No such word mate.

FWIW I think Horne has done enough for this club in the past to deserve next season to prove he can overcome his health and injury problems. If he's unable to do it then sentimentality cannot be allowed to come in to it and we have to let him go (I really hope it doesn't come to this though).

i know a player that ed there testimonial money away oh and gambled some too

More fool him.

Horney wont do that tho,hes a very sensible bloke and thats why i did what i did for him,if i thought for one minute he would pis- it up against a wall he wouldnt be getting more than £4000 from me and everyone who contributed to my fundraising,thats why i believe so many people have and are still supporting his events.

Is this the same one who used it to pay off his morgage?

I could name another load of players as well as the others that i'd have in front of Westwood. Dont rate the bloke one bit.

Think the appropriate word is "disillusioned".

I have always been a fan of Richard,but as has been discussed elsewhwere,since his neck injury,and diagnosed with diabetes he has not been his usual self. It is understandable,but if he has lost his edge then sentiment has to go out of the window.I would love it if he returns to his former self. (only my opinion of course.)

Don't be so pedantic, we all knew what he meant. It's an Internet forum, not countdown!

Yea ,but he would get F all on Scrabble.

I know what you mean about the decision making but I reckon he will make a cracking hooker/looseman in the near future. Agree that he hasn't got it as a half but like to think that a succesion of coaches have picked him going back to McRae, who made sure we signed him ahead of other clubs, cant all be wrong.

He is the type of player you either love or hate, bit like Calderwood in that respect. Agree to a point about players you rate above him but think that, of his type, he is one of the best playing over here. Reckon he is a similar type of player to Crocker, though not in the same class, and one that we need.

Tommy Lee is an example of what is wrong with coaching set up at FC, he had good decision making and they have coached it out of him. The Horne borthers have all suffered from not having a settled position, Yeaman should be a second rower by now. The club has a long history of missing players by trying to make them into something the are not.

Tommy was a gifted ball handler and those of us who have watched his developement at West Hull over the years will be amazed how he has changed. I see him slowing down to think now before he makes pass, the3 coaches and the bo boys hjave done that. I hope he does change clubs and goes on to become the player many of know is in there it just needs a decent patient coach to bring it back out.

Westerman and Welham where both at FC, two examples I can think of where good players have slipped through the net. We keep kidding ourselves that our junior set up is the best, its not its bloody dire at times. We are ruining more then we are producing and we not producing any half backs of note at the moment.

excellent post, TL was rated amongst the best youngsters in the game, his game has been coached out of him, we have watched a talented youngster, and i am amazed at how he has changed!

was suppose to pay off his morgage you mean but didnt ?

didnt think for one minute horne would do that with his money sensible people dont

talking about not producing half backs at the moment.could anyone tell me when was the last time ,hull or rovers for that matter last produced a top class scrum half of any real note.ive watched hull for many years and i cant recall any local scrum half going on to represent great britain.

It's quite common for a seemingly world beating junior to fail to make the grade at senior level. It has always happened, and is not inevitably the fault of the club or in TL's case the 3 different coaches who have presided over him.

At the same club Paul Cooke was a gifted young ball player and yet he did make the grade becoming the team's pivotal player.

Interesting to see Moa listed as Super League's best prop in this months Rugby League World. He has looked good in the last few he's played. I would want a seriously high quality replacement if we didn't retain him. Gotta be good value even on an improved contract.

Paul Cooke had a regular position and one main coach for his formative years ..................bomber

Talk about tommy lee's supposed gift all you want, the kid was never going to be the superstar some thought, talking to other people that have first hand experience of his youth career and plenty thought he wouldn't make it, some are even surprised he got this far.
You also name 2 other players that we have let slip, there are also those that have made it, rich Horne and yeamo have both been gb internationals, washy was in super leagues team of the year in 2008, tom briscoe is in the England elite squad. Paul king has a gb cap, rich whiting was young poty through our development, danny houghton is probably the 2nd best impact hooker inthe league and then there's cookie a kid who probably should have gb caps aswell.

Considering Hull is a "hot bed of rugby league", it has produced very few top class players in the last 25 years. Must be more to do with coaching than a lack of natural talent

He also had some experienced ball players to learn from, something Lee hasn't had.

Top post Ian.

Apart from Richard Horne you mean

Well said Ian. Someting I have alluded to before. The whole system is wrong. The scouting system needs severe sort out. Over the past 25 years how many players have to to Hull's youth set up and how many come from just 3 or 4 clubs in the Hull seen. Namely West Hull, Skirlaugh, East Hull, Iseberg.

How many came from Orchard Park, Beverley, Cottingham etc. There is a pecking order and only if you come from certain clubs do you really get a look in.

Our recruitment from further afield has improved since Agar came on board, Briscoe bros for two.
The whole youth set up for a long time has been geared towards winning. At aged 16 through 21 its not about winning but development. Yes winning league titles is great but its about development and producing the right kind of player with the right tempriment.

We are also reaping the reward of trying to pack a team full of people from Hull. We waxed lyrical a few years ago about the number of Hull lads in the team. Now look where it has got us.

We need to start looking at all players and developing them towards being quality specialists as opposed to average utility players. Could you imagine Saints playing Wellens at half back in the absence of Pryce. No but I bet we would have done that if they both played for us.

Some of all this has to come down to the player himself being dedicated to the cause, but that also comes from the example of senior pros. Thats why J Smith, Swain, Kearney were so influential. The squad of today have Radders, Tickle, Thackray and Berrigan to look to which is hardly orr inspiring. Thats before the world class coaching set up.

In the case of Lee though I have ofetn feared what is in a players mind when he runs onto the field with not a single hair out of place. Hensen in RU is another. But thats just my little bug bear.

Rich Horne is many things, but a Scrum Half isn't one of them.