You could be being sarcastic and it's gone way over my head but do you really think racial comments deserve a harsher punishment than physical violence?

Do you think flashing a sponsor's logo deserves a harsher punishment than physical violence or racist abuse?

No. That is stupid beyond belief.

That's UEFA.

They are completely different situations though. The FA's are being fined because of the actions of their supporters. Supporters who they have zero control over.

Bendtner deliberately broke the rules, and he will have been paid a tonne of cash to do it. His fine has to be in line with his earnings, not the fines the FA's are getting

I was trying to compare the punishments given to these offences to that of Bendtner, although I'd say the punishments to both organisations is far too low regardless of the Bendtner case.

I think for stuff like this to be eradicated from the game it needs to be properly punished, points deductions, bans from future competitions and other massive sanctions, even if it means San Marino will qualify for the next World Cup and the game will be clean.

How do we overrate him? What type of comments? I've always maintanied his first touch is terrible, but at the end of the day he is easily England's second best striker.

He really isn't all that. I've heard some United fans say that he'll go on to be a United legend and that he's "world class". He really isn't better than Defoe.

It does seem that flares in the stands gets jumped on as does unwanted sponsors and crowd invasions(You watch England get stung).
But yet racist chanting and banana a throwing (Everyone knew what it was like BEFORE the tourney even started) is being almost ignored with the hope it will just go away IMHO.

Am I missing something but is the style that the Spainish play and too a degree Arsenal and Barca becoming boring? Last night seemed like a pre season friendly.

I think Bendtner's punishment is fair and reasonable. Its the others that are ridiculous.

I can see the argument that FAs have limited direct control over their fans, particularly in matches played abroad. But these countries have "previous" for tolerating racism and will never take serious action to sort out the problem until they're made to.

Wigan reject £4m bid for Moses from Chelsea. Double it and they can have him for mine.

Brilliant.
I'm no huge fan of Welbeck but he is a far far better all-round footballer than Defoe is, has been or ever will be.

Awesome.

Newcastle's bid for Debuchy knocked back. £4m does seem very low TBH. Hopefully a solution can be agreed.

Meanwhile, SSN reporting Twente want £15 for Luuk De Jong, which will probably finish our interest. Apparently an £8m bid had been made, can't see them nearly doubling it unless Ba leaves.

We need to keep Cisse and Ba as well as adding. Selling Ba and bringing in a like-for-like replacement will still leave us terribly short for competing in four competitions.

Exactly. We're talking about a culture change and when you consider the amount of effort FIFA have made to include less developed countries in events then the lack of conviction within FIFA and UEFA to address the more pressing matter of racism itself looks even worse. If the FAs are doing nothing about it then you can't expect the fans to change because the clubs won't disturb things until they have to. It's basic business theory, change doesn't come if those at the top don't buy into it and a £25k fine is not buying into fighting racism, it's slapped wrists appeasement.

I seem to have the impression that FIFA don't deem it their responsibility to be the catalyst for change. It seems they have this view that racism is a problem in society, not football, so the action they take is very much representative of that. IMO, FIFA could have more influence, but they either can't be bothered, don't have the balls or don't think they're capable. I think it's a combination of all three, really, but they answer to nobody, it seems.

Who is doing the recruitment at Newcastle? Is it Pardew or do they have a DOF type? Whoever is responsible is doing a sensational job.

Gary Carr is the head scout there, Alan Carr's dad. I believe he is the main man behind their transfer success.

Yep, my thoughts exactly, but thats United fans for you.

Watched him (Graham?) play for Bradford Park Avenue in the 60's. He was, to put it politely, an uncomplicated player. Not someone I would ever have expected to succeed in the way he has done.

England's tactics tonight appear to be hoping to bore the opposition to defeat.

Not bad topping the group with an average midfield

21 unbeaten my fat Yorkshire

England doubting nob heads, it's your country

Just seen the replay...the Ukrainian was clearly offside for the 'goal' that was cleared off the line.