INOUT One error in this.post and that's mentioning Marshall in it!!! He is quality. Best winger at the club imo

It's time that some supporters stopped blaming Lam and whoever is the Coach and faced the fact that the first team squad is not as good as a Wigan squad should be in class, experience and size and the people to blame are those running the club, Lenagan and Radlinski.

It has taken Leeds around four or five seasons to get over the loss of their great team led by Sinfield, but now they are more or less back to normal while we are heading in the same direction as they were as a result of having a squad made up of players who should be retired by now, players not good enough and young forwards especially at prop who are lacking in experience and size like other clubs. Wigan are the only top club which does not have any of the big and experienced South Sea Island players from down under like you see at other Super League clubs.

In yesterday's game, again led by a captain who only plays in odd games and again in the short time he was on the field, dropped the ball and give away a penalty and now is a pale shadow of what he was at his peak.

Sorry, having to say this but when you have seen many of the great players over a period of fifty years or so supporting the club, you then start to ask yourself, what the hell is Lenagan and Radlinski playing at where the signing of top class players both from this country and down under is concerned?

I have often thought that our teams always seem unbalanced. Yesterday John Wilkin said that you should always find a place for your best players even if they are out of position but looking at our teams I cannot agree. Two good full backs but only one good centre in the team is ludicrous. We have lots of good young forwards but no real strike middles. We have plenty of tacklers but are light in the kicking department and most of all we do not have a plan B.

We've only got one good centre, and he wasn't available!



Although,seriously, Hardaker is not a great centre, but he does a job for us there and puts in a good shift. As someone pointed out the other day, for a player who came here under a cloud, but to play at full-back, who has been dumped from that position in favour of Bevan French, and shifted to centre, which he doesn't like as much, he had knuckled down and become a steady, reliable, if not spectacular performer. I was one one of many who were very dubious about signing him in the first place, but I think he's earned the respect of fans with his efforts on the pitch.

And we are lighter still when we keep our best kicker on the bench until the game is already lost!

Fairly straight forward for me:

5 derbies, Anfield Magic weekend, Camp Neu, Wire in last years cup, Salford in Semi for grand final and Leeds yesterday.

We have choked in every big game under Lammys stewardship

Bit of a rambling post, but...

I've been thinking about this quite a bit over the last few weeks and one of the main things that irritates me about our current side is we're just too unstructured. I think Lam has an idea/style in his head and we're just too wedded to it and that comes at the cost of performance.

Do we set up to build pressure - no. Do we look like a team that has a plan for certain situations - no. We do look like a team that's been encouraged to play what's in front of them and have some freedom.

It's great when it works (Catalan's away), but when it doesn't work or the weather dictates style (yesterday) you realise that putting all your eggs in one basket, or giving lads loads of freedom isn't always good. Yesterday was the day for structure i.e Hastings not going into DH on the 4th, or looking to French to find a gap. It was the day for high attrition, kicks to the corner, tough defence and planned moves. Sadly that's something Lam doesn't seem to believe in.

It's not all doom and gloom tho. Under the right coach there's a decent side in there imo. When they want to do it, our defence is decent and there's a good crop of players with time on their side.

It's almost like the Madge era i.e one signing and it's a different side. If you stuck Deacon in that side yesterday i think it would have been much closer. Or if we had a prop that took the game by the scruff of the neck then we're a different side.

I don’t even think we look like a side that’s been told to just play what in front of them and to try things though. We don’t kick early, we don’t chip over the top, we don’t offload, we don’t see players talking to each other and attempting to plan things on the hoof when they see space or see numbers on one side.

We’re just a nothing side as things stand from a game plan point of view. We don’t have a style of play and just look like we’re being thrown out on the field.

You're probably right, but that makes it worse I guess.

