to be fair it's not what i think. however after a fortnight i cannot imagine going back to pcs. i have a very high spec windows 7 laptop at work, which is only a year old. it was twice the price of the base level mac that i have bought and is about as reliable as an adam hughes kick off.

i think the brainwashing with macs takes care of itself. i have been stunned at the speed and ability of the mac to deal with multiple programs being running, and how it deals with photo/video editing.

i wouldn't buy an i-phone though. complete fashion accessory.

Not got a Mac - don't need a Mac - won't ever be getting a Mac.

I know Vastman gets a cut from every sale and he swears by them - as do most users to be fair - but I cannot bring myself to buy into the 'cult' that is Apple - something just goes against the grain to be so restricted, it's like going to Asda knowing that you can only ever go to Asda after that!

But because of the restrictions, you know everything you get for a Mac will work like it's supposed to

What I have works fine - thanks!

OK as it's you, one more last word. What you say is fair enough, although it's not that long ago there was a cult of Bill Gates and Microsoft.

I agree that stuff like the iphone, ipod etc though beautifully designed and good pieces of kit are over priced and fashion accesorries but then you have a choice of other very similar products if you're not a fashion victim.

The Mac v PC debate is a separate issue IMHO. These two products are polar opposites. One offers people who have the time and inclination a very open and expandable product. The other offers those (the majority IMO) a product that more or less does most of it for you straight from the box. The biggest problem in not which is best. The problem is that many people want Mac useability at PC prices and that simply won't happen. What annoys me is not PC's though I'd never ever have one. It's PC users who try to make out that the ordinary user get as much from a £500 PC as a £1000 mac - they don't - it's a massive lie peddled mainly because they simply can't afford one and that at the moment includes me.

You get what you pay for. Pay £500 for a PC and expect a painful lesson in computer usage which with luck and perserverance you will learn. Buy a Mac and expect a relatively easy and trouble free life with certain restriction that would only bother a very small number of people. That easy life is what you pay your extra money for. Until you have operated both you can't really get just how different the user experience really is. Sandcat called OSX polished and that just about sums it up.

That said my Corsa gets me to work in the same time as my much posher higher spec other car - so where there is a will there is a way (even for PC's

)

Having argued my point - I am starting a new job next Thursday and it looks like the company use iphones - so I'm just gonna have to swallow hard and accept it!

I have an iphone through work, it's fine - not saying it's better than the rest. One things for sure you won't lose it they weighs a ton!

I've not used an apple computer since 1983 when us swotty kids were allowed to play with THE school computer.
I find myself spending too much time plugging holes in pc dykes, both mine and other people's. Perhaps I should consider conversion mac.
I know nothing about them, but I send and receive a lot of data using office software (word, excel, powerpointless and access); is a mac compatable with opening such files?

bad news here too. we're getting them too

When we get the roof over the terracing you won't need one

Thats the advice i give the present Mrs KC!!!!!

I set 'em up - you knock 'em down!

Yep you can get Microsoft Office Mac version. I think the latest version is 2011 it's about £60. Don't know about access but it includes Word, Excel and Powerpoint. Once open runs pretty much the same as on a PC. You can also partition your drive and run Windows if you wish - never done it but as far as I'm aware they can run together and you just swap screens with a key command.

Partition is OK but you then have the problems on your machine as its effectivly a PC and prone to all the same problems.

I have the 2011 office for Mac and other than the very rare odd issue with fonts between that and my work PC there is no noticable difference

If truetype fonts then that's another thing you can thank apple for, along with having the 1st modern computer system with a mouse

One of the cheaper Mac options is to buy one of the Mac Minis, which is basically a Mac without the screen or disc drive, so it is a small box that will be silent and reliable. About £500. You just plug in your old monitor and keyboard.

Office doesn't include Access on the Mac.

I use Word a lot, and I did have a couple of crashes, which I never had on the Microsoft version.

They are both made by Microsoft

but yep I think it's fair to say that the PC version which is the main market is probably more refined than the Mac version. Look for upgrades and patches. Think the Mac version is a year behind as a rule.

Open Office which is a freeware version of Office for the Mac is very good indeed it handles Word, Powerpoint and Excel docs. It's an easy free download.

Think I'll start saving my pennies.

Didn't Steve Jobs nick that idea from the brains trust at Xerox?

If you go way back to the corporate 1960's and early 70's the driving forces in computing were Xerox and IBM so probably yes.

Steve Jobs didn't invent anything as far as I know. What he did was simplify it, make it work properly and re-package it. Which in itself is a massive talent, if PC'S/Macs had been left to computer boffins they would be the size of houses, cost the GNP of Belgium and be powered by Kryptonite.

I've since found the info - Xerox did indeed invent the mouse; details [url=http://www.zurb.com/article/801/steve-jobs-and-xerox-the-truth-about-innohere.[/url

I didnt say apple invented the mouse did I?

I didn't say you did - just something I remembered from the a recent documentary about Jobs.

Apple should really be congratulated for making a complete product. I mean, no one says that Samsung make rubbish televisions because you can't replace the valves with different ones (or whatever).

What do you reckon the working life of the hardware is?
I may have the chance to buy 2nd hand from the company that the wife works for. We've had pcs for about the last 20 years, and have replaced them every 7 years or so. Since she got a mac from work, she's been a complete pain... disassociated herself entirely from what used to be [iour[/i, but is now [imy[/i pc, except when she needs to use software she doesn't have installed on the mac. Then she bitches for ages about how slow the thing is. I have nothing against macs, but I'm developing something against mac users (or one user in particular)...

Our/my pc needs replacing... struggles to boot, sounds like an aircraft before take-off, and has so many work-arounds that one day soon, it'll give up the ghost. I won't admit it to her, but I can't deny the facts. If I buy a mac that's, say, 4 years old, how many years' use do you reckon I could get out of it? (I only need it for basic stuff, btw - word processing, spreadsheets, and internet.)