From watching back I still think it's vague to sust the high shots were anything more than careless?

Behave. 1 or 2 in a 10 minute spell is careless, 5 or 6 is dubious - 9 or 10 is blatant.

Not at all, trying not to jump to any conclusion if anything!
The fact was missing from DBs summary as were the fact that Widnes players tweeted in a non complimentary manner re the pitch.
I said it before I'll reiterate it again, nothing will become an issue until its a big club that complains, and IF these comments persist the weight of evidence will stack up.
At the moment it's only Wakefield, but stage management of the situation goes so far, it could get much more difficult.
For me Widnes are in a lose lose with this pitch.
1) artificial surfaces have a bad rep from football
2) any injury WILL be scrutinised because of the surface
3) any losing team has a ready made excuse
4) knowing how we love a good cover up story in RL any attempt to air brush history will be looked on suspiciously.
Without question it's a bold decision from Widnes and I can see all the all year round benefits for the club the business and the community.
However all the points above and the bigger question of is it fit for purpose for RL are huge obstacles.
Football and NFL have both tried these surfaces with problems, one has little physical contact the other plenty but players are kitted out in a way we would never want to see our RL players kitted out.
There are IMO vastly worrying questions, and ok we may be being a bit too fidgety after one game, I concede that.
If they persist it becomes less fidgety and more finger pointery.
So if you think I was digging I concede I probably was, just not in the way you think I was.
Widnes are allowed their point of view, but that's only one out of fourteen SL clubs and thousands of individual supporters who care about the game equally.

Now your just making numbers up. At one stage yes there were 3 in a row but that was mentioned by the officials and Cross (as acting Captain too) was called over and warned.

yawn........the scoreline wasn't even close IRRELEVANT.
Wanted Widnes to win (family reasons) but Betts is an arrogant black/white (not blue) tit.

What are you banging on about?

You do make some good points and a lot of Widnes fans were in no doubt the pitch would come into question over any incident that happened. I just think here once pics from Salford game and also Chev Walker from the Hull friendly the other week came out people thought that would be that, but it seem's to be ongoing.

I said at the start of it continues to be an issue then it will be addressed but when you have players who haven't even played on it (Carvell) saying it will be ripped up by the end of the year, it's just ridiculous and tbh a wee bit backwards from him considering the huge benefits of the pitch it should really be given the benefit of the doubt and not the opposite, though we'd all be foolish enough to believe that would be the case.

If your players are 'careless' enough to dish out the number of high shots they were punished for, then Betts has some serious work to do around tackle technique.

Which he eluded to in his post game interview if you'd care to take the whole thing in! Neither he nor fans have said we were wrongly penalised.

Quite simply - your 'banging on' about the referee is irrelevant due to the scoreline not being close at all.

A neutral POV and all that (in fact he wasn't that neutral as he wanted Widnes to win!!)

Rather absurd comment that does not deserve an answer.

A wise decision to make a dignified exit from a thread in which you have, in the modern parlance, been completely owned. An 'epic fail' if you will.

In an ideal world then you're probably right but like in any other sport this is never going to happen. Every team will do it's utmost to gain any advantage it can and if you/your team can't live with that then you're going to find yourself sadly disappointed most weeks.

If you don't play smarter than you did against Wakey you will be rooted to the foot of the table without doubt. Wait till you play teams that really do push refs to the limit and then you'll see what I mean.

As for the passing of sportsmanship to be replaced by an attitude of "do whatever you can to gain a competitive advantage" then you probably need to stop watching any form of professional sport, it happens in almost every one these days, and Rugby League is no different.

and the Aussie influence. The "ruck" terminology was also brought to the UK by Aussie coaches. I am all for British coaches getting more SL clubs to coach and the RFL should do something to encourage that.

I don't have time for a post match lie down as I have 90 miles to drive home

to watch Rugby League. The skills of David Topliss were often negated by spoiling play, but his style of play was a pleasure to watch.

Well at least that gives you plenty of time to contemplate how you've been beaten again but have played to the rules!

He was posting yawn about a discussion with nothing to do with his side but just because he dislikes Betts



If you think I'm blaming the refs then you clearly haven't read any of my posts... I haven't eveb mentioned the video ref calls

We dont mind Leythers posting on here


Anyway, as has been alluded to previously wait til' you play Hudds this weekend.

You will go into meltdown!

Haha, no doubt! Have always saud players should push refs limits on holding down and it's something that gas annoyed me with Widnes for years and eveb when playing annoys me when others just jump / roll off!

Only if the reg isn't shouting to move first can it become difficult.

Whats Reg got to do with this?

Does he dislike Betts too?

I didn't say I 'abhor' the wrestle technique or the Aussie influence, I just pointed out the existence of both - 'I'm not a fan of' is not the same as 'I abhor.'

The Aussie influence can actually be very positive - I thought Warrington and Saints played some sublime rugby last season and for me, Tony Smith is the best coach in SL by a country mile; what I do abhor however, is the snarling, mean-spirited, win at all costs mentality that Michael Maguire brought from Melbourne to Wigan - good riddance to him.

As for 'the ruck' - I got you with that one; probably best to just apologise and move on.

Probably, not many people do

True!

The ruck is an Australian innovative term first used by Stevo, who is a Yorkshireman, and therefore a barnpot.

And to quote John Wayne "Never apologise, Mister, sign of weakness."

I don't want to come over all VT on your ass, but if it's an Aussie term, how was it first used by Stevo? I don't doubt for a minute that the Aussies may well have started referring to the area around the tackle as 'the ruck' but to end the argument, let me quote you from the glossary of RL terms on the RFL website:



Secondly, it's 'barmpot,' not 'barnpot.'