You've randomly started counting LLS as major trophies when your original point (and Wigan total) was based on the Challenge Cup and Super League winners only.

Going back to your original point of the [u12[/u major trophies available during Wane's tenure then numbers for each club are as follows:

Leeds 5
Wigan 3
Hull 2
Warrington 1
St Helens 1

You can't seriously be trying to use that data as a reason to criticise Wane's performance?

Actually, someone further up the thread starting counting them which is why I started to use them also, I didn't use them originally, but if I had it would have made Waneys record even worse.

So revised totals with LLS are:

Leeds 6
Wigan 4
Hull 2
Warrington 2
St Helens 2
Huddersfield 1
Castelford 1

Which rather than making "Waneys(sic) record worse" actually makes it look even better in comparison to his peers.

Just for perspective, Shaun Wane didn't keep coughing possession up early in the tackle count, or keep missing one-on-one tackles. But very possibly that 'experienced first-teamer' did.

PS: I am not an habitual Wane defender. But I've no time for excuses from c&&p players either.

3 from 14

or

4 from 21

From the best-paid squad with two marquee players and the best academy, that your club benefits massively from.

Suggests it does.

Anyway ive made my point

Just out of interest how many Trophey’s would be an acceptable return for you?

I'd accept Maguires 3 out of 6

and also the controlled, organised, disciplined, professional behaviour, on and off the pitch.

feka, gleeson?

Both got rid of asap.

Next.

no they didnt, feka stayed, joel was shown the door

So basically you are saying we should win on average either the GF or CC every year otherwise it is an unacceptable return. Arrogant imo. Leeds, Warrington, St Helens, Hull (though not on today’s performance) and to a certain extent cas though they need to challenge regularly to be truly considered amongst the rest can then by your reasoning only have 1 Trophey between them per season.

Given the stature of the club, it’s academy and the ability of the players I would expect to challenge for trophies every year, which to be fair Wane has.

Yep, with the advantages we have had over the last few years we should be winning a trophy every year!

Not arrogant just honest.

Feka was shipped out at the first opportunity, Gleeson was sacked even after costing over 100 Grand that so-called tight Lenners stumped up!!

Joel wasn't sacked, he would have been under Maguire.

He was allowed to find another club asap.

HTH

so they got rid of him and didnt have to do a payout, Feka was given a new 1 year contarct after the assualt so your pretty worng.

At least do your research before you post.

The assault was 3 years before Maguire arrived at the club.

Feka was let go by Maguire due to lack of workload and lazy defence, that was one year after Maguire arrived.

Maguire had nothing to do with a new contract for Feka.

HTH

Mate, I understand some of the points you're trying to make but you're all over the place! 6 is twice as many as 4 (or 5 twice as many as 3), you count LLS for other teams and not for us in THE SAME statistical analysis, you fail to recognise making finals at all and completely ignore a WCC win, which only 1 other SL team has managed in the time period you're discussing. Talk about arguing to convenience! Perhaps you don't realise that deliberately sewing the data to suit your argument actually weakens it...

Anyway, on to the above little gem. You seriously suggest that Wigan should be winning half the available trophies year on year while the rest of the league, including Leeds, Saints, Warrington, Hull and Cas fight for the other half between them? Could you point to another competition where 1 team dominates to this degree? I'm struggling to think of one.

Scottish Premiership.
"It's a grand old team to play for"

You should read the thread.

It was 3 major out of 14

Then someone decided to include the LLS so I went with that and it became

4 out 21.

Under the 3 trophies available if we're using that formula Maguire won 3 out 6

50%

Oh, and yes, if your spending more than anyone else and has the best resources you should be winning something every year.

This ain't the premier league owned by Yanks, Arabs and Russians, it SL.

A pretty poor comp that we pay the best wages in.

Poor return, if you're happy with that, ok, but the thousands that aren't have voted with their wallets and feet.

Who decided to include it?
You decided to add LLS

Again. Wigan aren’t the best resourced or funded club and what makes you think you are paying more in wages than Leeds, Saints, Warrington, Hull, Cas, Huddersfield, Catalans and possibly more clubs?

Yes you have a fantastic academy and youth setup. So do Leeds and Saints at the very least.

The point being this isn’t the early 90’s when Wigan were so far ahead of everyone else. You have close competitors. It’s just daft to assume you should win 50% of the trophies available every year.
A trophy every other year is a good haul and should be applauded.

No, i didn't and haven't over time.

I used major domestic trophies to show how poor we have been under Wane.

If I had wanted to I could have had a better point if I included LLS

I didn't until someone further up the thread had started using it as a defence.

Read the thread lad, not just the posts you agree with.

Yes, we were spending more than any other club for the last few years..

Enjoy the road to survival,

And as if to prove the point your very first statistic is again incorrect. As the GF this year hasn't been played there has neither been 14 nor 21 completed competitions! What's more, you've been using this same argument since pretty early season so none of the 7th year competitions had been completed from a Wigan perspective. Don't you actually understand anything I've said? You're all over the place with your arguments and seem completely oblivious to the fact!

Where have I said I'm satisfied? Please point this out. Or are you once again trying to skew an argument in your favour erroneously? That was a rhetorical question by the way..

As for the 50% of all trophies garbage you're spouting, I asked for other examples where this was the case. You mentioned premiership football where success can still be bought and, even here, no individual team dominates in the manner you're suggesting. Someone in the premiership is spending more than everyone else. By your reckoning they should be winning at least 50% of all available trophies. Why are they not? Shall I tell you why? Because it's a completely unrealistic scenario. Now factor in the fact that our club exists in a salary capped and income restricted sport, where any advantage in spend is limited to say the least, and the proposition becomes even more fanciful!

Our trophy haul is comparable to the top few performers in any professional team sport in the world with very few exceptions. If you broaden this to include final appearances we would be among the very top few percent. For some reason this is an unacceptable situation in Ziggy world. Get real mate!

No one is arguing that we should be satisfied. As a club we should always strive to improve (that's the bit we agree on). However, suggesting anything less than 50% of all available trophies is a failure is both arrogant and ridiculous.

My first point will be correct in around 8 weeks time, but your foaming at the mouth really amuses me.

I understand fully everything you have said....but...i Disagree with you.

I think you're wrong.

Who's the player? Sorry if it's been revealed.