Anyone else think there was a strong case for Mascherano being sent off? My liverpool supporting brother seemed to think it was a crazy suggestion despite the fact its pretty clear Valencia would have got his shot off before the defender could come across. As it happens I would ammend the rules to a yellow card if the offence takes place inside the penalty area and a red if it takes place outside.

Also regarding Rafa and his diving claim, Valencia is running at pace and the tug on his arm has twisted him to the point that he could no longer continue running in the direction of the ball with any sort of control so he was well within his rights to go down. His constant moaning and sarcasm are really starting to grate now.

IMO there was a covering defender so Mascherano wasn't the last man.

I think Mascherano actually fouled Valencia just outside the box, but it was so close I can understand why the ref gave it.



Benitez was just talking nonsense when he said Valencia dived. I agree with your comment about his arm being twisted.

Having a debate on another forum with a load of Man United fans who cant or wont admit, that Messi is a better player than Rooney. The best they can come up with is that Rooney is the better player because hes better defensively. Attacking wise there is nothing between the two apparantly and Rooney can do everything Messi can. :S

Put Messi in the Manchester United side and he wouldn't be as good as he is now.

Put Rooney in the Barca side and he wouldn't be as good as he is now.

They are both great player, but both great in different ways.

Messi is the present king because Barca triumphed in the CL last season, but that could change this year.

If Ferguson had gone up against Barca in the same way we did we might not have to suffer half of Britain tossing themselves off to Messi right now. But Fergie got big-headed, had a lesson and we now have to put up with the worship.

For all the histrionics over Barca, they aren't even leading the Spanish league. When they win the league and CL for the second time in a row then they can start worshipping Messi, but they could end up looking foolish if Barca win nowt.

People tug over Messi because, quite simply, he's the most gifted footballer on the planet. There is no doubting it, he's the out and out star of the best team in the world, he is on a different level to the rest of the field. Most people have thought this for a while now, Barca's success just cemented that, just like United's success in 2008 cemented Ronaldo's place as one of the greats of our generation. Messi is a stupendously good player, Rooney is nowhere near him and you can call me biased, but nobody comes near him. He's a truly special player doing special things every week, players like him come around once a generation, if that, I think every wet dream over him is more than justified.

Most United fans will say 'I wouldn't swap Rooney for another player in the world' which is fair enough, it's to be expected, he's their star, the fan favourite and he's English. But, I'm sure if they just watched things without their tinted specs, they'd have no reservations about admitting the gap between Rooney and Messi is huge.

Rooney's in the form of his life right now, but he'll never be in the bracket of a player like Messi.

Maybe it's also hard for most Liverpool fans to admit that an ex Everton and current Man United player is maybe as least in the same league as Messi,to claim the gap between Messi and Rooney is huge is just plain wrong,lets wait a few months to see what both players do on the biggest stage in the world.

Just because we wouldn't swap Rooney for anyone else doesn't mean we can't see the quality of other players. When Ronaldo was here, he was by far the greatest player in the world, but still everyone at United would've preferred to lose Ronaldo than Rooney, because Rooney brings more to the team than fancy dan stuff in the final third.

And TBF, we're hardly bothered whether he's English or not are we? Cantona is the king of Old Trafford, and Rooney will need to do a bit more to get close to Cantona's legendary status.

Messi is a class player, but if Barca fail to win the league / European Cup, he won't win the POTY this year, especially if United win the league / EC. The gap between Rooney/Ronaldo/Messi and the rest is huge, there's nobody else near them ATM, but the award for the best player will go to the player that has the most success this year.

Attacking wise there is nothing between Rooney and Messi. Except Rooney is better in the air. Messi is better at running at players.

Along with Ronaldo they are by far the best players in the world. If Ronaldo was still in a decent team (

) he'd be getting tugged over because he can do everything Messi/Rooney can.

No other player gets close to them three in terms of class ATM.

Of course nationality has a bit of influence on how supporters see him. Just like with Becks, Rooney is England's star player, considering Old Trafford was effectively England's second home when Wembley was being built, the connection between England and your club is strong IMO, much stronger than the connection between England and our club anyway. It's hard to explain, but I don't think United fans would have took to Rooney so quickly had he been Nigerian or Mexican (just a random nation).

Rooney is a good player playing in the form of his life, but on pure ability, Messi is just so much better than anybody else. He can open a defence up with a pass, beat 5 men on an effortless sprint, he can score from inside and outside of the box, he can use both feet well and dribbles well with both feet, he links with players exceptionally and his anticipation is first class. Rooney is a top player, he's enjoyed a great season but he just isn't capable of the things Messi is capable of. It's what sets the likes of Zidane apart from other players in their generation, they have this other level of ability that sets them apart.

