GRaham and Hall now this is getting daft.

Now this is getting daft.

for me the one i always think was over rated was denis betts, played in one of the best rugby sides ever, did sod all for england and got hugely found out in the nrl.

and weirdly martin offiah, i think id have got 30 tries a season outside darren wright and gene miles and from his website....

had great hands and an eye for a try, often making interceptions then racing the length of the field to score. I received criticism over my defensive game, but such was the dominance of the Wigan during this period, that I was rarely required to defend.

when he went london he was pants and.... david jones had him for toast at bv!

Never really got Sonny Nickle myself.

Eh?

I think Hall is outstanding, power, pace, elusiveness & always in the right bloody place. Good looks to boot. Reminds me of Darren Albert and the posibility that he could play in the forwards at the back end of his career.

Yes I would take Dave Jones any day over chariots famous for one tackle on chariots against Widnes and nothing else.

betts did not struggle in the Nrl Andy Platt did at first but both got rave reviews. Read the iceman by John Monie good section on how they went in the ARL.

Martin offiah is without doubt the finest winger I have seen in my memory which is from about 1985. Yes he had his flaws nut he more than made up for them with other aspects of his game.

I cannot think of 1 Australian international centre that does not or did not have the ability to create something out of nothing. Senior at that level is as 1 dimensional as it gets.

some very good players on here got a mention for no reason

Terry Hill and Chris Johns, both were no more than straight up and downers, solid, dependable and nothing more.

Just like Senior. Add phil bailey as well but non made the shirt their own. The fact that a player like jamie Lyon cannot get a state shirt speaks volumes about the quality of Senior in real terms.

Hickey.

Agreed and Richard Owen, I know he's been unlucky with injuries but sky have been talking him up as an international for about three years and I think he's gash!
He made more mistakes than Morton in the cup game and we've had Morton done to pieces, unfairly I might add!!!!

Agreed. 6 months to get fit and no where near.

When I saw him I thought we'd signed Dave Hadfield the RL journalist.

Yer right there squire, Danny McGuire, Paul Wellens, I'm glad we never had the likes of those two at Wakey

My mate text me to say that radio Leeds were comparing him to Mark Tookey.

You can't come on here saying that in the land where Matt Blaymire is king!

You are correct though, the role of a fullback is every bit as much about attack as defence these days. The fact that we haven't scored a try from fullback against superleague opposition all season speaks volumes.

I think big gay Earl called him Tookey by mistake that's all. Tbh I enjoyed listening to Earl's co-commentary. Get him on the beeb instead of "Rob Burrow was like a supercar going into turbocharged."

Have to laugh, your resentment of any player who gains the remotest acclaim who didn't come through Wigan is barely hidden. Also as ever you miss the point.

Senior is the best British centre along with Gleeson of the last 15 years IMO.

Sadly he wouldn't make the top 20 in Australia.

I don't like the man and I accept he has a fairly straight game.

However neither of the above are his fault, he isn't to blame for the lack of SL centres is he. Further to that he's the only British centre I can think of who probably could have made a career in the NRL.

Had he changed nationality and the 5 or 6 centre ahead of him been killed in a freak accident. He would IMO ripped any British team to bits had he gained selection to the Kangaroos. This is because he's big enough, fast enough and smart enough to take most of the many chances he would get. The amount of chances no British centre has received since the days of Neil Fox.

It's not a case of how good Senior is or was, it's the sad fact that he is one of the few to even get close and considering the limitations of all the GB teams in the last 15 years that takes some doing.

HTH

Not sure where I miss the point you just back it up.

No body is saying it is his fault, just that he does not live with the best around, again something you acknowledge.

Physically like just about every other British SL player he is was and always has been light years behind the Aussies,

I would have loved to have him at Wigan he is an excellent domestic player, but in the International arena he has been nothing short of average.

All those big strong pace clever etc traits you mention are nothing compared to what the Aussies have had to offer. The players that get nowhere near rep shirts are still far superior to him.

Being around for 15 years and offering very little to shout about in all those years regards International performances highlights the above.

What him or anyone not playing for Wigan has nothing to do with it, I have listed several Wigan players that I do not get or never have. I think the Wigan bias in more your problem than mine old love.

I will add another McIllorum about to make his rep début, no ruck skills, no kicking game not especially fast good defence, Wigan struggle to score every time he is on the field. Compared to Riddell who was a true master at the ruck for leading his team round the park offers very little.

That's my point, had he gone to the NRL he probably would have been just about physically up to being an average NRL centre - he and Gleeson are the only two I can think of who could have done this. I think they would both have attained average.

However I believe these two to be so much better than the rest in SL that even as they are had they been in a line up of similar quality the the Aussies they would have performed pretty well at international level.

I think it s very hard, unfair and unwise to judge any British back of recent times to harshly. Virtually every game Senior has played in was lost in the forwards and the halves in the first 10 minutes so what chance any centre who needs to feed off possesion and tiring defences. I'd love to know how good some Aussie centres would look in that position - not great I suspect. It's easy to look good playing for Australia IMO.

A very good winger for his time, but just out of interest, how do you think he would do in todays game as im not convinced he would be a success???

Everyone remembers Offiah for the blistering long range tries he scored but there was so much more to him than that.

He often scored one yarders after supporting breaks made in every area of the pitch, he scored tries up the middle and even on the opposite flank.

As he got older he became a much more physical challenge than his MK1 version, standing 6'2" and weighing around 15st he was often harder to stop than most remember, he even ran over the top of Mal Meninga and then Rod Wishart on his way to scoring for GB in a Test Vs Australia.

Despite his reputation for being a bit soft he scored many tries where he knew going low and hard for the line would involve taking a clattering and getting hurt.

I wish we had him now!

Not in this team, he would only get the ball once a fortnight.