Then by definition you are classing everyone with 2 jabs or less as unvaccinated as the media campaign and everywhere you look is saying;

“Every adult in the country now needs to get a Covid-19 booster vaccine, because two doses does not give you enough protection against catching Omicron.”

No it doesn't give you "Enough", but that doesn't mean it doesn't give you something

No it's nit, and it oy isn't worse due to the vaccine roll out
If the ones tour talking about don't want to jabe that's fine, no one on here has said mandatory jabs should be on place
But don't expect everyone to standby and take in/believe the rubbish to justify their stance.

It's absolutely the case that most per capita ICUs and deaths are happening in unvaccinated (and youd be surprised it is now getting more and more younger ones).

Don't be surprised in response when people remind everyone of that.
(I suppose that's my way of saying I won't keep responding I'd other people don't keep pushing).

So in summary what you are saying is that Omicron is more deadly than flu but the only reason that the data doesn’t suggest it is more deadly than flu is because people are vaccinated with two doses.

But you now need another dose to reduce your risk of catching Omicron and going into hospital becoming seriously ill as the ‘majority’ as you say are unvaccinated in these hospitals and ICU. Again, can you define unvaccinated?

Most of the experts have said that having a low general level of covid is desirable as it reduce the risk of new strains, which is an argument for us all getting vaxxed.
That said, if you believe it’s a ploy by big pharma, Hitler is alive in Argentina, Armstrong didn’t walk on the moon, Trump won the election etc then don’t take the vaccine, but by effectively ‘opting out’, I think you should lose your rights to healthcare if you do get it.
Travel insurance providers now state in their covid cover If you’ve refused any doses of the vaccine or haven’t been able to have a dose you’ve been offered, you won’t be covered.

Maybe the same approach should be taken for the circa 30% of the population who are obese and pose a significant risk on the NHS regardless of whether Covid is here or not.

I'm saying covid is more deadly than flu (because other strains do exist.)
And I do know that yes, less people are dying than would have if 40/50million hadn't had one/both are all 3 of the jabs.

WRT what I mean by unvaccinated is this, someone who has had NONE of the jabs.

The debate is more nuanced as there will be people who sit in between No jab and all 3 inc booster jabbed.
Some people who haven't had the booster may be because until very recently they weren't able.

Anyway, I can see your trying to as you and the others have been for the last 2 weeks on this thread trying to complicate the issue to distract from the simplicity of the debate.

So again

If you are fully vaccinated with 3 vaccines, like for like with a comparable person of age/health etc. Then you are safer than if you have 2, far safer than if you have had 1 and FAR FAR FAR FAR more safer than of you haven't had any.

It not that difficult to understand

Not trying to complicate just don’t see how you can say and or prove that without facts and the facts aren’t available due to the comparisons not being the same.

Out of interest in your opinion at what point does this stop as in how many more boosters do you think will be needed?

Point no1 - Based on that analogy then you can never make any statistical analysis of any medical issue as no 2 people or circumstances are the same
The statistics/analysis is based on Numbers - and If based on numbers there are 10 x times more people Partially or fully vaccinated than unvaccinated and the Vaccine doesn't help then there should be 10 x times the number of vaccinated in ICU/Dying - There aren't
I haven't fully researched (Not that it would matter as much as I am neither a Medical expert, Scientific expert or Expert data analyst) but I have recently been pointed in the direction of a guy who Debunks people throwing around untrue statistical nonsense of FB - From what I have read he seems spot on however one of the key points he makes lately, and it is something I have previously said to my family & friends on this subject, is that it takes 10mins to someone to write 5 things that are absolute rubbish on FB/Twitter etc. and it takes him 10 hours to prove 1 of those things wrong & complete rubbish. By which time 10million people have seen it and same said person and Hundreds of others have wrote hundreds more bits of Rubbish.
Zack Berman BTW

Point No2 - I don't know - I'm not an expert
But a bit like when WW2 was on and the Germans were bombing I won't open my curtains just because I don't agree with the war, Don't like Churchill, Don't like the bloke next door who is off fighting the war, Won't listen to the fellow in the local pub who's making his own facts up etc. or I'm just peed off because "I don't know how long this is going to last".
I'll use a bit of common sense and if what I am being asked and statistically/Logically and with a bit of common sense I agree with it I'll do my bit to help myself, my family and others.
If the family (He/She) next door keep there's on that's up to them, but he shouldn't be surprised if he gets a mouthful back when he does or when they try to convince others that leaving that light on is the best thing to do

For those who like facts, these figures have come out today from the Intensive Care National Audit & Research Centre.

Basically if you don't fancy your chances of going infection - hospital - ICU - morgue, get vaccinated.

like I said earlier my sister is a nurse on ICU, when I spoke to her last EVERY covid admission was unvaxed and varied in age and conditions, people in their 30's with no condition are still dying from covid, thats a fact

Thank You








And that's all that we have been trying to say

If someone doesn't want it good luck, I don't agree, and I don't like how it COULD affect others however it's something I don't believe should be forced

But for anyone to say "We don't know what's in it" or "It's killing more than it's saving" or "More people are getting Covid because they are vaxxed than Unvaccinated (I know

I had this one thrown at me today!) is living in cuckoo land.