Lam must be happy for Hastings to keep jumping in at DH tho? We're quite fluid in some regards like that and for me it has to be something the team has spoken about / the coaches are happy with. If not you'd expect him to be told to get back in his box. It's been highlighted on here loads just how many occasions he dies with a ball on the 4th. We've spotted it, so I'm sure someone at the club has too. I don't know any other HB that does this?

This will be controversial to some, but for me the jury is still out on French too. He's a fantastic and instinctive ball runner, but he's not the complete player many make him out to be. It's a mute point, but if you compare him to say Tomkins the differences are night and day. French was talked up as a HB option and has 6 on his back, but ST actually started his career at 6 and you can tell which one has that organising HB brain.

With Hastings thinking he's a part time 9, we could really do with an organising 3rd pivot out that back. Someone that will demand the ball and stretch the defence with not only runs, but passes and kicks too.

Can you have two mavericks at 1 and 6?

I think as others have said in this thread, the problems we face will not be solved by bringing in a new coach. Our recruitment and player retention strategy has been poor for some time, leaving us with a squad that is imbalanced in a number of ways. Our focus on youth is laudable, and I enjoy seeing these lads getting a run in the first team, but we've crying out for real size in the forwards for years. Bullock is a step in the right direction as is Burgess if he was fit, but we need bigger bodies who can do damage in attack and defence. The game yesterday was the type of game that exposed us badly in that respect (without taking any credit from Leeds who were excellent).

More than anything, I'm getting tired of what I think is sentimentality about the town's tradition in the sport and ex-Wigan players, which I assume comes from the top. Lockers was very poor yesterday, this myth about him being brought out like a vintage car for the special occasion is nonsense, he doesn't get enough game time and it showed yesterday. The Edwards fiasco was for me, pure sentimentality, which we doubled down on by bringing another ex-player in as interim coach. The focus on youth is another sign of the same thing and it no longer seems to make sense financially, because a lot of these lads see SL as a stepping stone to the NRL so we rarely keep them until they reach their prime. If you look at the backroom staff, it's the same story.

At the end of the day, we're all Wiganers, we all know the history of the club, its great PR to say '8 of these 13 came through the wigan academy' but actually winning big games and building on our legacy is the best kind of PR.

You've made my weekend! Hope it's true.

If coaching was just a matter of saying, go out there and do what you think best, lads, then you or I could do the job.

#

Correct, and some supporters should stop blaming Lam and aim their comments more towards those running the club as some of the signings over the past couple or so seasons from outside the club have not been to the standard expected by supporters. I suspect the reason is financial as a result of the mistakes made with the Millwall game and the trip to Australia, plus the cost of having to move the club HQ from Montrose Avenue to Robin Park Arena where a office block has had to be built and the facilities upgraded. St Helens had similar problems on the playing side when they were involved in the move from Knowsley Road to their new Stadium. It may explain why some shares of the club owned by Lenagan have been sold to another millionaire in order to boost the finances of the club or even offset any losses which have now not been helped by the present Covid-19 virus situation.

Admittedly it's a weird old season
But Adrian Lam wins the league leaders shield for Wigan
Could he yet deliver the SLGF trophy too?

Do you guys still want him out?

His team selection in a fortnight will be his big test, got a horrible feeling he'll pick Burgess and O'Loughlin and that's us basically playing with 15 men, hope I'm wrong or if I'm not the two mentioned prove me wrong big time.

Whilst not denying how good we’ve played recently (exception to the Hudds game but we were never going to come out with the same intensity as v Saints) - yes.

I think a lot of the points raised in this thread prior still stand. I’m happy for the LLS win, and happy we’re in an advantageous position but as others have pointed out that has now raised expectations and cranked up the pressure. If we wither and die in the play offs all the good will he’s garnered will evaporate. I don’t think a GF win will save him, for me he’s probably already got a 2021 contract nor do I think it’s GF or bust for him for the same reasons but as I’ve said expectations are now higher.

