Quote ="davey37"Which stats are these?'" These: www.superleague.co.uk/matchday/player/114 And these: slstats.rlfans.com/index.php?playero=291 They show his performances in 2011 and 2012 were broadly similar to his performances in 2009 and 2010 (GB call up, FC player of the year) with a noticeable drop this season - particularly in errors per game.

Quote ="davey37"Which stats are these?'" These: www.superleague.co.uk/matchday/player/114 And these: slstats.rlfans.com/index.php?playero=291 They show his performances in 2011 and 2012 were broadly similar to his performances in 2009 and 2010 (GB call up, FC player of the year) with a noticeable drop this season - particularly in errors per game.

I think he realised long before last night hence the signings of Feka & Paea.

Yeaman getting slated. Lovely. Always hated the ugly little badge kisser.

We all have players we hate, step forward "Charlie."

Quote ="Kosh"These: www.superleague.co.uk/matchday/player/114 And these: slstats.rlfans.com/index.php?playero=291 They show his performances in 2011 and 2012 were broadly similar to his performances in 2009 and 2010 (GB call up, FC player of the year) with a noticeable drop this season - particularly in errors per game.'" The stat I am interested in is missed tackles (MI). Doing a quick total up each season it proves that he has been equally bad every season with over 40. Indeed in 2009 the figures are horrendous with 8 misses in one match versus Rovers.

Quote ="Kosh"These: www.superleague.co.uk/matchday/player/114 And these: slstats.rlfans.com/index.php?playero=291 They show his performances in 2011 and 2012 were broadly similar to his performances in 2009 and 2010 (GB call up, FC player of the year) with a noticeable drop this season - particularly in errors per game.'" The stat I am interested in is missed tackles (MI). Doing a quick total up each season it proves that he has been equally bad every season with over 40. Indeed in 2009 the figures are horrendous with 8 misses in one match versus Rovers.

He's never been terrific in defence, no. But that wasn't your original point. You said he'd been 'crap' for a few seasons when in fact his missed tackle and error count has been fairly consistent going back to when he was playing for GB and winning club awards.

Jesus....must watch different games to me then.....Ran some great angles and played with commitment.Been a very fine player for us.

miller should go hes making yeamos job even harder hiding behind ellis in defence hes awful imo

Unmitigated nonsense.

i just dont think hes good enough if were to contend for silverware most halfbacks can tackle look at broughy n burrows all rounders millers been targeted loads already and will be a spot for many teams to target in the future.

I know you cant just get rid but if you could it'd be bye bye to Miller, Mcdonnell, Johnson, Crookes.

Yeaman to second row to see if he can cut it. Id play Heremaia and Holdsworth in the halfs with Horne as back up full back/half back.

So get rid of Mcdonnell????/ and play a hooker at 7 with a utterly useless standoff?

And relegate our best performing half back to a back up role.

What about Shaul. Do you lose him just to keep to some bang average aussie on your books?

There's room for both. Shaul is far from the finished article. His passing is little short of horrific, for starters. There may be times when his form dips and he needs a break from the first team. McDonnell can play wing as well, so provides cover.

Great idea.

That 'bang average Aussie' was the second best FB in the competition at the time of his injury.

According to who

OPTA.

Not only that but if Shaul gets injured guess who'd be the first one on here slagging the club off for not having cover!

The facts. As represented by OPTA stats.

I realise that you'll be incapable of giving him any credit so you might just want to duck out of this conversation to avoid embarrassment.

His missed tackle count and error count have been consistently awful going back seasons. Stats prove that.

Whether he was picked for GB or won club awards doesn't alter the stats you were so keen to highlight.

Plus certain stats can tell a confusing story. e.g. if a player drops 20% of passes but only receives 5 passes a game then his error count will be 1. But if he receives 15 passes a game the error count will be 3. Now it is well known that we used our left side attack (Manu, Yeaman & Briscoe) more than our right so Tickle didn't see so much of the ball.

Hence less errors in previous seasons and hence my main criticism of him been his missed tackles (or pathetic attempts at tackles).

I'd give credit where due but mcdonnel is average and given another off season shaul will offer more.
As for 2nd best full back in the league regardless of stats I'd take hardaker, grix, lomax, tomkins, hodgeson and hanbury all before him and regardless of his faults I wouldn't swap eden for him either. Apologies if ive missed any other better fullback out.

Oh well - I did offer you the opportunity. Now you've gone and made yourself look daft.

I've had a think and you're right, mcdonnel is better than tomkins and hardaker, my bad.