Sorry mate, it's a bit of a drag from Zummerzet every other week

No worries no worries, i'm sure it wont be too difficult to find people fitting the description needed on this board

Oh you've changed my name to something hilarious now, what a card you are!

I understand perfectly what you want to do thanks, you want to discuss our poor statistics in terms of ways in which we can say that they aren't Agar's fault, except when a statistic comes up that you can try to spin in order to try and make Agar look good (e.g. penalty count).

Obviously you've really whetted everyone's appetite with that proposal, as demonstrated by the thriving statistical debate that is going on here.

Surely by the time any of the players have been accepted into the club, from colts; A team; First squad; then they would have been taught as amateurs how to play all the basics of R.league. So they certainly should not need to be coached. I am not one who studies Statistics, but I would be interested to know the comparisons between penalties against Garreth Carvell when he played for us and now he plays for Warrington. It just seems as if the refs awarded more when he was playing for us, and now he plays for Wankey, he gets away with the same. Maybe it's me and memory lapses.

Its the same memory lapse maybe that remembers that Keith Senior needs to attend some more basic coaching, as again I see more forward passes from Keith that are ignored by the linesmn/refs. Why is it that Super League cannot show forward passes, and thus be able to disallow them by video-ref. They manage to show the angles of a kick but a simple line to prove that a ball has gone forward is too difficult. grannyfan Cindy

Ok here some stats for you.

2008 (Agar officially takes over Round 16)

Round 16 : Leeds 38 - Hull 22
Round 24 : Hull 24 - Huddersfield 30

2009

Round 13 : Hull 16 - Wire 18

2010

Round 18 : Huddersfield 32 - Hull 18
Round 27 : Hull 14 - Leeds 18

2011

Round 1 : Hull KR 34 - Hull 24

In all the above games Hull have actually lead by 12 or more points and went onto lose.


2008

Round 19 : Hull 22 - Warrington 24

2009

Round 6 : Hull 18 - Castleford 19
CC Round 4 : Hull 18 - Salford 22
Round 10 : Hull 14 - Wakefield 21
Round 13 : Hull 16 - Bradford 18
Round 27 : Hull 18 - Bradford 21

2010

Round 3 : Crusaders 18 - Hull 16
Round 8 : Salford 27 - Hull 20

2011

Round 5 : Wigan (with 12 men) 14 - Hull 12

All those games Hull were leading or at the very worst drawing going into the last 10 minutes of the game and still lost.

I am sure they are some alarming ommissions but this just shows how far away from a top club we actually are under Agar.

So the reason that Carvell is a more effective player now than he was for us is nothing to do with coaching and more likely to be down to referees? I've heard it all now



No offence to you Mrs Russell I know you've been watching FC for longer than I've been alive, but saying that players learn the basics as a youngster and that's all there is to it is simply wrong in the modern era.

Quote ="pmarrow"Ok here some stats for you. '" The only stat anyone should need at the moment is this one: news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... efault.stm Or perhaps it's that Agar's win percentage is barely above 40% Or maybe it's that we've only beaten the top 5 teams (Hudds, Wire, Leeds, Wigan, Saints) 5 times in the 30 games we have played them under Agar, and only one of those 5 came outside the first month of the season. But no, why not spend time in 'Pookieworld' and see if we can't put it down to our forwards not getting taught how to run the ball in well enough back when they were juniors

Quote ="pmarrow"Ok here some stats for you. '" The only stat anyone should need at the moment is this one: news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_l ... efault.stm Or perhaps it's that Agar's win percentage is barely above 40% Or maybe it's that we've only beaten the top 5 teams (Hudds, Wire, Leeds, Wigan, Saints) 5 times in the 30 games we have played them under Agar, and only one of those 5 came outside the first month of the season. But no, why not spend time in 'Pookieworld' and see if we can't put it down to our forwards not getting taught how to run the ball in well enough back when they were juniors

You've got a good memory!

Is he? Apart from a huge reduction in time injured I'd say he's no better - he's always been that good. Remember he got selected for GB while at FC.

Spot on. A fantastic player for us when fit.

That's probably fair comment, but why the sudden end to his injury troubles when he moved to Wire?..Coincidence? or working with a better coach with better methods in a better training environment?

Clearly reading this thread has all got a bit much in "Whingley World" (which I suspect has very few Rich Agar's) and you are now getting names like "Cindy" and "Pookie" mixed up - fair enough they are very similar.
As I said previously I don't think we need to go back to when the players were juniors. Just why statistically we havent had anyone take the ball up really since Motu Tony (I am not sure if you where boycotting home games at that time but he played for Hull FC). As I said why? Maybe the answer is Rich Agar's coaching skills? I cant see that but I am posing the question.

So when he was injured playing for Hull -

Hull FC prop Garreth Carvell has been ruled out for three-and-a-half months after it was confirmed he ruptured knee ligaments in the game with Warrington.

The Great Britain and Wales prop said the injury, after a tackle by Rob Parker, was a total accident.

"I can't believe it, especially as I was really looking to make a big impact at the start of the season. To say I'm gutted is an understatement," he said.

- it was down to a poor training environment (read: in Whingley World Agar's fault) ?

But presumably when he broke his leg playing for Warrington that was down to the good technique coached by Tony Smith?

Deary me, you've mentioned me attending home games three times in the same thread now and you still expect to be taken seriously?

It's typical of your tactics to use a small piece of information such as Carvell getting injured once and pretend it's enough evidence to ignore the bigger picture that he has been fit far more often for Wire than he was for us. It's much like when you pretend that having a low penalty count over the season means that our discipline was the best in the league or as good as Wigan's.. It just shows you don't get it.

Clearly it's possible to attend as many matches as you are so clearly proud to have done and yet still retain such utter ignorance about the sport you are watching. Your pro-Agar rhetoric is somewhere on the scale between the icecreamman and Jimmy Rule's newspaper interviews, I do think you ought to question the wisdom of you starting a thread purely to showcase your own ignorance though.

Can't you two get a room?

If someone makes a daft OP, they get a daft thread

You're right, this is a daft thread. To which you've heavily contributed. Are you willing to take your share of the blame? I doubt it.

Guilty.



Anyway in the unlikely event you want to find us later we will be in the hotel bar. I will be the one with the glass half full and Gary...

....Probably spilled his when he read the latest Agar "stating the bleeding obvious cr*p" in the HDM!

No idea. He was hardly the only player to suffer from the 'FC injury curse' and I'm not sure we're any closer to figuring out why now than we were then. We've had injury issues under three different conditioners and four coaches.

Fortunately I was at a seminar in Manchester all day yesterday so I missed that. I went to the JJB last night though, so I'm actually in a pretty good mood having seen some proper rugby being played for the first time in god knows how long. It's amazing what a bit of decent coaching can do....

I sometimes wondered if it had anything to do with the firmness of the KC pitch but Wigan and Huddersfield never seemed to suffer like we did

Not to mention two squads packed full of international standard players.

You mean like the one Cullen had in his last 2 or 3 years at Wire and couldn't get anywhere near winning anything? Besides, one of Wire's standout performers for me last night was Blythe, and then you've got the likes of Briers and Westwood who Smith has transformed at a relatively late stage in their careers into twice the players that they used to be.

Obviously Wigan and Wire's squads do look dodgy in terms of salary cap, but it's really not worth bringing up unless they ever get found guilty of a breach.