7 wins out of 28 against the best 5 teams in the comp says otherwise

To continue a bit of a Hudge theme in the threads im reading tonight........shame Agar isn't on no-win-no-fee.............

I didn't mean to imply that the facts were untrue in anyway. I was just suggesting that the headline statement you put out there didn't tell the full story.

The rest of your post is opinion and that is fair enough, although I would say that I think some of it is very "glass half empty" - but that's my opinion.

Whilst it's fair to say that our attacking play is often understated on here and we have the 5th best points difference in the league as things stand, the fact is that we have been in the bottom half of the table all season. That may well change by the weekend but how long will it last?

www.nrl.com/super-league-losing- ... fault.aspx Bit of a interview here.

www.nrl.com/super-league-losing- ... fault.aspx Bit of a interview here.

Wont disagree with that, we all have differing opinions and my glass is definitely half empty.

"wereas we only lost to Wigan by 2 points."

That quote sums everything up for me. We were in front against a Wigan side who were then reduced to 12 men and STILL couldn't win the game. Had roles been reversed would Wigan have allowed the same scenario to unfold? I very much doubt it. As for 'competing' with the top sides, the stats that have previously been banded about say it all.

To be 4 from 28 against Wigan, Warrington, Saints and Leeds in the past four years is simply not good enough. Forget injuries, crisis's, bad refereeing decisions etc. Every side has those and they get on and deal with it. The fact of the matter is that we're not a threat to the top teams (see 4 wins from 28 if you don't buy that) and it's just not acceptable. The league table never lies as they always say and that means that we're 8th with seven games to play. If that's good enough for this club then we may as well all give up now.

I'm sure some statto can tell us how the other SL clubs have done against those 5 teams in the same period. Would expect there are few who have done worse

Against Wigan, Warrington, Saints and Leeds 2008/9/10/11 (including playoffs)

Worst to best
Crusaders 2 wins (Not present in 200icon_cool.gif
Salford 5 wins (Not present 200icon_cool.gif
Hull Fc 5 wins 1 draw (Wigan in 08 and 09 Saints in 2010 twice and Wire in 2011)
Wakey 6 wins
Quins 7 wins
Bradford 7 wins 2 draws
Cas 7 win 2 draw
Warrington 9 wins (obviously not playing themselves)
Hudds 13 wins
Hull Kr 13 wins
Catalan 14 wins 1 draw
Leeds 14 wins 1 draw (obviously not playing themselves)
Wigan 15 wins 3 draws (obviously not playing themselves)
Saints 21 wins 2 draws (obviously not playing themselves)

You beat me to it, there is 10 minutes of my life Im never getting back!!!

I had Quins down for 7 wins though. Not that it really matters

Just double checked and you are correct

That is very depressing reading. Sort of hits home which company we should count ourselves in, and it's obviously not the top 6, nor even particularly close.

Wow. And not in a good way. Add in our woeful record against Rovers, which is a "big" game, and it's a tragic indictment of our mentality, IMO.

We've had that company 2 out of the last 3 seasons so it shouldn't come as a suprise to most fans.

It's an indicator of three things IMO...

1. Too many seasons without a proper halfback partnership.
2. Too many seasons without a proper kicking game.
3. A lack of mental toughness.

Good post.

or simply too long without a quality coach.

But it may make it more difficult to deny that we deserve to be amongst them.

Makes worse reading when you consider Wigan & Wire were not even classed as the top 4 just 2 seasons back they were far from it. In those 4 years the 2 constants have been Leeds & Saints and we have a total of 2 wins against those.

Personally I think that 1 and 2 contribute as key factors in our league positions over this time. What the results against the top clubs show for me are that we don't have the self-belief going into these games, and I would add the Rovers games in too as these should be big games for us where we only win one game in three against a mediocre team that can get up for the occasion. We just don't turn up in these games with an attitude that we are fully confident in our ability to win and a mindset that demands a "one in, all in" attitude. The fact that Cas, Harlequins and Wakey have better returns from big games is telling.

Also a lack of versatility. The top sides generally have the ability to change tack to turn the tide of a game and find a way to win, we don't have that and it is exposed more against better opposition.

FFS, worse than I thought

You need to ring sportstalk about this

4. Too many seasons with an inadequate coach

Your right, that is a very simple way of looking at it.