I think the quality of coaching has improved so that decent players playing to a structured system can get good results. We had far more 'off the cuff' players back then I think. There are possibly less supposed superstars in the game, but then again, there are also less overpriced ageing Aussies here for their pension.

I'd like to bet that a fair proportion of those moaning about the state of the game now are the same ones moaning about those Aussies coming over for one last easy pay check.

As we've seen, the SL comp is capable of producing top flight NRl players so i don't think standards are that different, just that some of the names don't look quite so exciting 'on paper'.

As mentioned above, the big issue is the top 8 system. Imagine this season having to get into the top 4 to qualify, the quality and intensity of the last months games would be far far higher. This is the biggest cause of supporters complaints, that regular games don't mean much.

Hopefully next seasons changes will improve this.

The star players we produce should be playing in the super league not the NRL though. The issue for me is the state of rugby league in general, the game has become robotic natural flair has been discarded, even sky sports opening credits for rugby league games shows players as robots and I'm afraid that's what the game is turning into, like the game battleships but for rugby league players.

Or maybe youre just more expectant having seen the "flair" of previous generations. A 30m pass was a big deal in 2005 (Paul Cooke made a career out of it), but its standard today. Defensive structures mean every try (generally speaking) comes from what would be considered a "great" try "back in the day", but because a) its common now and b) were not wearing nostalgia glasses we dont celebrate it for what it is anymore. Weve become an expectant culture as opposed to an appreciative one (thats not just in RL mind).

I had the misfortune of watching Saints vs Bradford at VP when we put 50 past them recently. London would of been embarassed by some of the defence on show, and Saints attack didnt need to get past run at the gap. Not everything was better.

Leeds were without 2 halfbacks and were a man down for the majority of the game. Credit to saints for winning, but it's hardly a win you can be cock of the north about, scraping home with a man advantage after 2 weeks prep against a team with 3 days prep.

But missing your two halves allowed that young sinfield lad to get a game in the halves and he went OK I reckon, big future ahead of him.

You are looking through rose tinted glasses if you can't see that Leeds dominated for most of the game. It was only when Leeds started to tire due to being down to 12 men that Saints got back into the game. In that game you had two half backs just as Leeds did. They had Burrow and McGuire sat in the stand. I have several friends who are Saints supporters and they all have the same view as me.

True, the combined ages of the Leeds halfbacks was 52, the combined ages of the Saints halfbacks was 65!!

We haven't had " A Wigan Performance " since Catalan away . Hope we get some in the play offs !

McDermott's decision to leave two subs unused when down to 12 men on the back of the cup final was a puzzler.

This topic has gone a little bit wayward everyone?!

In my opinion, every time we get a "first teamer" back fit he is thrown straight in despite the youngster who has played just as well if not better in the first teamers absence. Said first teamers then continue to perform worse than the "stand in" youngster and usually results in a loss. Play to form Shaun, not a name.

Its hopefully just a ploy to play tot he set up of the play offs in order to get to the GF, but in fairness, its not fair to the paying fans is it so I can understand everyone's' grievance with the game in general at present.

Looking at the eticketing site for Friday it's going to be a big crowd, could even push 20k depending on how many Leeds bring. Hopefully we are treated to something that is a "Wigan performance", as our recent home record against the top teams doesn't make good reading.

I would recommend anyone to have a look at the "RL Action" programme for the 1981 "Battle of Fartown" (available in full on Youtube). Once you have done that see if your opinions still stand.

I was privileged to have attended that game, it was actually better than the new years day v wire game a few years later.

Quote ="hatty"I was privileged to have attended that game, it was actually better than the new years day v wire game a few years later. '" "A game for the connoisseur" was how Maurice Bamford described it. I remember Martin Foy shadow boxing close to the touchline when everyone else was getting stuck in. For those of you who have never seen it take a look. It was mayhem. wigan.rlfans.com/news.php?readmore=2365

Quote ="hatty"I was privileged to have attended that game, it was actually better than the new years day v wire game a few years later. '" "A game for the connoisseur" was how Maurice Bamford described it. I remember Martin Foy shadow boxing close to the touchline when everyone else was getting stuck in. For those of you who have never seen it take a look. It was mayhem. wigan.rlfans.com/news.php?readmore=2365

Isn't that the one where the black Hudds player gets targetted?

I'm not really sure who you're referring to? Manfredi does a decent job and has got a bright future ahead of him but Charnley is one of the best wingers in SL and rightfully got slotted back in when fit. Thornley was clearly put in against Widnes to regain some match fitness before the Leeds, Wire games and the playoffs seeing as though there's no reserve grade and it's too late for him to get sent out on loan, plus Sarginson has been poor in the last couple of months. Same with Green, he's first choice and needed to displace one of the youngsters to gain match fitness. Plus I do think Powell and Williams genuinely had knocks against Widnes because it simply didn't make sense to rest both when McIlorum and Green weren't up to speed and the only other option was Doran.

Quote ="Rogues Gallery""A game for the connoisseur" was how Maurice Bamford described it. I remember Martin Foy shadow boxing close to the touchline when everyone else was getting stuck in. For those of you who have never seen it take a look. It was mayhem. wigan.rlfans.com/news.php?readmore=2365'" And those 2,687 tickets sold out in seconds!

Quote ="Rogues Gallery""A game for the connoisseur" was how Maurice Bamford described it. I remember Martin Foy shadow boxing close to the touchline when everyone else was getting stuck in. For those of you who have never seen it take a look. It was mayhem. wigan.rlfans.com/news.php?readmore=2365'" And those 2,687 tickets sold out in seconds!

And what part of that game are you actually missing these days? If it's the full-on brawling, horrible cheap shots and general ry then either go and watch MMA/Boxing or get yourself out on a Friday/Saturday night in town rather than going to watch Rugby League.

Yes I miss everything you mention, I also miss being able to shoulder charge , stealing the ball, full on brutal games the spectators (and players) love, that's what rugby league is and if you don't like that then maybe you should be at the DW on Saturdays not Friday evening or you could walk the dog in the park.

So in summation, you miss thuggery in our great game.

God

Dont be such a tart.

Rugby league "the toughest game in the world"

"our" great game was built on toughness. Now is just sanitized and dull.

Blah blah f-in blah... You see posts like this from fans all the time, yet when Kevin Sinfield 'headbutts' Luke Dorn there's a 20 page thread calling for blood. Fans go on, and on and on about 'biff' and the 'good old days' of cheap shots, and handbags, but the reality is RL fans in general are a bunch of soft hypocrites

I think you will find that the 20 page thread was on the Leeds forum not here but anyhow.. back on topic, there's nothing wrong with a bit of "biff" as you put it, it used to be the way teams got momentum and the upper hand, the forwards softening up the opposition forwards. There was nothing better than the first 15 mins of a game, this is where lines were drawn and platforms laid.

Not from me you have f-in not pal...............

But your right about the hypocrites. Absolutely riddled with them this place

I suppose if you mean would I rather watch Les Boyd and Kelvin Skerrett than Eorl Crabtree and LMS then the answer is yes.