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| Quote ="east hull FC fan"My god, Tony made 1 error today that didn't cost us any points, thackray knocks on, they score from the following set which at the time of the game really deflated us! No thread about thacks though.
Which just goes to prove that people on here will take any slight opportunity to start a witch hunt against someone who has been quality for us over the years but still can't get over a decision made by a coach 2 years ago!'"
This is nothing to do with a witch hunt. It's all to do with a coach continuing to play someone who clearly has not got the aptitude to be a first choice full back. You always know you're going to get the effort from Motu but a full back he is not. It gets heated when the last person in the defensive line coughs up possession as often from the high kicks. Remember, it was only down to a sypmathy call in the Salford game that we managed to hold on for a win. The previous game at the KC, another high ball missed and a try. The point is, this is bread and butter stuff. If a ten year old was making as much of a mess, he would be moved. The Jamie Thackray comment holds no water either. The difference between a genuine mistake/error and talent are two different things.
Horne R has made a much better job of the full back role. And regardless of who he has playing at seven with him, he's underperformed. We're a team of one trick ponies, the opposition have worked us out !! The ball turned back inside at the ruck, the Horne step. It'll be much better when Cooke is back on his four year deal, at least we'll have options.
And yes I am damn upset by Sharpe's decision to ditch Briscoe, just look at what it's costing us.
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| Quote ="Largeparts"This is nothing to do with a witch hunt. It's all to do with a coach continuing to play someone who clearly has not got the aptitude to be a first choice full back. You always know you're going to get the effort from Motu but a full back he is not. It gets heated when the last person in the defensive line coughs up possession as often from the high kicks. Remember, it was only down to a sypmathy call in the Salford game that we managed to hold on for a win. The previous game at the KC, another high ball missed and a try. The point is, this is bread and butter stuff. If a ten year old was making as much of a mess, he would be moved. The Jamie Thackray comment holds no water either. The difference between a genuine mistake/error and talent are two different things.
Horne R has made a much better job of the full back role. And regardless of who he has playing at seven with him, he's underperformed. We're a team of one trick ponies, the opposition have worked us out !! The ball turned back inside at the ruck, the Horne step. It'll be much better when Cooke is back on his four year deal, at least we'll have options.
And yes I am damn upset by Sharpe's decision to ditch Briscoe, just look at what it's costing us.'"
Totally agree... Cookie back for 4 years
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| Quote ="Largeparts" The Jamie Thackray comment holds no water either. The difference between a genuine mistake/error and talent are two different things'" So taking the ball up and carrying it correctly as to make sure the collision does not dislodge the ball isn't a talent? IMO catching a ball from 20/30 foot in the air is a lot more difficult. Both were a genuine mistake, thacks cost us points, end of!
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| Quote ="east hull FC fan"So taking the ball up and carrying it correctly as to make sure the collision does not dislodge the ball isn't a talent? IMO catching a ball from 20/30 foot in the air is a lot more difficult. Both were a genuine mistake, thacks cost us points, end of!'"
yep
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| Quote ="Superbowl Scott"He may have made a few errors since hes come back but he is one of if not the best attacking option we have.
We would be stupid to let him go imo.'"
any fullback who lets the ball bounce and have no postional sense isnt a fullback imo.
and before u start i aint a briscoe lover I just think tony is a poor fullback
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| Quote ="Largeparts"This is nothing to do with a witch hunt. It's all to do with a coach continuing to play someone who clearly has not got the aptitude to be a first choice full back. You always know you're going to get the effort from Motu but a full back he is not. It gets heated when the last person in the defensive line coughs up possession as often from the high kicks. Remember, it was only down to a sypmathy call in the Salford game that we managed to hold on for a win. The previous game at the KC, another high ball missed and a try. The point is, this is bread and butter stuff. If a ten year old was making as much of a mess, he would be moved. The Jamie Thackray comment holds no water either. The difference between a genuine mistake/error and talent are two different things.
Horne R has made a much better job of the full back role. And regardless of who he has playing at seven with him, he's underperformed. We're a team of one trick ponies, the opposition have worked us out !! The ball turned back inside at the ruck, the Horne step. It'll be much better when Cooke is back on his four year deal, at least we'll have options.
