But sending players to mete out justice does? Now which is it?

I'd hardly say Mick Potter was " Shown up" by him to be honest. You only beat us by 8 points. Unless you are classing a defeat as being shown up, in which case Maguire has been " Shown up" by the much Maligned duo of Brian Mcdermott and Steve Mcnamara!

either we allow both to go (virtually) unpunished or we stamp them both out! We do one or the other,what we dont do is allow what O'loughlin to do go free then complain when there is a little retribution and intimidation.

I would say no and no. However I am not Nathan Brown, and didnt see the challenge on Luke Robinson. None of know what goes on behind closed doors in team talks or training sessions!.

I was making a point about what Tony Smith and his comments about banning players.

It was his after match comments that got him added to the list, nothing to do with the win

Entirely wrong.

You're making the assumption that O'Loughlin was 'deliberately reckless'. Please prove that point. (and please don't come back with some "it happens all the time" or "It's my opinion" junk!)

In the second instance we [uknow[/u it to be deliberate as Brown himself has confirmed it.

You getting this yet?

You then go on to admit that you don't in fact think or at least can't say that O'Loughlin did this on purpose (and in fact he has no real history of this tactic anyway even if that's what you wanted to try to intimate!).

In the second instance we [uknow[/u it to be deliberate as Brown himself has confirmed it.


We there yet?

Then you say "Its like you are defending O'loughlin because what he did was sly and that it is somehow worse to be up front about it". Well let's start with the fact that no-one is defending O'Loughlin "because it was sly". In fact I doubt there'd be any takers for that particular defence. Rather, we are saying it was an "honest error in timing due to a commited attempt to put pressure on the opposition player and prevent him getting the kick/pass away effectively". You remember that don't you? It's called playing the game. If you're response to that is that sending players out to exact revenge is the same thing then, mate, you aren't naive, your a fool.

O'Loughlin didn't go unpunished. A penalty was awarded against him which was entirely the correct decision. Have a look at the rules if you have any further points that need clearing up!

I agree the other incident went unpunished.

OK. Fair enough!

Hey Phuzzy,

no worries mate - for what its worth I think his comments could come and bite us on the backside this season - one would hope not but we'll see.

Cheers mate

You have to laugh at the sheer brass neck of the bloke. Brown moans saying that a player "has to run on with a knife and stab somebody to get a ban". I'm wondering what more a coach has to say to get himself reprimanded from the RFL? Call the entire Red Hall staff a bunch of baby-raping, crack-dealers? Probably get a strongly-worded letter telling him not to say nasty things

Wigan fans in not understanding Browns comments. Just goes to show how far they have fallen when you used to be able to get intelligent and educated comments from Wigan fans.

Now when they are having success again they are becoming all arrogant ( the new Leeds fans

) and think that the world revolves around them and everything that is said is about them.

=#FF0000This is what most posters semed to have missed.Look at what he said
The RFL are weak
The referees are weak
The disciplinary system is a joke ( it even lets my players off=#FF0000 when i think they should be banned)
Because the RFL is weak people like me and other aussie coaches who see the RFL as weak will manipulate this for our own ends.
Smaller skilful players are targetted by other teams sometimes unfairly
The RFL need to make examples of players who break the rules to assert their authority

Wigan fans read
O Loughlin should have been banned for 8 games.

there is no more proof that O'loughlin did it accidently than there is he did it deliberately. I knew someone would get all precious about 'their' player which is why have endeavoured to separate this particular incident to the fact it does happen all the time. I dont care whether O'loughlin was deliberately reckless or not, it was a specific incident that has long since passed. What i do know is that it happens far to often in all games to all teams for it not to be, in most cases reckless


Im more than comfortable putting the burden of safety onto the tackler. If we punish those who are reckless (and you are reckless whether deliberate or not by definition of hitting the player late) the same as those who are deliberate players will no longer be reckless.

ahh, so you are trying to explain something i have said to you. Seems a strange way to have a conversation if im honest. I would have thought it obvious i understood by definition of me saying it to you.

