I posted the below comments in bold in April 2010 and I feel that having read the 30 odd pages on the stadium statement thread it is more relevant than ever.

All I ask is that people take off the spectacles of bias (hard for everyone, myself included) and look at the situation as it truly is. Neither club deserves any help from the council, whether it be financial loans or pushing through planning, that is not what they are there for.

Both BoD's have proved themselves incapable of progressing their club since the conception of SL. The buck stops with them in my opinion. They are the guardians of their respective club and they have failed. The need to regcognise this before both clubs are consigned to the scrap heap should not be under-estimated. History counts for nothing in SL, never has and never will.

There are a great number of passionate people involved with both clubs, but none more so than the fans. We know RL, we breath RL and we can dominate RL if we only learn to work together. Both clubs feel that the RFL and the rest of RL is against them....I agree. So lets do the un-expected and embrace their efforts to destroy us and unite. This is extremely hard for me to say and concede, but we had the chance years ago, but the timing was out; and we, the fans were wrong. I can hold my hand up now and see that.
The bigger picture is what is important and I don't want RL to wither and die in my/our district.

The RFL and it's dream of SL has created a false hatred between our fans, shown by the blinkered venom spouted by some on the various stadium threads. I enjoy the rivalry, experiencing my share more than most with the whole of my in-laws massive wakey fans, and I'll be sad to see that lost to a merger, but I'd rather that than one or both clubs to die. I'm not prepared to take the risk of losing either club...are you?
I certainly see no success in seeing another proud RL club die just so that one can survive until the RFL move the goalposts again and the "winner" dies to make way for another more fashionable club.



=#BF4080As soon as wakey announced the location of Newmarket Lane I warned both Cas and wakey fans that a merger would come and I still don't see anything to make me think it wont happen. As I have resigned myself to this I have mused over the prospect for quite a while and I think the majority of people, myself included, could follow a merged team under the following conditions:

1. No professional rugby league team henceforth to be allowed to have the following words incorporated into its name; Castleford Tigers and/or Wakefield Trinity Wildcats. The names must die with the merger; it's the only way it could work.

2. The newly merged team must play in completely neutral colours (no black, amber, red, white or blue) difficult though this may be. There aren't many left as I'm sure neither of us wants to play in blue (spit!)

3. The newly formed club must be named independently of the two places. Who says a team has to bear the name of a Town or a City? It has to be something completely synonomous with the area; the only thing I can think of that alienates no-one, but incorporates almost everyone is the moniker "Miners" or some other mining industry name. This, in my opinion, could appease some of the older heads too as well as allowing the heritage and identity of the whole area to blossom and engender a lost sense of pride and community which has otherwise been consigned to the rubbish tip by successive Tory and (more shamefully in my opinion) Labour governments. Apologies I digress!

If these three points were applied, more importantly point 1, then I, as gut wrenching as it would be, could support a merged team with the pride and passion with which I have followed Castleford Tigers.

You may have noticed that I have left Featherstone Rovers out of the equation, this is purely as the thread appears to me to be talking about Cas and wakey only. They could easily be placed into the equation I have outlined above with little or no problem should they choose to.

TWo teams, one stadium - absolutely yes. Merger, no way - never. Sorry!

First of all i should really move this into the main thread but out of respect i won't.

I'm afraid my answer to this bit is NO =#FF0000"support a merged team with the pride and passion "

I fully understand and agree with 99% of the post and it makes sense BUT the answers still NO, my passion is for TRINITY and i can't re-invent it for a merged side.

Not sure if its for me but its a well thought out balanced point of view althought I am not sure what sort of a response you will get on here, but reading posts from most Cas fans I think you will get a warmer reception on here with the Wakey fans than that of the Cas fans who seem totally against the idea.

Any such club would have to survive the initial abandonment from the hard core support until the next generation of supporters come through who don't have Trinity or Cas ingrained into their soul. That could take 5-10 years. Could any club survive that?

Simple fact for me is I will support Wakefield Trinity at a ground in Wakefield.

Nothing else will do for me. Ever.

I support Wakefield Trinity, because they represent the place I come from in the sport I love. And yes, [iwhere they play[/i is very much part of that. Sorry if that sounds too parochial for the modern day sports fan.

My thoughts exactly.

This area is WAKEFIELD.
You are a small part of that region. You don't see Ossett kicking up this sort of a fuss. Know your place.

So lets run with your premise of a team called simply "Miners".....Any merged team will inevitably end up with the name Wakefield attached as people will wonder "Where do those "Miners" come from?" to which the reply will be "Wakefield".

Teams need a geographical connection. Only the wandering Welsh go without and when they settle they will be rebranded to sell to the surrounding population.

J32 will only happen if we agree to share. Fact. Without us joining neither of us will get the finance. IF we ever moved a merger would inevitably happen. The name Cas would die. Be careful what you wish for.

As I continue to say. GH will happen regardless of whether you join us there. It will just be phased and would take longer to complete than it would both sides playing there.

Then why the U turn on wanting a ground share?

Could it be down to no (/very little) available funds?

Lets have a think...

Partners:
Waystones: Can't be putting very much capital into the construction as if they were building (even a phased build) would have started 3 years ago.

Surfworld: Well they haven't even filed for planning permission so any news is good news on that front.

Wakefield council: After years of Gaslight saying "We're not getting any hand outs..." RW confirms that GH HAS ALWAYS BEEN DEPENDENT ON COUNCIL FUNDING. And there is none.