And yes I am damn upset by Sharpe's decision to ditch Briscoe, just look at what it's costing us.'"
Excellent summary, although Thacks made 3 big errors today and was a liability. Tony isn't a FB.
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| Quote ="Largeparts"This is nothing to do with a witch hunt. It's all to do with a coach continuing to play someone who clearly has not got the aptitude to be a first choice full back. You always know you're going to get the effort from Motu but a full back he is not. It gets heated when the last person in the defensive line coughs up possession as often from the high kicks. Remember, it was only down to a sypmathy call in the Salford game that we managed to hold on for a win. The previous game at the KC, another high ball missed and a try. The point is, this is bread and butter stuff. If a ten year old was making as much of a mess, he would be moved. The Jamie Thackray comment holds no water either. The difference between a genuine mistake/error and talent are two different things.
Horne R has made a much better job of the full back role. And regardless of who he has playing at seven with him, he's underperformed. We're a team of one trick ponies, the opposition have worked us out !! The ball turned back inside at the ruck, the Horne step. It'll be much better when Cooke is back on his four year deal, at least we'll have options.
And yes I am damn upset by Sharpe's decision to ditch Briscoe, just look at what it's costing us.'" Agree with what you say,a full back who doesn't want to know the high ball is a liability, and more than that he is not a full back.A full back's job is to gobble up everything thrown at him,afraid Motu is a liability under the high ball.Young Hally was dropped and shipped out,he's probably no worse than other players but they are on bigger contracts.Whilst we have the present coaching set up i can't see things changing.
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| Quote ="east hull FC fan"So taking the ball up and carrying it correctly as to make sure the collision does not dislodge the ball isn't a talent? IMO catching a ball from 20/30 foot in the air is a lot more difficult. Both were a genuine mistake, thacks cost us points, end of!'"
I never said a safe carry wasn't a talent. What I was hinting at is that losing the ball in a tackle may well be an error but not catching as many high balls is a talent issue.
Maybe Thackray did cost points today, and all our players have cost us points over the years. If you look at the amount of carries Thack's or any of the forwards make and the amount of times they fumble, the percentage is reasonably low. Look at the error rate for Tony under the high ball and it's massive by comparison. Also, look at the attention the forwards receive in the tackle. Tony often fumbles when there isn't an opposing player within 20 yards of him.
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| Quote ="Superbowl Scott"Rusty. All players are prone to errors after such a long time out.'"
Fair enough, but why does he [ukeep[/u making them? If the ref hadn't disallowed the Salford try last week we'd be in an even worse position than now.
Motu's confidence under the high ball is shot and other teams know this. He needs to be saved from himself.
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| Quote ="Mrs Barista"Excellent summary, although Thacks made 3 big errors today and was a liability.'"
Perhaps one of those days then !!!! We all have them, perhaps not four games on the trot though
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| Quote ="Largeparts"Perhaps one of those days then !!!! We all have them, perhaps not four games on the trot though
'"
Agreed, although as one of Thackray's cheerleaders that's not surprising.
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| Quote ="east hull FC fan"My god, Tony made 1 error today that didn't cost us any points, thackray knocks on, they score from the following set which at the time of the game really deflated us! No thread about thacks though.
Which just goes to prove that people on here will take any slight opportunity to start a witch hunt against someone who has been quality for us over the years but still can't get over a decision made by a coach 2 years ago!'"
Well said.
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| Quote ="east hull FC fan"My god, Tony made 1 error today that didn't cost us any points, thackray knocks on, they score from the following set which at the time of the game really deflated us! No thread about thacks though.
Which just goes to prove that people on here will take any slight opportunity to start a witch hunt against someone who has been quality for us over the years but still can't get over a decision made by a coach 2 years ago!'"
Nothing to do with Motu being a very ordinary full back then? Which he is (at best).
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| Quote ="Rock God X"On the contrary. I too think we have an average squad, but I also think that other average squads are doing better than us at this point in the season.
