And that is the dilemma.
Me and our mob have deliberated for hours and sunk gallons discussing it. Is it the coach, is it "mental toughness", is it "a leader", is it us and the pressure we put on the "team"

The truth is IMO it's a combination, but I do believe it's a confidence thing, and if we can string a few wins together we are capable of beating any of the teams.

We were in the game though. We will see if we can do it when it counts in the challenge cup final against saints

All of the above.

There is no point getting to the elimination semi and making up the numbers as we have in the past.

There is no point playing poor all year and having a 2/3 game run and claiming the season to be a success. We have to catch up to Leeds or Saints and step up to the mark when it counts. As you continue to whinge about the cap and lowering standards, Wigan have continued to sink and are no closer to the real teams capable of winning the silver come the end of the year.

The Challenge Cup final has already been played, but given the nature of the cup teams like Hudds, Quins and Les Cats can make a final, not often does it go right after that point though sadly.

Only on the scoreboard. Leeds had 2 to 3 gears to shift up had they needed to in my opinion.

It's true, confidence, mementun and experience have a massive impact and I beleive we will have all three come the end of the season. We are the most likely to challenge the top 2 in the play-offs.

Maybe true but we still coult of done it at the end. All ifs and buts though.

But surely confidence is the preference?

Correct so by saying I think we will have all 3 by the end of the season I think we will be on a good enough run to gain some of this confidence you talk about

You would expect we would have it by now though.......still we seem to lack it.

I wouldn't say we lack it completely, we looked really confident against Salford in the first 20 mins but because we had not played like that all season we didn't no what to do with the game to really take hold and put some real points past them. We lack composure more than confidence. We are at our best when we put both composure and confidence together as when we have a little bit of beleif and chance our arm we look a good side, but this has only happened a few times each game and when we have the composure to take the chances created we look a top 2 side IMO. Like I said before we are not as far off as some people pessimistically like to think.

I agree, a half, a Prop and a coach, job done.

not quite I think we would of won 4 extra games had we just had Barrett in the side, maybe 5.

But we do not have Baz and more importantly we wasted him for much of his time here.

For someone who sits on the fence regards Noble i cannot help but notice the lack of splinters.

What do you mean by your second comment?

nothing off by it, just you seem to claim you are in neither camp on the Noble debate, which is fair enough, but yet seem to support him in most debates.

It's true I am in neither camp. Read my other posts though and I have always said support whoever is at our club, we cannot get rid of them so support them while they are here, I said the same about Mathers. So when people say something against him, I will lightly defend him as he is our coach and we (I believe) should support him. I accept both sides though. If I had to be further to ones side I must say I am more towards the keep Noble side as I like consistancy and I don't think changing coach every 1 or 2 seasons is the answer. Different sport but look at Man United and Arsenal. Noble IMO has not done anything wrong but has kept us safe from relegation and taken us to 4 semi finals and over the last 2 years we have been the 3rd best team and are still the main top 2 challengers for the title IMO.

mate i am not criticising your stance just saying that i find it to be very pro Noble, but you seem to continue to back him while stating you are on the fence, which would indicate you do not sit on the fence.

Either way i respect your view.

Well I did just admit I am more towards pro Noble and have stated my reasons but I still am on the fence as we should support who is at our club as fans IMO. I am not pro Noble though but I will defend him as he is our coach not because I am just pro Noble. I am not also a fence sitter who has a sore cause they can't be bothered making a decision but because I believe this to be the best place to be within the debate.

i really do not understand this.

If we all backed the coach simply because he was a wigan coach we would have been relegated.

I am just saying let the people who matter make the decision on if he should stay or go, as we cannot decide this. So I will support whoever takes the field.

I might even not be happy with the players or coach like with Mathers yes, he was naff, but I did not shout it from the terrace, I gave him support.

I'm still not comfortable with claims of the 'business end' of the season being the most important. As jonh says, we finish in a mediocre position in the league, win a couple of play off games, and that makes a successful season? If we don't win those play offs it's a complete disaster. I'd much rather be a consistent top four quality side, hanging close to Saints and Leeds then hope to get to a final.

I think he's a good coach, too Millwardesque for my liking though, comes across as cocky and unprofessional.

I think Morgan is a great coach

The jury's out on whether Morgan is a genuine top-tier coach, but I do think he is superior to Noble.

Nobby deserves credit for what he achieved at Bradford, but he's exceeded his sell-by date by a couple of years. Coaching methods move on and in all but the most exceptional cases (Wayne Bennett) coaches are left behind. Noble's methods are simply outmoded.

"Park Life!"