They can't move until contact is made with the ball. What I was saying was our actual mechanics of playing the ball from front to back and then the pass from dummy half are slow at times (more so on Friday I thought, probably hangover fatigue from Easter). Now this may only add a second or so, but in a process that only takes a few seconds in total that can be a relatively large addition leading to the defensive team making 1 or 2 yards more.

I'm not saying that offsides are perfectly policed, but I don't think they're always as bad or as one-sided as a lot of Hull fans seem to.

Add in that the man who receives the ball is invariable stood still or barely above walking pace due to poor organisation and delivery from acting half

Exactly. It's little things like these that all add up to us being woefully slow from the ptb to hitting the line, not just that we don't get up quickly enough (although we don't, either). Referees are usually as bad about the 10 for both teams, we just contribute further to help teams make more ground on us a lot of the time.

The frustrating thing for me is that if we could be a bit better in 4 or 5 key areas then we would be greatly improved as a team

And even more so because it's been that way for ages. I do think a lot of this stems from lack of guile , at the ptb. With all respect to Houghton and his work ethic he at least needs help from a more physically and mentally dominant acting half who will push both opposition and his own players around and control that area. A 9 calling the shots and worrying the opposition because they don't know what he'll do next is something we've lacked for years. Howarth and Cunningham aren't that sort of player and I don't think Houghton can become one.

I think that everyone can agree that we have issues with a slow PTB, but how anyone can look at Silverwood's performance and say that he was equally bad for both sides is beyond my comprehension. Granted he was terrible overall, but we got the dodgy end of the stick by some considerable margin.

Sadly in this day and age in 90% of ptb's the attacking player's foot never touches the ball....

I agree that most times things are evened up, but, that doesn't mean it's ok not to police it properly. He was poor for both sides.
As I said in a previous post Silverwood was particularly lax in with the offside. He had players either side of him, within touching distance, who were clearly well in front of him, before the ball was even placed, never mind heeled (well, ok. an attempt was made to heel

) How he couldn't see it is a bit of a worry.
I also agree that our generally slow PTB's, seem to highlight the problem even more.

Who won? anyone would think we had lost, Widnes moved the ball better ..and lost ! they saved 6 players for this game...and lost Fc had No Ellis, ,Sneyd,Watts,Green,Hadley,Yeaman and Whiting come of the back of a easter weekend and all fans can do is pick fault. make no mistake Widnes were offside probably all the game and Silverwood allowed it.Again Houghton gets flack for what? giving 100% .As for agreeing with the pundits these are the same pundits who said kelly was magical getting two length of the field interception tries yet Lineham did the same and he was lucky? the same pundits who had fc to lose and how Brown would be the key to a Widnes win,they were wrong . No it was not sparkling rugby but come on give the side some credit for once

You've no chance with that particular poster as he's desperate to tell us all how he was correct in permanently slating the coach.

spot on hokey

You say similar nearly every week, I disagree this week as I do many others. The officials are bad, but not usually biased without a big 4 presence.

I agree it's not ok to not police it properly. I'm just saying that it's often the same for both sides and we are not the perennial victims some seem to think or want to paint us as.

Who slated the coach? I offered an opinion on the actuality of what I saw, going by the previous posts by other forumers they agree. Our PTB is lacklustre, there are no dummy runners and backing up breaks is awful/non existant, our effort is there, that's hardly ever being in doubt and our defence was pretty good as I said.
As you're so desperate to tell us how correct you are over whatever the point you're trying to make why not actually look at what has being written, compare it to the actual game and how we played and then come up with a contribution to the thread instead of backbiting like an infant or are you just not capable of understanding the game of rugby league and a very fair assessment of how we played?

Did you actually bother reading, no sorry understanding what I said?? FFS you just concocted imaginary stuff out of your own head and surplanted it to how you read what I'd written. They said we wouldn't trouble the top sides with that attack, I agree on the basis of what I saw, you have an opinion fine but you go on to say about me saying Lineham was lucky

IF you had listened to the commentators they actually said Lineham was brave and had used his nouse..so on that your interpretation of what I said was wrong.(The fact I never mentioned Lineham seems to have also avoided you!!)
I pointed out our obvious inadequecies, as others have also, Houghton IS NOT a great distributor of the ball, he hardly ever changes the direction of play and it's all so slow AND obvious. If you think our backing up is great watch how many breaks we make and how many times we backed up in that game, watch how little dummy runners we have.. I've given congrats on a well earned win in tough circumstances but I and many others can see where we are lacking.
if you don't like the fact that posters have an opinion on what is on show..tough, go elsewhere but learn to understand what's being said instead of thinking what it said in your own mind mr agenda.

Just about to type something similar but simply can't be @ rsed now as you've save me the trouble. Strange how you can type no criticism of the team whatsoever and merely comment on referree performance and pundit opinion and get slated for knocking the team by some one eyed fans who interpret it as such with hokeys being the best fantasy story I've seen.

I've barely mentioned the officials this season. But feel free to quote me to prove otherwise.

I never mentioned bias. A ref doesn't have to be deliberately biased to ref one side differently to another or for decisions to go more in favour of one team than the other. Incompetence is enough.

I don't really care enough to check your posting history to see if that is true for this season. It has been a consistent theme of yours for pretty much all of the time I've been on these boards to bash the refs as working against us, though, whether intentionally or not.



So you genuinely believe that we are regularly on the receiving end of incompetent refereeing performances that just so happen to favour the opposition?

It's not that IMO, I think it's just the natural warping of a fan's view to more readily notice and then remember the things that go against their team. It does happen sometimes, but with the regularity you've often suggested, no.

And I still don't think it was the case on Friday specifically, which was the starting point.

Bring back Fred lindop

While talking about the RH commentary team I was listening to the coverage of Rovers and Castleford while driving home at the weekend. At the point where Carney went down with his arm one of the commentary team came out with "I hope he's injured", followed by a bit of back pedalling no doubt when seeing the looks on others faces that he's actually said it out loud.

Classy.

The standard of refereeing in SL may have been a 'consistent theme' of mine. Whatever that means. I have rarely accused refs of 'working against us' as that would imply a level of deliberation I genuinely don't feel is present most of the time, apart from the fairly well documented 'top 4 effect' that many teams suffer from.


Were did I say that? I genuinely believe that all teams are regularly on the receiving end of incompetent refereeing performances. That typically favours the better side and/or has the biggest impact in tight games - two conditions that, unfortunately, tend to have worked against us as we haven't been very good and are often involved in tight games as a result.


You're entitled to your opinion, but I'm struggling to see how you came to it. I'm hardly an isolated case in thinking otherwise either. I do feel that you tend to err on the side of not blaming officials even when they deserve it out of a desire, unconscious or otherwise, to not appear to be making excuses for bad performances.

refs may be stupid, blind, useless, arrogant, ignorant winkers but I don't for one second think they have any bias at all.

Think Silverback showed that he was by watching replay and all the Hull players moved to 20 m line he held his place trying to force the vid refs to go his way.
Lack of not going to vid refs for Browns try .
Then ruling out a god try for us by not going to vid ref again.
Stopping game when an injured player not on the pitch in his own in goal area head injury should of ordered him off and replaced ,not stop game so all momentum was lost

Same here. The only time you ever see a bit of a bias is when one of the big teams is at home and the crowd gets on his back and may influence the odd decision. But that's just human nature, and it isn't prevalent enough to be an issue imo.