We are at the moment. Do you think we'll be there after the weekly rounds have concluded? I have to say, I have my doubts.

Sorry i respect your opinion but you know as well as i do that 90% of those out of contract run of the mill players will get another contract because it is the cheap option.

8th is play offs this year.

So if we finished 7th last year (outside playoffs) and 8th this year. Would that make us better?

apparently where in talks with thorman for next season

More likely a 5 year deal.

what really is the point of a playoff away defeat at Saints, Wigan or wherever? really i fail to see what benefit that brings the club or enjoyment for the fans

this season was over the moment we performed pathetically at home to salford in the cup

your Mr Thorman and i claim my five pound

Irrelevant as we finished 11th last year, so that's progress, even if ithe basic maths doesn't fit with your agenda.

At the start of the season I though we'd finish somewhere between 7th and 9th. That assumed that we had better luck with injuries and Crocker would be playing. So we're technically overachieving against my expectations at the moment.



Given our injury situation and the complete skill vacuum that is Chris Thorman I now expect us to miss out on the top 8 barring some miracle.

So you are saying that only a top 4 place (ie a home tie) would have been acceptable at the start of the season, even though we were 11th last year?

no any playoff place would have been acceptable, if i had any confidence of us beating one of the other 7 and actually winning 1 playoff game!

right now I have so little confidence in our woeful side that I'd prefer the season to be over already to spare our embarrassment

So a 12th finish is an improvement cos there will be 2 teams below us?

Teams I expect to finish above us, in no particular order:

Saints
Leeds
Rovers
Huddersfield
Bradford
Warrington
Harlequins
Wigan

Wakey and Cas are both in with a decent shout, too.

Saints away apart, our losing margin has not been more than 10, so we've hardly been "embarrassed". Let's say we get Tony, Raynor and Berrigan back shortly and Lauaki gets his visa. Get Manu back end of June and things are maybe looking up, particularly if we drop Thorman and stick Berro at 7. To call us woeful and embarrassing is OTT.

A play off spot is looking increasingly unlikely.

We still have to play Leeds home and away, Saints at home, Wigan, Rovers, Catalans and Warrington away.

Given we've lost five on the bounce at home, even Salford, Bradford, Huddersfield and Quins look tough.

Great how people just want to tell someone isn't it ?

In some ways I would rather rovers faced better quality opponents than us in the playoffs. I would hate for Hull FC to be playing some part in getting the filth to Old Trafford.

IS IT SAM MOAS GAME SHIRT YOUR SELLING??

I think this is the number you're looking for

says who

I wont be renewing my pass if we are!

reckon you will be renewing it then

Thorman is clearly a joke at SH but to blame him for all of our inadequacies is a little optimistic. There are many things clearly very wrong with our squad and coaching set-up and Thorman just happens to be the biggest example.

The fact that 11 are unavailable, including 4 of our first choice back 5, being one of them.