Castleford Tigers: Loss making company, no sale on their current ground, value will have dropped dramatically since it was valued for outline planning permission at J32. Still unable to sell due to blast zone. Housing market still very hit and miss at the minute....

Fact is mate, unless we join and bring the "community" tag you will never fund it without our input, that of the council and the grants that we have secured to provide facilities for the WHOLE REGION, not those of a select few in a backwater eastern ward.

If you had funding it would have been up years ago...

And how do you know there aren't any other organisations? Just because they are part of the plans doesn't make them the major benefactors although obviously Cas will be.

RW Confirmed that it was always dependent on that piece of land (i.e. £2m).

There is no u-turn on the groundshare - in fact, we've always wanted a groundshare at GH - it's just Wakefield who've been trying to get everyone to goto Newmarket instead. As I've already mentioned, without Wakefield it would be phased i.e. bits built at a time; with Wakefield it would enable us to build the entire stadium.

I don't know even know what you're arguing. I've always maintained full funding isn't there - that's patently obvious.

PS. Why would Surfworld apply for planning permission when it is part of the stadium?

I thought one of the stands of the Stadium was incorporated into Surfworld. Surfworld will need to apply for planning consent unless Castleford are designing it as part of the Stadium.

Have Surfworld formally committed to Gh and signed contracts yet ?

Steady

Good post and I can see your logic.

However the name miners is CRAP !

Arent wakefield a loss making company too?

The rfl appluaded our finances last time as we have very little debt in comparison to most sl clubs, iirc our debt stands at 200k compared to hull kr who are 5 million in debt.

OK, take soccerball as an example. It's not part of my culture and heritage as I didn't have a hometown team. I have no real interest in it but if I did I could never support Leeds Utd because I'm not from Leeds, I'm from Wakefield.

As a kid I 'supported' Liverpool because they were the glory club of the era. I still have a soft spot for them and look out for their results but I've never been to a match. Likewise I look out for the Preston and Cardiff results as they are places I've lived, but I don't have any strong bond with these teams.

If Wakefield Trinity ceased to exist I would have no team to support and I would lose almost all interest in the sport. I'm more likely to support Hull or Saints than Cas or Leeds.

A merged team playing in cas would be a cas team.

I would prefer cas to survive as a SL club if it meant that we was forced to merge, afraid its do or die for me

Think we are heading back to "my imaginary stadium is better than yours" debate. Addressing the OP's points - I believe this is the beginning of the end for one or perhaps both clubs. In the medium term I belive the only way we can guarantee a SL presence in the region is via merger. Ideally, I'd love to be watching WTW in a new shiny stadium in NM. However, I am a realist and I think the chances of that are slim to none. I know many of you traditionalists who have no doubt invested much more in WTW than I have will balk at the idea of supporting a merged team, but surely love of the game comes first. If it was a choice between merged team or no RL or worse watching the Rhinos I would watch the merged team without hesitation. I think many others would make the same choice and it may even bring new fans in to the game. As KK said the risk is that both sets of supporters would walk away, but with some financial incentive from the RL the storm could be weathered. I think supporters need to start seeing the bigger picture here and park up their egos and pride (hard as that is). In my view the best chance of preserving SL rugby in the Wakefield District is via merger and if it worked with the combined strength of the new club (both financially and in terms of the players which come up in the area) we could actually be competing with the big boys rather than limping along and continually being at the mercy of the RFL.

I know this goes against many fans principles but to me it's the only way. Having said that with the mindsets of both BoDs and the majority of fans, in practice I don't think it would ever get the stakeholder support it would need, so I fear the worst. We can't even agree to share a stadium FFS. Should have got our heads together years ago, but I'm going off at a tangent....

Snowie, as usual you are spot on, except in my opinion its already dead!

One intresting point made to me by a chap in the legal profession actually said to me that our petition could be turned against us at some point as many did not know they were signing for an industrial development as well as a stadium!

its all crap and i feel let down...badly!

My love of the game means i wouldnt stop watching rl, but it would be lock lane, a team that i care about and have pride and passion towards (incidently the only team i have ever supported against cas) i wouldnt have any loyalty or pride towards a merged club, in fact if i'm being honest i would have a hatred towards any merged club as it would be what killed off the club i love.

Steadgetyerbootson - Good post and I wholeheartedly agree with you. A strong merged team with no senior partner is the ony viable way forward to enable us to to compete with the big boys.

For godssake forget the tribal loyalties and lets start competing with the likes of Wigan, Saints, Leeds etc - we certainly aint going to do it as two struggling entities.

(from a Wakey supporter of almost 50 years)

I'm not involved with the club so I don't know the details. But Surfworld is part of the stadium and I would assume would be built into one stand, yes.

We'll just have to see when designs come out in three weeks.

with you there mate, id go watch dewsbury or batley.

Would it really though after all these years of chairman, who at times have held both clubs together but have also held them back. It seems to me we CAS and WAKEY have failed to move with the times for whatever reason and someone will now pay the price, lets be fair its not long till next franchise applications and we are scurring about at the last minute looking for a bolt hole.

Just who's fault is it i ask.

in order
1. the 2 clubs for believing they were big enough and strong enough financialy to justify 2 new stadiums.
2. frankly all the rest of us for letting them carry on with this folly and blindly believing it was viable without WMDC
3. SL for the criteria in the first place
4. Danny Brough, because everything is his fault