Never wanted him out and still won't if he doesn't win the GF. As I've mentioned on several previous posts I'm not sure he's had a fair crack of the whip and, given the circumstances, he's done Ok. Still something to prove for sure but I'd like to see what he was capable of when the season was just about rugby and not the Edwards fiasco, Covid etc.

If they win the SLGF, the usual suspects will still not be happy, but they will not say that IL and KR have not made a wrong decision in the appointment of Lam as they never see them ever making any wrong decision.

You cannot have it both ways, by calling the Coach and wanting him to go, but heap praise on the ones who make the decisions which include the appointment of a Coach.

I won't beat around the bush. For 2 seasons we have been woeful (especially in the big games) and the last few weeks have been chalk and cheese in comparison. If we go into the play off semi with the same intensity we have shown and get to the GF and then even lose the GF without choking like we have against Leeds CC semi for example then i will begrudgingly give him another year. I was one of the ones until recently that was all for him Staying. My patience ran out against Hull KR but lets see how the rest of the season goes. Another debacle in the semi and its a big 'NO' from me.

Sign him up for me.

Do I expect to win the SL title this year? No.

Can we win it? Yes but I think this team is a year away from maturing enough to be considered favourites.

So far I think the team has improved, the style of rugby has improved, the entertainment on display has improved and individual players have improved under Lam.

I think if you look at the team and rumoured signing and confirmed (Field & Bateman) he is building his squad with an aggressive tough pack and bags of pace and flair in the backs.

The discipline and silly penalties have been removed from our game which allows us to build pressure so much more effectively.

Great example on Friday when the Giants were having to carry set after set off their line, in the past I always expected an offside for being too eager or a totally unnecessary Faz laying on penalty. They seem to be a thing of the past.

I think he is doing a fantastic job to be honest, I’d take him off the rolling year and give him a 2 year deal without hesitation.

I appreciate the Leeds semi was a massive disappointment and that seems to be a major black mark against him. In all honestly I don’t think any team in SL would have beaten Leeds that day. The conditions played into their hands and their forwards were unbelievable, sometimes you just have to give credit to the opposition.

With the exception of Burgess for obvious reasons his recruitment has been first class.

Bar the last month we must of been watching two different teams as we have been poor in many matches and obviously choked big time in every big game.
We still look like we don't actually have a game plan or set moves, but its all opinion's i suppose.

I cannot see Lam being given the heave ho. Despite the circumstances he finished top of the pile and that counts for something. At last the defence seems to have been organised to allow the rest of the team to play. In the forwards we can all see that we are one dominant prop short and someone need to carry the can for the George Burgess fiasco but probably not Lam. Other than that we look as good for next season as I can remember. The backs worry me because I like to see pace outside and our wingers all seem to be broken.
I think that we look better balanced when we can go with three forwards and a back on the bench so seeing Clubb, O'loughlin and Burgess keeping a single seat warm is a really frightening prospect. A real test of Lams leadership qualities will be if he can say to those three "Sorry lads but you have not done enough to warrant inclusion".

Of course you can.

Some coaches work out, others don't.

Look at the appointment of Ian Millward. A total success at Saints, a disaster at Wigan.

It's never as simple as you guys who are constantly (and pointlessly) lobbying for the chairman's removal always claim.

Adrian Lam is here because Ian Lenagan made one mistake: trusting Shaun Edwards. Line that up against all his trophy wins and he doesn't look like so much of a catastrophe..

This GF semi is the big test for Lam. If we win then he's safe. If the team perform as they have done in the past three semis under his coaching then he will go. Perhaps not for 2021 as IL could well sign him for a year which will give him 12 months to find a quality coach.
Come 2022 and it's the club's 150th anniversary when all expectations from everyone associated with the club will be a trophy (s). Having a coach in place in 2022 who can't win semis is quite simply not an option.
So this GF semi is massively important for Lam.

With the 150 year anniversary, are we forgetting the few years in which we didn't exist?