It's not 1 game though. He hasn't hit the standards we expected all year. Keep citing those useless stats on the SL website. Most people know they are garbage.

[urlhttp://www.superleague.co.uk/statistics_player.php?hs1=2009&hp1=374&hs2=2009&hp2=2075&stat=tries&season=2009[/url

There is the mystic stats of Higham and Riddell - same amount of games.

Whether you think Higham's is worse or better but only just - either way Mark Riddell has not been a significant enough improvement from Mickey Higham. Regardless whether you think he is better than him or not.

The fact is if Mark Riddell was significantly better than Higham we would not be having these arguments/debates on the matter because it would be obvious by his performances on the pitch.

I can't help but think back to somebody like Craig Smith when looking at Riddells contribution so far.

It like Smiths in his first year has been ok but probably not as good as we'd all expected. Riddell again like Smith carried an injury into this his first season and has picked up another couple of knocks during it.

I know it probably sounds like i'm trying to make excuses for him but i realise he must improve. I also realise he can improve and that overseas players need time to settle in.

We were all too quick to write off Smith, Richards etc and hopefully Riddell will improve like one of those.

Tim Smith had not played the game for a while before he came and Pat Richards was played out of position at centre.

This whole idea of "overseas players taking time to settle" is inconsistent because it didn't apply to Trent Barrett or Steve Renouf etc.

I didn't know Riddell was carrying a knock - if he has been doing then that makes Noble's decision all the more bizarre to include him. Why not let him rest and get fit seems as Michael McIlorum is in fantastic form and Sam Tomkins is in brilliant form as well.

Riddell must improve in the next few weeks/months otherwise it will have proved to have been a naff signing altogether because people will still question whether he has been an improvement from Higham. Make that a vast/significant improvement from Higham because if he isn't then what is the point in bringing someone half way around the world, taking up an overseas quota spot if we can do better with the players we already have at the club - i.e Thomas Leuluai and Michael McIlorum.

I was on about Craig Smith not Tim who carried a knock throughout the whole of his first season.

I'm not saying Riddell has been as good as we'd have hoped for as that would be a complete lie but i still believe he could be. I was only on here last week saying we should be looking only at players that would defo improve the side and thats nothing else would do. I agree Riddell hasn't been an improvment on Higham just yet but i feel he has alot more to give.

He missed out on the friendly at Leigh in pre season after getting injured in training and carried that into the start of the year after being a doubt for the Wakey game.

Even his iffy form has been as good as Highams best so we could still be proved right in letting Higham go and replacing him with Riddell.

I just think all us Wigans fans should have learned by now that patience will sometimes bring you results. We've rushed into far too many things in the past only to realise we maybe should have just given certain individuals a little more time.

The majority of people on this forum change their minds week in week out, one minute it's 'McLorum isn't good enough' then it's 'McLorum should be in the side week in week out!' ... You all did the same with Tim Smith, 'Smith is Sh!t'... Then it's 'Smith is brilliant' - Wigan fans are the worst for this, they are so two faced it's unbelievable.

Let's be honest, Sam Tomkins in that Hull KR game would have been smashed around the pitch, you all seen the amount of big hits in the game, they would have targeted him every time... They were constantly heading at Smith, and they would have done the same against Sam... Simple as that.

I presume that Riddell is earning substantially more than Higham did, so to say that Wigan were right to replace one with the other doesn't make sense.

Ignoring the Higham thing (for now) as Higham defiantley won't be playing for Wigan on Friday, and to get back on topic re Sam.

Are we in agreement that Tommy, Smith, Sam, Piggy and Mickey Mac can't all be in the same 17?

1) We don't know what the injury situation is particularly regarding Micky Mac and he didn't look well as he left the field on Friday.

2) If we assume they are all fit, which one would you leave out, and why?

I have championed McIlorum for years and been pilloried (mainly by Saints fans) for suggesting he would be a future International.

However, I believe (at this time) we would be better served with Piggy starting, Timmy and Tommy starting and Sam on the bench.

My reasoning
Piggy passes the ball better, makes more metres, misses less tackles and makes less errors.

Over to you.

Statistics, statistics, statistics.

As I said earlier, Fatlad is a seasoned ex-NRL superstar, and here we are discussing whether he should be displaced by an upcoming young kid from the Academy.

The mere fact that we are having this discussion should be enough to tell you that Riddell is not living up to the hype, most of which, admittedly, comes from you.

When I go to watch my team I want to see players that put in inspiring performances. I want to see players who look like they want to win. I want to see players who are willing to put their bodies on the line for the club.

One of the players we are talking about does that, the other one is merely additional weight that we are having to carry around the field.

Riddell is currently stealing a living at Wigan.

We were promised a larger than life character who would add another dimension to the team. What we got was a little boy lost, who looks like he can't wait to get back home.

I wouldn't presume nothing on that score tbh.

Higham was signed by Lindsay from Saints via Bradford making him think he'd got one over on the old enemy. He took Newtons place in the squad and more then likely his wage which will have been a good one.

On the other hand Riddell has been signed by Lenagan who seems to be a very shrewd businessman and huge salaries will be a thing of the past.

He won't be playing for Wigan thats for sure ! viewtopic.php?t=410925

He won't be playing for Wigan thats for sure ! viewtopic.php?t=410925

Quote ="wireontour"He won't be playing for Wigan thats for sure ! viewtopic.php?t=410925 '" Sam is playing for Wigan at Warrington this weekend.

Quote ="wireontour"He won't be playing for Wigan thats for sure ! viewtopic.php?t=410925 '" Sam is playing for Wigan at Warrington this weekend.

what train do i need to get for warrington??

Ask Sam

He can't afford a car?

Jinkin Jimmy posted on here ages ago Higham was on £70K and that the info came from Millward himself.

If Higham was on a fortune why, when Higham, Calderwood and Barrett all left were the only senior players recruited were Robert and Riddell?

Now granted we gave some of the junior player a pay rise but if those three were on the fortunes some would have us believe we could have done that AND signed either more seasoned pros or a the odd genuine super star. We did neither so something doesn't add up.

Either these players were not on the money people think or we spent it Roberts, Riddell and the young players.



Seasoned NRL pros don't come over here for three years for peanuts. He will IMO be on a fair old whack and I'd guess more than the £70K suggested for Higham.

Dave

Nobody knows for sure though do they?

IMO Highams former deal and Riddells current deal won't be miles apart but i could be totally wrong.

As for abilities i likes Higham yet he did have his flaws but so does Riddell. I never totally went along with this idea that he couldn't pass from dummy half as sometimes it could be pretty good and again Riddell's isn't the greatest from what we've seen so far.

I do however believe Riddell will improve and thats all we can really concentrate on because he's here and Higham not.

Don't forget that Pryce started to count on the cap too.

Word on the street is that Hansen is back in this week.

and we've signed Gleeson who'll be on alot more then Mathers was on.

Should be in for some even harder hitting in defense then

He should be at the expense of Joel Tomkins if everyone is fit although i get the feeling we may be missing a couple through injury after that bruiser last week.

does anyone know sams preferred position. we know he will play anywhere to get in the team but the only time i spoke to him which was last season he said he wanted to be a scrum half not a stand off.
as for smith taking his place i would not let smith in wigan never mind in the team.

So Pryce, Riddell and Roberts plus some pay rises for the younger players took up the fortune we are supposed to have paid Barrett, Higham and Calders? People suggest these three were all on mega bucks but the quality of the recruits since they left suggests otherwise to me.

Unless of course we are paying too much for those three "new" players.

Dave

Gleeson?