Once again, you are reckless by definition of hitting the player late. It happens far too often for about 10 plays every game to be accidental. Whether you are deliberately reckless or just reckless is of no interest to me, move the burden of safety onto the tackler and they will stop being reckless and deliberately reckless, it will stop a players 'accidental' shooting out of the line and throwing themselves into a prone player
You are almost there. You have almost understood the deliberate recklessness. O'loughlin wanted to put pressure on the player, he was reckless as to whether he did this legally or not. We know this 100% because he hit the player late, either he isnt a very intelligent player or like everyone else he was aware that chances were he wasnt going to make it in time. He either didnt know what he was doing and was running around like a headless chicken, in which case he should be punished for being too stupid to play the game (which considering some of our players would be quite an acheivement) or he made a split second decision that it was worth risking taking a prone player out late and illegally which is deliberately reckless.

at this point i have no qualms with a prop handing out reasonable retribution to a player who was reckless and illegal in hurting one of their backs. Its part of the charms of the game.

And again you seem to accept that a player hitting an opposition back whilst he is kicking late and recklessly is somehow morally ok because he can always pretend he didnt mean to, yet massively over-reacting to a Prop giving a bit of niggle in retaliation

You're defending your coach. We're defending our player. If you look back plenty have said that Brown made plenty of good, not to mention worrying, points in his statement. Where Wigan fans are saying he is wrong is his claim that Lockers should have been red-carded and banned for what in truth was nothing more than a poorly-timed shoulder charge, which sounds like little more than sour grapes. Does anyone think he'd have carried on like this if Huddersfield had played well and turned us over on Sunday?

If this is what he said about the RFL then they should show him what teeth they have he should be brought up in front of the RFL And charged with bringing the game into disrepute. He should then have his coaching licence taken off him in the UK for 6 months and fined £20,000 for his trouble.

We all know this wont happen but this is what is needed to stop coaches spouting off to the media as it does our game no good at all.

You've got it in a nutshell. There is no proof. Therefore you can't make assumptions based on what other players have done. It's nothing to do with "their" player as you put it. There are rules governing the game which [uall[/u sides are subject to. In this instance O'Loughlin's tackle was seen as late. Not high. Not malicious. Just late. The correct decision was a penalty. It doesn't matter whether you, Brown or my aunt Fanny does or doesn't agree.



You can't play the game under those circumstances! You profess to know the game. This simply proves otherwise. You can't ban every player that makes an error! There are penalties within the game for those circumstances. They're called...oh yeah, PENALTIES! Just for the record, who decided what is reckless and what isn't? The judiciary? See where we're going with this....



Unfortunately it shows no such thing. What it shows is that you don't understand the difference between explaining your own words to you and pointing out the inconsistancies. I was doing the latter.


And you would ban EVERY late tackle? If that were the case all any player had to do to get an opposition player banned would be release the ball before the tackle came in. You're seriously advocating we go down that route? Laughable! And, incidentally, this from someone who advocates enforcer props! BTW is EVERY high tackle also reckless and therefore worthy of a ban? I'd love to see how many players would be sat on the sidelines. What about a bit of biff? Bans all round? Need I go on?



So that's 10 players per game would be banned. Really looking forward to the next Hudds/Wigan game. Maybe we could both bring our boots just in case!



It would also be called football. No thank you. I like my tackles to be commited. But let's agree to differ on this. I'll send you an application form for a season ticket for the Latics.




O'Loughlin wanting to put pressure on the player is not Reckless. It's how the game is played! Have you ever actually watched a game? The rest is just garbage so I won't bother responding.



You reall are a hypocrite, aren't you! Retribution is "part of the charm of the game" and making tackles and occassionally getting them wrong should be stamped out? Jeez, I couldn't make this up!




Do I actually need to point out the ridiculousness of this paragraph? Really???

.

it is reckless by definition of him hitting the player late. You are the one apportioning intent or lack of it. I have simply stated what is a fact.

