Agar should be doing all he can to get the team working together and playing well. Not all our players are average but two thirds of them I would say are. Some coach are able to make average players looks quality. Something Agar isn't capable of doing.

We'll agree to differ. Berrigan should at least have been looking in the direction of Thackray at the time.

Berrigan average? PMSL

I agree. However you would also expect your best player to lead by example and drag the team through games kicking and screaming if he has too. He should be standing out as our best player, but he isn't, he did last season. So for me it's either he is lacking in attitude or he is playing injured.

Well apparently he isn't our best player, he is only average.

Disagree.

Thackray should have been looking to get a qptb instead of a ridiculous offload in traffic and that no-one was expecting. Berro was clearly looking to sort the next play and to blame him for Thackrays error is just plain stupid.

Totally agree, Thacks shouldn't of been thinking about a stupid offload.

Well he's certainly been nothing special for us this year. If this season was the first time you'd seen him, you would call him an average player.

You have a point, but to call such a world class player average is crazy. Berrigans still carrying an injury isn't he? Also as I said earlier, the players around him arn't giving him anything to work with imo ie just standing there waiting for the ball to be passed to them instead of recieving it while moving up.
Berrigan also seems to do alot of tackling which isn't a bad thing obviously as he's a very very good defender. But surely after all this must affect his attacking side of his game, been knackered and all...

Berrigan was already setting himself for the next PTB.

As for his overall play, put him in leeds, saints, shudds or even teh dobbins side where he has willing runners around him and other players taking some of the burden and he'd be awesome. Problem in the Hull side is he thinks twice as fast as everyone else. Lost count of the times he's looking around for players

He's an excellent player but has been below average this season and way below what he can be. You say it is because of the other players around him but I daresay he would see it as his responsibility to play to the top of his game.

What's he supposed to do though? From what I undesrtand his knee injury restricts his training, he has to have injections to get on the field, then when he does, he's expected to do everything. I think if he was in the saints side, with lots of options around him he'd look a hell of a lot better

If his injury is that restrictive, which would explain his performances this year, then he should be having the operation he was talking about in the HDM now. Chris Thorman would look better in the Saints side because their players are all better than ours. Totally agree with you there.

The problem i have with this is that he was injured for last season but kept playing i thought he had a shoulder op in the close so was now fit and well if he is crock again is this another bad signing.

I was lead to believe we were getting someone who could take over Swain, we have gotten nothing like. He was supposed to be the worlds best hooker, sorry to say this but Houghton has changed more games then him.

He does not lead or direct play,and yes if we had better players than he would look better but he is getting paid a good crack and should be showing more. If he is injured don,t play him, we have a good replacement,who goes forward.

The problem is Agar, the players (proven SL players, many internationals)look completely lost. They start every game the same, with no idea whatsoever, a decent coach quick.

I'm sure he'd have had the operation if the rest of the team were playing to their potential, but it's probably a measure of the man that he feels he needs to keep playing through it. Also played whilst needing an op last season.

And thorman would still look like a turd playing for saints, in fact he'd be about 10 yards behind play most of the time

Sorry , Berrigan is living on his reputation from Oz. He isn't giving us value for money and hasn't done since he came. For those that see something else it's just a case of "the emperors new clothes". When he first arrived he said something along the lines of , I'm the sort of player who doesn't say much I just turn up play my game and go home. Well if that was known before we signed him then it was a big mistake. Certainly in a better team he would be better because it would be easier but lets face so would most players. He's been slow and ponderous and looks so disinterested it's untrue. What we need from a marquee player that takes up so much cap is a leader on and off the field that does open his mouth and doesn't look like it's all too much trouble especially as we have three other hookers in the squad and we could find no end of average , solid , good defensive hookers in this country at a fraction of his money. If he's injured he could still be influential drawing on that vast experience and ability or at least try to be , demonstrating his committment to the fans wouldn't do any harm either. If he doesn't like Agar and his tactics ( I sympathise there ) tough , he's a professional player and should get on with what needs to be done or if it's that bad , go. His reputation set a high standard of expectation with reward to match. He hasn't delivered , it's about time he did.
He isn't of course on his own.

Not a bad post there.
I would simply say, if injured then go get sorted. We actually don;t need him now but will next season. Go rest

If Berrigan is injured then he should go and get sorted now, this season is completely fooked up (again) so lets at leats have him right for next season.

And if he is just injury prone and carrying knocks that will keep re-occuring do we pay him off? Weve carried him for 2 years and they have been 2 of our worst seasons of rugby of late. Coincidence?

A tad unfair to suggest that we 'carried' him last season TBH. At least he managed to be on the pitch more often than not, and generally performed well. Even if fully fit he wouldn't have been able to shine given our general injury situation. We were playing him all over the pitch, sometimes in multiple positions during a single game.

This season he's been disappointing. He's had a long run at his supposed favourite position and has failed to impress in anything other than small patches. If he's currently injured and needs an operation he should go and get one now, not faff about. If his prognosis doesn't indicate a complete recovery in time for next season then we should seriously consider whether his salary could be better spent elsewhere.

Thats unfair...he carried us last season on the back of being played here,there and every where.......we carried Dykes,Radford and a few others last season................Berrigan hasnt hit the heights i expected him to tbh but he is a class act and should come good.

We are carrying Berrigan this year, whats the difference.

For me at least when Dykes was on the pitch you actually saw the class, it stood out like a sore thumb, Berrigan's class does not stick out like a sore thumb. Nor can we use the average players around him argument as Dykes played with those average players yet his class still shone.