Ive seen the updates in the mail but find Radford very cryptic, like i said he said Savelio was just a niggle.

Hes abit vague with Ratu too.

Sounds like Carlos, Satae and Kelly and thats about it

I never said the pack was our biggest problem but it is a problem. Our 1st choice pack includes ellis who won't play a chunk of games this year. We're then into playing our form centre in the 2nd row or playing youngsters who clearly aren't up to it.

Stats yesterday:

lane - 9 carries
masi - 3 carries
fash 4 carries
ellis - 4 carries
bowden - 4 carries

Simply not good enough.

Contrast it to wigan's youngsters/interchange

smithies - 12 carries
partington - 13 carries
bullock - 11 carries
byrne - 12 carries
clarke - 12 carries

The forwards clearly are a problem

As radford has said, a very average wigan side

never been sold on radfrods ability to handle the interchanges and the make up of his various benches. its ok when at full strength but we've seen some strange set ups over the years

That very average Wigan side will still finish above you. Again

Can I just say that, as a Wigan fan, I'm very happy for Radford to consider us "an average side". He has shown many times that he has poor judgement and is pretty clueless when recognising what makes a good side. I'd happily have him a substantial bet that this 'average' side will finish above his 'good' one.

This is more to do with the fact that Radford doesn't use or trust the young players enough (or the bench for that matter) and the fact that our backs do far too much work, Wigan trust there youngsters more than us.

Did Radford say Wigan were average, where was that?

Is it or is it that when our young players are on the field they're not looking g for work? Could be down to the player, the coach or on field decision makers. Whatever it is it's a problem

You are average and will finish a long way behind saints again. Where Hull finish has no bearing on how good Wigan are

Looking at this particular subject I would say if it were simply down to the players not looking for work then it wouldn't be such a spread of low numbers and would expect a difference in the numbers as not every single player would not be looking for work. It would seem it is more to do with the way the coach wants it and sees it when you look at the way we use the interchanges as we just don't use them wisely.
I think you are also right Jake in the fact that one or two of the decision makers are also at fault for not giving or allowing the players the opportunities when they come on.

I know its only 4 games in but its not just about this season, its about seeing the same poor decisions, mistakes and dumb stuff we have seen for the past few seasons and even with a whole host of changes in playing staff we are still seeing the same stuff that doesn't work. So just how long do we keep telling ourselves its early days? because in all honesty it isn't or are we just yet again in the jam tomorrow phase.

We’re four games in, Leeds Saints Rovers Wigan, 50/50 at present, a difficult start to the season by any standards.

Atrocious weather for players and supporters alike, yet on our own board we have the Radford out brigade already, a lot of talent missing through injury or suspension, players playing busted, and all the young kids are getting it in the neck ffs what age is Jordan Lane 22/23?

It’s a good job some of these chaps on here didn’t watch us in the sixties or seventies, now they would have cause to criticise, give them a chance for gods sake, the season just began.

We have beaten teams who finished below us, and lost to those who finished above us last season. To be in the top 3, we need to start beating teams who finished above us - Saints had players missing, 1 week before the WCC. Wigan also had players missing and had a stuttering start to the year - yet we didn't take advantage.

Constructive criticism is allowed.

Weve brought in an attacking coach to solve alot of the issues mentioned, yet our attacking structure doesnt seem to have altered.

Some posters with a keen eye are spotting the exact same shortcomings as weve had for a couple of seasons now.

Whats wrong with pointing them out and hoping they improve.

Weve mentioned the players shirking work especially in the forwards, weve mentioned the distribution from the play the ball and the organisers. Radfords latest interview seems to lay the blame at the players doors as in the decision makers on the pitch. So who is it Connor, Sneyd and Houghton?

Il say it again as much as Houghtons done for us and all the tackles he makes, i dont think his distribution from the play the ball is brilliant, as in speed and pass selection.

Were looking disjointed, try Johnstone from the start vs Catalans and Kelly at 6.

Wasn't clueless when he out-coached Wane in the 2016 challenge cup semi and the 2017 final.

you know there is a difference between an "average side" in a league in any given year, and an average side compared to previous iterations of the same team don't you?

I’ve no problem with constructive criticism, but four matches in to a new season, and a Radders out thread, it is more like a witch hunt.

Maybe pop your comment over on the relevant thread as its coming over people arnt allowed to discuss our short comings on the matchday thread, after the match.

Does a new season draw a line under previous season's performances? if so do we disregard those cup wins which were years ago?

... and what about 2018, when the club had the worst injury record in living memory.
Plenty on here have already conveniently forgotten it ever happened.

You couldn’t disregard those fantastic occasions, even you must have enjoyed them. But this is 20/20 four games in, we’re not that good, we’re not that bad, give the lads a chance, even till Easter as one of our posters use to say, we don’t know how the season will unravel.

My original post is on the correct thread, regarding Wigan v Hull.

Even I must have enjoyed them? I love this club and have supported them for best part of 50 years. Seen plenty of ups and downs but I'm not blind to the clubs failings unlike some

And the joint worst losing run in our history along with the worst defeat in our history too wasnt it?

I guess I’m just a glass half full type of guy Jake

... and maybe, just maybe, because of the worst injury record in living memory.

I still can't understand why some people believe that losing 7 players from your starting 13 doesn't weaken the team significantly. It's nothing to do with excuses, it's a simple fact.