Jurgen Klinsman certainly seemed to think it would be an exciting game, maybe he sees something in the way the teams have/will set up that we haven't, i just can't see it myself.

Italy are famed for their pragmatic disciplined approach, although they are transitioning to a more attacking style as the serie A has shown.

England under hodgson have set up much the same way.

Italy to win in extra time for me.

Like others have said its likely to be cagey.

Well at least Ashley Cole consolidated his image with regard to the rest of the country.

Looks like Ashley Young has been struck down with the Lucozade endorsement curse like John Barnes was....

Best team by a mile have gone through.

Disappointing but not entirely unexpected. On the plus side it was good experience for some of the newer faces and despite being a way off our best we still could have made the semi-finals. Rooney's absence from the first two games probably disrupted things for him a bit which is a shame (self-induced I know but still a shame).

Thought Roy of the Rovers, Hart, Johnson, Parker and Lescott were our best overall.

Fair result. Outplayed and outclassed.

England started quite well and shown the type of tempo needed to put the Italians under pressure. They clearly couldn't keep it up and resorted to dropping deep and trying to close down the space that Balotelli nearly thrived in on a few occasions.

Poor/average performance, I didn't think England would win but I'm surprised they managed to stay in the game for so long. As I said in all the other games, England's lack of ability/will to play and play some sort of attacking football was frustrating to watch. A bit more precision/composure/quality and there were chances to exploit Italy, but England were exposed as the game went on and invited too much pressure.

Penalties are decided by the flip of a coin, can't really knock them for going out to penalties but the match itself was disappointing.

Completely unacceptable tonight I thought. Going for the draw and penalties is stupid when you know you are not mentally strong enough to win a shootout.

Milner again spends far too long on the field and didn't do anything positive at all, not one thing. I would love to see the stats on him. Pass completion was nearly zero, never beat a man, didn't make a tackle. He's the worst player in the Euros by a distance, technically awful, tactically awful. He spent his entire game jogging around between Italian passes as if it were a training session. He contributes nothing. This myth that he protects Johnson is ridiculous, he puts him under so much more pressure.

We have banged on about it on here so much before but it's still true, we're so awful technically that we'll never compete. We can't pass the ball, we can't keep the ball. Parker is terrible in that sense, for all the huff and puff, he's still a poor man's Lee Carsley.

But after being dominated for 120 minutes and being thankful that Balotelli is terribly wasteful, it comes down to two moments. Rooney's overhead kick, which he executed terribly, and Young's penalty. If he wasn't thinking of Pizza Hut adverts when he hit that then he needs to call it a day. It's not acceptable to fail to test the keeper from that distance. In penalties if the keeper goes the right way, fine, but at least make him do that.

Plenty to change ahead of the WC. Terry has to go, Cole as well, lauded as the best left back in the world, but did absolutely nothing in an attacking sense, as ever. Parker, Gerrard, Milner and Young must surely have played their last games for England. The future doesn't exactly look bright though when the likes of Henderson seem to be the next in line.

It is not 'a lottery'. It is a contest of who is best at penalties.

England were an embarrassment and thank fook they are out and we are spared the humiliation by the Jawmans.
Once again there was no plan when it came to penalties. i knew Young was going to miss before he took his penalty, because he's a maverick.
If I were England manager, which I am not or never will be, I would say to my goalkeeper ... ''pretend to dive, but don't dive, two of the five will come straight to you''
It does my head in that they dive out of the way of the ball even if it is straight down the middle!

Hart was clearly nervous and had researched which way they were going to go. Seeing how quickly he was committing to it, Italy just added a stutter to their run, which made it very easy. Cole did the same, but then chose the same side Buffon had dove into, the genius.

First of all, Milner may not be the most talented international winger in the world, and there are probably other options. At least Milner is always showing for the ball, something which cannot be said of most of the England players after the first 15 minutes. How the hell we expect to win a 1/4 final when our midfield has no interest in making themselves available for a pass, I do not know. We back our own players into a corner because the have no options, and then said player ends up giving the ball away.

Say what you like about Terry, he's been immense this tournament, and had he been German people would have been raving about him. I don't want to choose individuals, because the whole mentality of the team was so negatibve and scared to even receive possession it became a bit embarrasing. Wilshere is a must if he can get fit, someone with the bottle to take the ball to feet, use it and then go looking for it again. Carroll enhanced his rep. big time tonight IMO, Lescott looks good in there. Parker had a great first half an hour, but faded out due to our inability to keep the ball. Ditto Gerrard, he spent the majority of the game chaing Montilvio around, tired and then couldn't get on the ball. You MUST be able to retain possession of the football.

Sorry for the rant but the inability of that set of players to do the fundamentals of football and make themselves available to pass to is infuriating.

England will always struggle against teams like Italy because they simply don't have the quality or patience to beat them. We've done well in some ways and hopefully we can build on the organisation and heart we've shown and add some reall class to the team. Parker will run his blood to water every time but you need more from your midfielders, with hindsight the decsion to try and get Paul Scholes out of retirement wasn't a bad one. Hopefully Jack Wilshire can stay fit because if you does we should be trying to build a team around him. Not sure who else is coming through who can partner him in midfield though.