But when you look at the squad we have, we should be doing better. We should be able to do the basics right:
Motu - former international
Raynor - international
Calderwood - international
Yeaman - former international
Horne - former international
Berrigan - international
Manu - international
Radford - former SL winner
Briscoe - future (current?) international
King - former international
Thacks - has he got a cap or two?
Cusack - has he got an NRL winner's medal?
I'm not saying we should be topping the competition (and I know we've had a few injuries), but we have a number of players who, if they were performing better, could turn us into a reasonable play-off quality side.'"
Former internationals in general are past it - that's why they are former. Former SL winners played with world class players when they won it. Thacks ? FFS hardly an established international. He played well in the season we won the CC and got his cap then. King ? jesus wept hasn't played at international level for donkey's years. Cusack is our best forward didn't play today. Your post actually proves my point - you forgot Thorman by the way didn't he play international once ?. And critically none of the players you mention have an organising bone in their body which is one of our biggest deficiencies.
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| Quote ="Smiggs"Nothing to do with Motu being a very ordinary full back then? Which he is (at best).'"
He'll fit in well with the ordinary rest of the squad then. Anyone going to start a thread on each of them?
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| Quote ="Neil HFC"He'll fit in well with the ordinary rest of the squad then. Anyone going to start a thread on each of them?'"
Feel free.
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| I must say I enjoyed Supermans "tackle" on Pat Richards there.
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| was going to say the same myself, poor positioning to let him on his outside that easily and then a weak tackle.
I bet you there wont be a thread on the KR board slagging him off for one mistake, they tend to back their players.
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| Quote ="Staffs FC"Former internationals in general are past it - that's why they are former. Former SL winners played with world class players when they won it. Thacks ? FFS hardly an established international. He played well in the season we won the CC and got his cap then. King ? jesus wept hasn't played at international level for donkey's years. Cusack is our best forward didn't play today. Your post actually proves my point - you forgot Thorman by the way didn't he play international once ?. And critically none of the players you mention have an organising bone in their body which is one of our biggest deficiencies.'"
The point I'm making isn't that we have a team full of international standard players. The fact is that we have players who have been good enough at some stage in their careers to represent their country. Players who are hardly old enough to be deemed 'past it'. Some of those players are playing below the standards they are capable of. That's the fact of the matter.
You can argue that the squad isn't good enough - and I'll agree with you. What you can't argue is that this squad is playing to its full potential. Not in a million years.
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| Quote ="Rock God X"The point I'm making isn't that we have a team full of international standard players. The fact is that we have players who have been good enough at some stage in their careers to represent their country. Players who are hardly old enough to be deemed 'past it'. Some of those players are playing below the standards they are capable of. That's the fact of the matter.
You can argue that the squad isn't good enough - and I'll agree with you. What you can't argue is that this squad is playing to its full potential. Not in a million years.'"
In a nutshell. The concerning thing is that although it would be nice to think Lauaki, Crocker and Cusack would have added a lot to our pack today, the likelihood is that we still would be underperforming vs what we would be capable of.
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| Quote ="Rock God X"What you can't argue is that this squad is playing to its full potential. Not in a million years.'"
We'll agree to differ. I'm not saying for one second by the way that Agar hasn't got a fair bit to answer for. ATEOTD we lack quality at half back which means we are crap at organising any kind of attack and it shows every week when we get 20m from the opposition line. Horne has been very poor this season and Thorman should have been dropped weeks ago - something Agar has definitely got wrong previously. Our pack is OK when it plays to the very best of its ability but when that dips we are struggling even more. With 2 decent halves we would get into the top 6 but we need better players across the park to challenge the top 2.
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| Consistent though Motu at fullback. Rubbish
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| Motu has been consistently awful for a long time a full back. It's funny that when I called out for his defenders today it all went silent. Every defender of Motu as a fullback is an enemy to our club.
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| Quote ="Raggytash"Motu has been consistently awful for a long time a full back. It's funny that when I called out for his defenders today it all went silent. Every defender of Motu as a fullback is an enemy to our club.'"
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| Quote ="east hull FC fan"Tony made 1 error today that didn't cost us any points'"
He made two, one of which cost us a try (Wire's first).
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