Fair enough...why off to Featherstone though? Crazy decision for me. Some spat? Fergie knew how to get the good bad boys onside...a good coach should know how in my opinion. I just don't know where I am with Agar. I felt converted by the end of the year. We have been nearly back to square one fo most of this season. Catalans looked like the push on...tonight, though full of effort in defence,was pretty dismal. We never looked like winning. Yes Hull's defence was 1st class but our lack of adaptation and willingness to 'go for it' and chance our arm in the last 30 mins was dismally disappointing.

does anyone actually know and will post anything that's gone on between agar and frankie to end him up at fev?

Yes...I think a light squad does make life hard for a coach, you are right. And I think the point about match fitness applies to proven SL players but Lyne just does not look robust enough to me to play centre in SL. I don't think injuries or confidence is the issue; I just don't think he quite has it. As I said earlier, Paul White: lightning fast, pretty skillful, but small and you need the pace, skill and the beef in most positions these days sadly.

Here we go FWIW I dont think Mariano has taken his chances this season again I think he had some knocks but I havent seen anything from him that warrants a place in the team based on his performance, if there is an issue between him and the coaching staff then the coaching staff will see the decision to loan him out ats the right move.

Mellars looks to be getting up to speed and has utility value, Malloy is just coming back from injury and it looks to me that he is gaining full match fitness on a week to week basis recovering from his long term injury too early to say how he will go for me.

Guess if we are getting up to Mellars speed it explains why we were so slow, totally agree about mariano v Mellars . Last night we never managed to create any meaningful gaps in the hull defEnce. There forward s totally outplayed ours. Men v boys spring to mind.
Re Mellars we are stuck with him and nobody else wants him. What I don't understand is we are paying a part of marianos salary . Then we sign Molloy and Lynne total additional outgoing 70 k whilst we have trout walshaw and cowling out on loan

When you go to hull it shows you part of Wakefield areas long term recruitment problems , whiting briscoe westerman arundel Pitts lynch all local lads

Makes me laugh.

We complain that Agar didn't try to improve Mariano's game but complain when he tries to stick with Lyne and improve him.
Personally I think Lyne has lost it bit he has shown his skills earlier in the season so worth working with.
Mariano has gone. He wasn't the saviour and certainly wouldn't have won that game for us.

I don't understand the need to bag players and coach all the time.
We haven't become a bad team over night. We were good last week. We still have flaws. Hull were better than us.
I'm pretty sure Agar didn't plan it that way.

He tried something with Lyne. If he'd put Mellars there wed be complaining he is a slow overseas player.

I like what Agar is doing. It's just not an overnight thing. We are going to have some losses.

dont know why folk on here are suprised by lynns performances,we were told on here by a few hull supporters at the time of his signing that as soon as he got any where near the first team he showed his soft side. i agree some of his early performances were ok, but that was against average opposition and he had ali inside him creating gaps , ive seen plenty of near best in the country 16 year olds vanish when they meet the big boys this could be another

You are only allowed to praise players when they play well.

Most of the fans I spoke to last night during and after the game thought RL showed very little interest last night.

That's simply not good enough and its not the first time.

Not a fan of certain other players but while ever they put the effort in I won't bag them.

Isn't it worth recalling Cowling and giving him a run in first team and sending Lynne to Doncaster to get some confidence and form?

I don't think it's that simple, but I understand where you are coming from.
The guy did look a bit lost last night and was very timid going forward.

Could be a very long stint at Donny for the lad he's on a three year contract

You are a plonker!!!

Does anyone actually know for fact that Agar has fallen out with Mariano or are we just assuming it because otherwise it would be insane to loan him to Fev considering what we have?

I've bagged Mellars a lot in the past, but last night he did nothing wrong and was one of the better players out of a bad bunch. His attitude in defence in particular, he doesnt offer much in attack, bar his size out wide.

Molloy I have seen nothing to convince me SL standard.
The idea of having Mariano on loan to Fev is rediculous.

We played well Vs Catalan.. if Poore was out then why wasn't Mellars kept in the centres and Mariano brought into the 2nd row. We would have a much better chance imo.

Thats the problem Mellers is just ok every game hes OK! Eventually he may make a break zzzzzzzz. HES AVERAGE !!!! Cowling tackles Flannery and we won the game against St Helens thanks to that tackle I can't see Lynn doing that. Cowling has impressed me every time when hes played.

Are you trying to set a record for different spellings on Reece Lyne?

I said when he signed I didn't think he had what it takes to become a SL player, I came back after a few games to ask if he had proved me wrong, all said yes, but I still had my doubts.

I'm not sure why Agar is playing him at centre, he spent all of his time on the wing at Hull and didn't look big or strong enough for the wing.

As I've sad before he is a nice kid who was bigger and faster than everyone in the youth leagues, players have now caught up and overtaken him and he now is being found out.

To play him against one of the form centres in the league was a big mistake by agar, although I think Crooks would have made look a fool, so not sure your options could be?

I'll back him up since I know the kid. When he did peck at London it looked like season over, but 2nd look n scan reveled not as bad, but bad enough. Still hasn't been full weight training since,only just about there but has lost a good few kg.
Also though I'd say as a neutral who's seen quite a few of your games your left side service is at about 70% of what it earlier in the yr. Ali him n Benny were thriving on crisp early ball. Ali isn't getting that now, seems lot slower n having to make something out of half the space he had earlier in the yr, you're right is now getting the sharp service.
Think a few weeks out will help him greatly, he played 1sl game in 18month's including off season and already has about 10 this.
Remember form can return in sport as fast as it goes. Fox was struggling a matter of weeks ago and within a few more was 1of the form wingers of the comp.