I thought Hodgson made his first poor substitution when he took Welbeck off instead of Young, who frankly is complete gash. He's meant to have pace but he never beats a man, has no left foot and gives the ball away as much as anyone I've ever seen for England. Adam Johnson should be given a go.

A flip of the coin that england keep losing again and again?

England just can't handle the pressure of penalties. That's what it comes down to. We always have 2 or 3 players that can do it, but always a few who fluff the penalties, if you only score 2 or 3 the likelehood is you will lose. That's what happened to england.

Young's penalty was fine, he just had to hit the target. Cole's was a little too tame and not far enough in the croner (see balotelli's for a pretty tame, but unsaveable penalty)

England deserved to lose, it would have been a travesty if they had gone though over the italy the way the game panned out.

But where england is concerned, let's not kid ourselves that penalties is a lottery for us, (a lottery we keep losing). We are just too weak mentally when it comes to penalties.

I don't think theres a nation with a worse record.

It takes mental strength to do that though. It's easier just to have it in your head you're going right (or left, whichever), running up hitting it hard in that direction and hoping for the best.

Holland?

I soon has I heard Woy say about penalties ... ''we will cross that bridge when we come to it.'' I knew we were doomed.
Similarly England managers of the past who have said ... ''you can't practice penalties.''
Fooking losers!
Be prepared.
Why wasn't Gerrard an early penalty taker?

My mind goes back to Batty.
And as he squared up to take a penalty for England the commentator said something to the effect that ''this was the first penalty he had ever taken.''
Mental!
And all because at the time he said to the boss ''I am up for taking one!''
There should be a plan!

what's their record?

Tulips from Amsterdam.

he was our first penalty taker



You can practice penalties as much as you want but it still doesn't prevent you from fluffing it when your physically and mentally battered after 120 minutes and you lose your nerve.

That's what people mean when they say ''you can't practice penalties''. It's not that they don't take them in training, it's that you can't re-create that situation and moment.

England's problems are far deeper than the mental pressure in penalties. As Rory Smith has just said on Twitter, people accept pride and determination as qualities that make a side good. They should be a given, they should turn up to every game like you turn up in your kit. As I said after the France game, England never tried to play football and I thought it was poor. I was told it was the type of performance we've been waiting decades for, but it was another papering over the cracks, an attempt to hide the obvious inabilities of a squad largely lacking in crucial areas. England will keep Roy until the next world cup (assuming they qualify) and will expect more of the same, whilst a national side like Germany will reap the rewards from investing in a great manager and a great youth set up.

Why do so many other nations get it right yet we can't? Do people really believe it's psychological? Is it educational? Is the training wrong? Are we oblivious to some magic form of training? Why can't English managers come up with anything remotely decent in terms of tactics and personnel? Jogi Low dropped his first choice attacking three in Germany's biggest game where they'd be facing a defensive wall, yet they came out, determined, settled and played with a tempo and consistency England could only dream of. People think that things will change once Roy gets time but they're kidding themselves. It never changed at Liverpool, it never changed at Fulham or West Brom. He plays one way and England played that way throughout the tournament. It's not Roy's fault, but the FA have to do something different, it's time to think outside of the box and change, instead of hoping one man can come in and change it all.

Well f*ck me, get this man on the phone to roy hodgson.

Did you hear that people, he said there should be a plan!

They practice in training, they have an order, top 5 go.

Take ashley young for example, probably smashes them in the top corner everytime.

Steps up in the shootout, smashes it down the middle and hits the crossbar.

Pressure.

you.
can't.
practice.
penalties.

I think we should a chance if Rooney lived up to this billing he's got of world class but yet again in big games for club & country he's done little. We needed him to drop short and help keep possession but he was as guilty as anyone for letting the ball go, and people keep defending him out of this belief that he'll come good for us one day and slate the easier targets of Milner and Young (who didn't play well but aren't in Rooney 'class'). They said he lacked match practise because he missed the first 2 games yet we are usually complaining players look too knackered from too many games, he should of been fresh from the extra rest. Apart from Euro 2004, Rooney has disappointed in an England shirt mostly and even at Man Utd he might batter the likes of Bolton and Wigan but how many times has he dominated a game against the bigger teams, especially in the Champs League. In 3 Finals, 2008 vs Chelsea and in '09 & '11 against Barcelona he did nothing. If their is anyone i'd like to see the end of after this tournament then its Rooney, the Flat Track Bully of football.

I must have fallen to sleep!
He scored though didn't he?
I appreciate you can get pressurised into missing penalties, but you have to practice them and moreover you have to have a 1 to 5 etc list for taking them. You also have to do your homework on the opposing goalie. You also have to do the opposite of what he expects.
If you then fail fair enough.
England may well have done that, I don't know.
Perhaps it was just poor execution.
But the fact remains we lose most penalty shoot-outs and that is just not coincidence or bad luck surely?

England have been practicing pens all through the tourney according to Hodgson. Really it came down to Young (who looks to have zero bottle, and Cole who went for Gareth Southgate approach.

Here is the penalty shoot out records for most national teams. England have the worsed.

[urlhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_national_football_teams_by_penalty_shootout_record[/url

Tell that to a German!
Are they super-human?