But if we go with the referees decision then we go with the referees decision, thats fine. If Nathan Brown wants to send his players out there with the idea that if a player is reckless with his timing of 'tackles' on his backs, then maybe his forwards should also be a bit more reckless with the height of their tackles also, then that is also fine, after all you cant ban every player who makes an error and it is up to the judiciary to decide on intent. Mason et al can just say it was an accident, prove otherwise

No, you repeated back to me what i said about O'loughlin, then said something i had said nothing about relating to Brown

yes, i would either ban all late/illegal challenges regardless of the outcome (though not necessarily to the same degree) or i would be lenient on these late challenges but also lenient on any reasonable retribution handed out.

You seem to not want bans handed out for a bit of biff, yet are upset that a player should instigate 'a bit of biff' in retribution for a late challenge on a prone player

Really, you wouldnt want to watch the game because it would be too much like football all because players can no longer shoot out of the line and hit a prone player they didnt really have a chance of catching legally?



yes it is, if cant see that your an idiot. Ill try and put it a bit simpler for you.

When committing a challenge like O'loughlin did there is always the chance the opposition player could be hurt or injured. Within the rules of the game O'loughlin has no responsibility, When he steps out of the rules of the game he takes total responsibility for the outcome. O'loughlin took the opportunity to put pressure on the player but was reckless as to whether or not he did this within the rules of the game. His primary concern wasnt to play within the rules of the game, nor was it for the safety of the opposition player. It was to put pressure on the playmaker, by any definition this is reckless

do i need to point out how ridiculous you look trying to patronise people when its clear you dont understand?

its an either/or situation, either we are lenient with late tackles and as such the retribution that may be forthcoming (as long as it is reasonable) or we stamp out both. What we dont do is allow sly and cowardly late challenges (when only the prone player is at any real risk) and clamp down on any intimidation that would follow it, down that way football headed.

For the third or fourth time, im not advocating one or the other, im advocating both or neither.

And again, just in case you get precious about O'loughlin, maybe it was an accident,maybe Wigan have never done anything illegal by anything other than accident, maybe they are making a stand for the Corinthian spirit back to sport, but there are 13 other teams who just happen to accidently do the same thing very very often, Maybe just maybe we could ask them to be a bit more careful with other peoples safety, and if we dont, maybe we could just keep them honest?

I'm still struggling to see what his problem is. The tackle was a little rough, initial contact was made in the chest which with momentum went into his jaw. No swing arm, not leading with an elbow. Its a type of tackle you do to knock players down, which O'loughlin does well. Get over it Brown.

I think at the most he should of gotten 10 mins, i don't believe it deserved it tbh but if anything was to come of it, 10 would be it. Also being early in the match the ref, rightfully, gave a warning.

If anything Mason should be up for attacking a player as he punched Micky that is a fairer description of "attack".

AND before anyone tries to tell me it was late...

get out of it. When you watch it in replay thats is SLOW motion. Normal speed it's not late. Robinson shows his back so he's either dummying or passing. Lockers would have been amateur not to have committed.

Correct the RFL are weak.

They should be kicking Brown out of the league for inciting violence from his own players.

Sour grapes i feel. It was a late hit but it was hardly malicious. The thing that worries me now is when we play hudds next week they are simply gonna be a bunch of dirty sh:thouses, in the full knowledge that, i'f last weeks game is anything to go by... that they wont get punished. And if they do get punished he will have even more to whinge and lose his dummy about.

Anybody now feel a few of the giants players have big red targets on them ready for other teams...they must really be thanking their coach for that. Robbo Mason and Fa'alogo must have done something really good to get such a target painted on them. Luke cos he's too small to look after himself and the other two for being his avengers.

I'm just a bit concerned that if Fa'alogo decides to target Lockers and Mickey Mac ain't on the pitch, then our lot are gonna look like a right bunch of fairies.



From what I've seen/heard of him the guy's an animal!

Let him, he'll get penalised and/or walk and we get territory up field.

If we keep our heads discipline wise then we'll put a similar score past them as we have too much for them out wide and we can handle their backs.

You're dead right , just thinking how desperately we need a headbusting player now Hock has gone, we really only have Mickey Mac who I feel could dish it out.

Didn't catch the full game last Sunday what happened with Mick and Mason?