required is publication of the regular notes and interpretation guidelines that are issued to officials. It's seems farcical that they appear to be such a closely guarded secret.

Problem is that no one will ever have looked into the legality of that situation in close detail because apart from us all whining about refs we sort of take it as given it will be that way !! but i am sure that there will be lurking some loophole that makes it open info for all to read ..
maybe not

Fair point. I'd hope they're shared with clubs as a minumum even if not fans?