I think the biggest influence on the WPOTY award will obviously be the world cup, although I don't agree with that, we'll have a stronger indication as to who's the favourite after that.

We took to Dong very well.

Anyway, I prefer Vidic and Evra to Rooney so nationality has feck all to do with it.





Aye, which is what I said in my last post to codarmysaint. Messi is sublime with the ball at his feet, only Ronaldo is like him, with the ability to take players on. Rooney's passing has been pretty poor this season, which is why I believe we have yet to see the best of him. People with the ability to make a pass to eliminate the opposition and bring in more of your own team, like Scholes, Alonso, Xavi and Fabregas can do is a rarity, I believe them four have the ability better than Messi.

I agree that Messi is probably the best player in the world, because there are a couple of weaknesses in Rooney's game this season, such as his passing / long range shooting. But he's not as far away from Messi as some are making it sound.

I don't mean it to knock on Rooney when I say it, I just think Messi has combined so many attributes, it's hard to see anyone near him. His turn of pace, agility yet strength and balance are freakish for a player of such height, the way he compliments his speed with the effortless dribbling, I could go on.

It's harsh on Rooney that he's playing in a time when someone like Messi is just hitting his peak, as any other player having a season like Rooney's would put his house on him winning the WPOTY award, he's done it in every competition and he's done well for England, but I just can't look past the little Argentine.

Drogba can have the PL, Eto'o the CL, Ronaldo - La Liga. Rooney and Messi can then share the Ballon D'Or (or whatever 5hit it's called) and everyone can be happy.



For me it's always best to laud the players who actually win things. Winning things is the only thing IMO. Being the best player to win FA is really pathetic IMO. Total Football Holland shouldn't be championed because they were the best side not to win the World Cup, they should be ashamed that they didn't use their talent to achieve what should have been their objective.

Change the list a bit! Messi can have the WPOTY by himself. Rooney can have the World Cup!

The rules/laws don't state anything about this mythical "last man" which people are so fond of quoting...it states that if a clear goalscoring opportunity is denied the attacking player then a red card should be issued. I think Valencia would have got a shot in (whether it would have been any good or not is another debate!!) so technically it should have been a red card...taken from the Laws of the Game...[urlhttp://www.thefa.com/TheFA/RulesandRegulations/~/media/Files/PDF/Get%20into%20Football/Referees/lawsofthegameen_0910.ashx/lawsofthegameen_0910.pdf[/url
Sending-off Offences
A player, substitute or substituted player is sent off if he commits any of the
following seven offences:
• denying an obvious goal-scoring opportunity to an opponent moving
towards the player’s goal by an offence punishable by a free kick or a
penalty kick

I'd agree with that at this moment in time. Lets see how good Rooney, Messi & Ronaldo are at the WC. I think if anyone of them won the thing they'd be entered into the all time greats list?

Pele
Maradonna
Zidane

All time great?

Did I stutter?

[url=http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/23032010/58/world-cup-2010-england-world-cup-tv-schedule.htmlWorld Cup 2010 - England's World Cup TV schedule[/url

ITV will show England's first two matches at the 2010 World Cup, with BBC showing the third group game, as well as the last-16 and quarter-final if Fabio Capello's men make it that far

Eh? So the games won't be shown on both channels? FFS. Got to put up with ITVs dire coverage.

"He's alright that little Messi fella, might make it if he puts on a bit of weight and learns to head a ball..."

Probably what the scouting report would have read if he'd been born in Aldershot rather than Argentina.

Add 'too short & only has 1 foot' and you're bang on the money.

He was turned down by Argentinian giants River Plate due to the conditon which stunted his growth.

I am yet to meet an Argentinian here who has a good word to say about Messi, they all think he doesn't care about playing for Argentina and only plays well for Barcelona because that's who pay his wages.

Then again, they seem to think similarly of most of the star players who head to Europe so it isn't that much of a surprise.

I presume the post about Messi/Rooney/Ronaldo joining the likes of Pele and Maradona if they do well in the World Cup was a joke? Three players in their early/mid 20's who have done well for the last 3 or 4 years for their clubs in comparison to players who performed well at the very top level for club and country for over a decade?

Obviously. All 3 of the ones I mentioned won at least 2 World Cups? (Did Maradonna? Think he got 1) Mess, Roo & Ron have still got many years of football ahead of them.

Why do they think so highly of Maradonna then? Because he won things with Argentina? Maybe Messi will.