Must agree. One time last night he caught the ball and looked like a rabbit caught in the headlights!

having questioned our signing of jon molloy and saying id not remembered seeing him at his roots at wigan and then at huddersfield i was hit by an huddersfield fan who said because of injury i wouldnt have seen him intheir u20s quickly supported by shifty cat who im sure was pleased to tell me thats why i wouldnt have seen him, well ive done some research played stand off for wigan against our u18s in the semi final when we won the title ,i repeat cant remember seeing him ,and what ive seen of him while here backs up every thing ive said previously cmon shifty really intrested to hear your opinion of a player whos played about 30 mins in 3 games.

cant believefolk are happy with mellars one of our biggest if not our biggest money earners doing ok, the guys 6ft 4 must be 17 stone cant break a tackle weve lads out on loan better while ever weve fans with that mindset the coach and board are on a winner cmon get me

I watched Frankie against Batley last week and looked ordinary in an average side on the day who were lucky to win thanks to some bad calls.You wouldn't have thought he was a SL player on his performance.As for Mellars I didn't go to the game, my son went and he said he was one of the better players for Wakey and I think he's a pretty good judge on all things rugby.He also said he wished he hadn't gone as well. !!!!!!!.

Mel lard has been solid and was far away from the worst on the field vs hull.

Give the guy a break, he's come back from a big injury and is playing pretty solid and while not breaking tackles every hit up is making pretty decent yards.

Mariano was sent on loan to Fev when there was also a rumour of an offer to go back to KR. Think it was the right decision to send him to Fev. Lets see what he is made of in the Championship. The above statement seems to point to a lack of personal motivation. I maybe jumping the gun, but a supposed proven Super League player should be a stand out performer, a bit like Cockayne was the other year for Fev. Also with regard to Mellars, he turned a loan move down, possibly to fight for his place. Got a bit of stick when he first came into side, but has been getting better. Not really done owt wrong or spectacular, has been part of a good team unit the past few weeks that was progressing.

There are a multitude of things going on in this thread - all of them come back to management / coaching issues.

I am ambivalent towards Agar. I think he has done some great work for the club, but I also think he has got many things wrong.

On the plus side:
Most of his signings have worked out.
He pulled a new side together last year and kept faith with them until it worked.
He is a thinker of the game.
He seems to enjoy respect from the players.
He is working with tight financial constraints

On the downside:
I'm not covinced in his motivational side (hence not being 100% for a cup-tie)
He seems to have his 'favourties'
We haven't started well this year - we are only 2 points ahead of this stage last year!
He hasn't brought the juniors through.
Not sure what is going on with the Mariano / Molloy thing at all (time will tell)

My biggest problem is this thing about management of players. We have seen several comments about players not having the right attitude, but in some of these cases I am not sure that we are managing them all that well.

The Walshaw issue is one that springs to mind. Have we seen the last of him? He is a big talented kid who has issues away from RL, but are they insurmountable? Can we not work out a solution so that he can manage his private life as well as becoming the RL player he should be>

What of Cowling? Apart from 3 early season games, Lyne has shown nothing to suggest that we didn't already have a player at at least the equivalent stage of development - one begging for an opportunity in the first team. Will he still be there when we need him?

What of Trout? He has seemingly gone backwards. Is that his making or ours? Have we put the faith in him for him to re-pay us?

An of course lastly, what of Annakin? Have we missed the boat by not having seen his potential (for of course no-one knew that he was a good player until this season - not!) and getting him signed on a longer contract BEFORE putting him in the shop window and leaving him open to sign for whoever he chooses?

In not one of these examples do I see (in my humble, naive, way) a single one where the development of the player, and therefore the strengthening of the squad, has been put above the priority of 'fitting them in when others are not available'. To be blunt, we have shown no faith in them - or rather Agar hasn't!

This is all exactly what we were told by the Hull fans, and follows a pattern started by JK (he is not the answer). It also runs completely the opposite to Shaun Wane - his attitude is that whoever he puts out (and there have been plenty of kids), he EXPECTS them to win.

Of course I will concede that I do not know the remit given, or priority placed, by the management, although I am led to believe that coaching is very much left to RA as AG's knowledge isn't great and JE is too busy with other matters.

The big concern in all this is that if we lose the above players, then we have little coming through the 19's at present and we may struggle to fulfil our 'home grown' quota. As it is now, only Woody is featuring regularly from that group of players!

I'm not banging any drums to get rid of RA, and I know some will be very defensive of him, but I find these issues very frustrating and find difficulty in understanding the long term plan in the way we are going about this.

In short - if RA signed them - they seem to play / if RA didn't sign them - they don't! Someone prove me wrong please!

Difficult to argue with a lot of this especially about players like Annakin, Cowling and Mariano. Should be anouncement Annakin resigned 3 year asap!

Think Agar has his favourites and Molloy signing was bizarre he hasn't pulled up trees despite Agar saying he was already in very good shape before needing match fitness. Washbrook needs to be rested for few weeks and other options looked at.

Still to be convinced that letting Ellis and Mariano go weren't mistakes. Still think no one out there available better than Agar but does his side kick Webster do enough? Whose the motivator? Frustrated when look at Huddersfield or Bradford as we should be where they are rugby wise with our history... We just can't take that next step into top 6 side, is it purely down to investment?