Another poster on the forum has a partner who works on the ward as you say above.
Their experience is exactly the same and weirdly enough said the same thing about people in their 30s/40s dying from it.
But Hey, what do they know

But but I saw a guy on YouTube and he said that’s rubbish

**Insert copy and pasted text from said YouTube nutter**

Add a word like ‘interesting’ at the end


That’s it, I’ve finished my response template and I’m ready to tackle all future factual statistics posted.

The old favourite is ‘there’s an awful lot of sports people taking ill or dropping dead since the vaccine was introduced’.

Aye, let’s just ignore the illness the vaccine has been introduced to tackle. The illness that has not only killed millions worldwide but is leaving many people with long term health problems.

Boom! Thankyou. Someone else agreed with me. Absolutely no reason for any single person to be obese. It’s just pure laziness and the amount of illness that is caused by being obese far outweighs Covid. And before anyone pipes up “I have illness that makes me fat” no you don’t, you just consume more calories than your body needs. It’s just your illness means you require less calories than normal.

Any person that is obese, especially when they have young kids need to take a long hard look at themselves. They are just selfish. I wouldn’t mind but it’s not even hard to lose weight. It’s simple

There isn’t a single medical condition in the world that makes you put on weight. It’s just an excuse that lazy people make for being overweight. The medical condition may mean you need less calories each day but it’s still the individual that decided to eat a bacon butty every day and put weight on

Those who eat fatty foods, takeaways etc and eat far more than they need of the bad stuff pay more tax (cos they consume more and the unhealthy stuff is subject to VAT).

How much "stupid tax" do you think we should bill an unvaccinated person who occupies a hospital bed with covid?

It’s gone awfully quiet since some facts were posted in.

To those that think it’s just a bad cold or another flu then how do you explain:

1 - at least 1 million people in the UK now living with long covid

2 - In total, there were 14,102 deaths registered in the week to 17 December, which was 14% above the five-year average. (in the UK and taken from BBC).

You have got to be joking, I’m summary what you are saying is it’s ok for people to be unhealthy because they pay ‘more’ tax by default due to the amount they eat.

On your last point, I thought that nobody was advocating mandatory vaccination yet you want to tax people for not having it? If said unvaccinated person doesn’t occupy a hospital bed do they get the tax back?

Quote ="nathan_rugby"It’s gone awfully quiet since some facts were posted in.'" If by facts you mean the table that was posted a page or so back then it doesn’t tell the full story. I am on my phone so unable to post a picture but here is a full report from the website that the original screenshot was taken from, check out page 46 of 95 which tells a different story. Go figure… https://www.icnarc.org/DataServices/Att ... 505601089b

Quote ="nathan_rugby"It’s gone awfully quiet since some facts were posted in.'" If by facts you mean the table that was posted a page or so back then it doesn’t tell the full story. I am on my phone so unable to post a picture but here is a full report from the website that the original screenshot was taken from, check out page 46 of 95 which tells a different story. Go figure… https://www.icnarc.org/DataServices/Att ... 505601089b

Again, doesn’t tell the full story

What isn’t full?

Quote ="WiganRL12345"If by facts you mean the table that was posted a page or so back then it doesn’t tell the full story. I am on my phone so unable to post a picture but here is a full report from the website that the original screenshot was taken from, check out page 46 of 95 which tells a different story. Go figure… https://www.icnarc.org/DataServices/Att ... 505601089b'" Aren’t you proving yourself wrong with the first bar chart on this page? For December it shows more unvaccinated in critical care than vaccinated ? Second bar chart proves nothing. Because 90% of the population are vaccinated of course you would see more in hospital than vaccinated but we are talking on a % basis. What don’t you understand?

Quote ="WiganRL12345"If by facts you mean the table that was posted a page or so back then it doesn’t tell the full story. I am on my phone so unable to post a picture but here is a full report from the website that the original screenshot was taken from, check out page 46 of 95 which tells a different story. Go figure… https://www.icnarc.org/DataServices/Att ... 505601089b'" Aren’t you proving yourself wrong with the first bar chart on this page? For December it shows more unvaccinated in critical care than vaccinated ? Second bar chart proves nothing. Because 90% of the population are vaccinated of course you would see more in hospital than vaccinated but we are talking on a % basis. What don’t you understand?

They don't want to understand

They want to talk % in hospital when it comes to people in hospital, and its been explained and proven a thousand times that yes 60/65% in hospital are vaccinated, thats because 10x times more people are vaccinated.
However, per 100,000 there are something like 5 x times more in hospital that are unvaccinated

However
The table provided by WLA proves that the vast vast majority of people (whether its pure numbers or even more so per 100,00) are unvaccinated.
End of

Next we will here :-
Ah but
Whatabout
Look at this (and you spend an hour down a rabbit hole looking at unsubstantiated rubbish and/or stuff that got nothing to do with what you were talking about and by the time you come back there's another dozen bit sof absolute rubbish).
You can't say that the vaccinated are better off because they may have been better off if they hadn't had it

And end up 90% plus more likely lely to end up in ICU/morgue, yeah that makes sense.

Along with the current:-
That's not the full story etc.
You can't make comparisons because each person is different (btw, there may be something in this, maybe there are more unvaccinated in hospital because they are also smokers/obese/alcoholics/have underlying conditions? But hang on qrent you making out the unvaccinated are cleverer/healthier than us Sheep?).

All the while you camt get a coherent explanation of what exactly they are trying to say without the usual Big Pharma/MSM rubbish

If there is a "More nuanced conversation" to be had then I will let the Scientists/experts etc. Have it.