Tomkins is a very good player with a bright future ahead of him but think he's got a long way to go before you can compare him to someone like Danny Mcguire. Mcguire has proved it over a long period of time and has won massive games for Leeds with flashes of brilliance In every season he has played,

Tomkins will need to do it over a longer period before you will have a serious argument, I think he will but who knows what might happen in the coming seasons, yes he has talent and looks good but has to stand the test of time before he can be mentioned in the same breath.

Spot on!

Actions speak louder than words.

Thats fine with us if your happy with Danny McGuire instead of Sam Tomkins, we are happy with Sam Tomkins instead of Danny McGuire. Everyone is happy

McGuire has won 4 league titles, 0 challenge cups and 2 WCC.

Tomkins already has 1 league title and has won YPOTY 2 years on the trot. As an individual honour that is a pretty high one. I don't think that success is down to just McGuire as well, it is the whole Leeds team. Tomkins is the better player, I can't believe anyone would disagree.

Mate I can't believe you actually believe Riddell is better than Cunningham, that has to be one of the worst statements I've ever heard. I bet you can't find a rugby fan in world rugby that would agree with you. I'm actually really shocked you've said that.

Its pointless arguing mate cos we don't know what will happen in the coming seasons because until Tomkins has proved it for a longer period of time you can't really compare him to Mcguire who has been there and done it in massive games year after year, so give it 4-5 more years then come back.

I am comparing as an idividual player right now!

If I wanted to compare careers then I would be happy to wait but I am comparing the two players quality from the last 2 seasons. Tomkins is the better player. He has already proved he can win games and get us out of trouble, he has done it on so many occasions in only two years in the first team.

Anyone who is comparing Tomkins to McGuire needs their head testing. McGuire is a good support player end of! Sam is the complete player and has already surpassed what McGuire has achieved in his two years as a first team player.

Its a matter of opinion, no one can win. But still think Tomkins has a way to go, and you can't say over the last 2 seasons because a player isn't just judged on what skills he's got or pace etc it is also judged over a number of seasons in different game situations, also temprament must be taken into consideration and Tomkins' is suspect to say the least.

Crazy comment this one, you obviously haven't seen him play much because to say Mcguire is just a support player is ridiculous, yes one of his great attributes are that he's the best support player in the game and started off mainly as one but has deleloped his game and is now a very good half back who creates loads of oportunities for team mates, his short kicking game is good and his eye for a gap is second to none. To say he's just a support player I think is very unfair.

Eh? Tomkins has achieved more? No he hasn't Fact! He will do well to achieve half of what Mcguire has. Look you can argue all you want but the facts are there, Tomkins has a long way to go. Tomkins record just doesn't stand up to Mcguires and I doubt ever will.

I would like to know what you judge as an achievement

Tomkins has actually achieved more over the last two years than mcguire has over the last two years lol

Some one can be judged the best player in the world Stacey Jones for example and have no medals to show for his personal achievments. Team sports reward teams. Individual awards could be considered a better a gauge on how good an individual player is compared to his contemporaries.

The thing that impresses me most about Maguire is his defence.

You only have to look at Fridays game to see that Sam dragged us back in to that game in the last 10 minutes when he was clearly told 'Sam get up in to that line and get us back in to the game'

He scored a great individual try and then made a cracking break for Joel/Faz to win a penalt between them to then score the leveller himself.

Long may he be in a Wigan shirt.

It's not that difficult, even for you.
Individual achievements are judged by individual awards and selections; team achievements are judged by trophies.

Yes, Mcguire has acieved more over a much longer career, but we can easily and fairly compare them at the same stage in their career, and when Danny was Sam's age he'd achieved nothing.

Sam, by contrast, has 2 YPOTY awards and 8 international caps.

If I could be bothered, I'd total MoM awards too, and would be prepared to bet Sam has more of those than Danny did at age 21.

McGuire has been a great player for Leeds and Sam is fantastic for Wigan.
Unfortunately, Danny has been unable to step up at international level and Sam didn't break any pots in last year's 4 Nations.
If, in the future, Sam makes a hit at international level he will prove himself to be the better player. I don't think Danny will play at that level again.

Danny will definately play for England again at 6 with Tomkins playin 1 or 7, could be a good partnership

Oh dear, try actually reading what I wrote. I made no reference to either players ability.

What I said was that Sam Tomkins is the Wigan equivalent of Danny McGuire as they are both players neither set of fans would do without.

Where in that am I comparing their abilities?

Well said!

Oh dear, try reading what I wrote.



I did not say you made reference to either player's ability.

I was accused by another poster of making a fatuous comparison. I didn't make the comparison initially - you did. I merely pointed out, the comparison having been made in terms of both players being highly thought of by their fans, that Sam Tomkins is the better player.

Well, in that case I appologise. It read to me as if you were saying i'd made the initial comparison of their abilities.

It's nice to see, though, that you accept the initial comparison of their abilities was made by yourself.

Why wouldn't I accept that?

You made the point that you thought they were equally highly rated by their respective fans.

I made the point that Tomkins is a better player.

I guess the conclusion to be drawn is that Wigan fans have higher standards!

You didn't accept that point earlier.



Still, as you're only interested in an "Our full-back is better than your Stand-off" argument, I'll leave you to it.

No, the point I didn't accept was that I hadn't made the comparison between the players in the first place - you did.