Sione Matautia = 6'2" 16st 4 (from Sts website)

Kaide Ellis = 6'3" 16st 6 (from Wigan website before they stopped putting those stats on)

PS Apologies if you were joking.

Yeah I rate Ellis highly too and agree that overall he was our best prop over the season.

Puts himself about and obviously a physically fit lad. Personally I don’t mind his disciplinary record as long as he isn’t retaliating to verbals.
Havard, quite rightly, gets the plaudits because of his age and his exceptionally high level of fitness however, he’s had a few injury issues which hopefully are not going to effectively his game longer term.
Byrne for me still has the most potential. At times for me unjustified criticism has tainted his progression and I always enjoy it when he’s pitched against Walmsley when I think we see the “real” Liam Byrne.
A long long time since we had so much potential in our front row and that’s before our recent recruits.

Its a joke referring back to a Saints fan saying they have no worries about their front row next year and that Matautia could play prop as he was bigger than Ellis

Byrne just needs to find his top gear a bit more often and if he can do that, he could be extremely good. His form for about 6 weeks prior to his injury was pretty special, so we just need to see a bit more of that going forward. It looks like Smithies will leave, so Byrne would be my man to help support Brad O’Neill in being the leaders of our aggression and line speed at the start of games.

I'm a big, big fan of Byrne and have been for a while. He's only recently turned 24 so loads of time for him to really reach his potential & sort out any consistency stuff.

I've said before that, if we let him go to a Salford etc then a Leeds, Wire or even Saints will be snapping him up in a couple of years time.

I really hope he stays and smashes it for us.

I assumed it must be. Apologies

Would be criminal to move Ellis to 13. Having props who can do big minutes is a massive bonus, which him & Havard can both do. Opens your options for proper impact props up, and means if you're blooding the younger lads there's no pressure for them to be doing anything more than 30 mins.

A good point re Smithies leaving. I think that Byrne is actually at his best leading the defensive line per my earlier comment re Byrne on Walmsley. I don’t think that Byrne is better with the ball in hand than Walmsley but his aggression in defence can nullify someone like Walmsley.
As you say his form prior to his injury and importantly after a brief break was what I think he is capable of most weeks.
With the new additions to the squad this will put pressures on Byrne to maintain his position in the 17 but I’m quietly confident that he will respond well to the challenge.

I would be very disappointed if he did depart. If he did become available like you say there would be plenty of teams chasing his signature.
I’m hoping that in 2024 we will see a more mature and consistent Byrne which will put pressure on the club to retain him with improved terms.

I’m hoping that competition will really drive him as well. He’s a nailed on starter for me ‘if’ he plays in a similar way to how he was playing in that latter period of the season. He was absolutely smashing people all over the show and that’s ideal to set the tone. As things stand with the squad currently (and assuming Smithies departs), I’d be looking at starting Byrne and Ellis and bringing Dupree and Havard from the bench, with Thompson at loose forward. To think that leaves Mago, Cooper, Hill, Chan and Eseh in the stands is pretty amazing.

I keep seeing fans’ teams for next year on Twitter and they have Ellis missing out, I don’t see where they get it from, I do agree that he was our best prop in 2023. He’s the most underrated prop in the league, a few decisions in the disciplinary don’t go his way at times but we’ve had that for a number of years with Isa. Played just under an hour in the GF and played the first 36 mins, that’s some effort.

Ellis had a VERY good season, particularly the second half after his ban from the cup game.

Squad number wise, I’d like to see Havard 8 Byrne 10 Ellis 13.

Unless we sign a rugby Union player.

Agreed, Ellis was outstanding at 13 away at wire.

Yea I do see Ellis taking a starting position. He’s got great intensity in the opening spell.

Is there any news on returns for Cooper, Harvard and Byrne? Also is Thompson fit to start the season?

Cooper will be back late April.

Thompson played in the bulldogs last game so assume he’s fully fit.

Byrne I think was 8-10 weeks so he should be fine.

No idea on Havard.

With Ellis, Mago, Byrne, Dupree and to a lesser extent Eseh and Hill (not doubting ability just a lot to rely on young lads) we should be fine for the first half of the season.

Thompson can cover prop and 13 with maybe O’Neil just with question marks over the people outgoing Shorrocks and Powell

Leeming cover 9 and O’Neil possibly Rocky?

Don’t have to rush the injured back then

Just looking at that list. Ellis and Byrne as starting will be as good as any in the League. Mago and Dupree as impact props could be exactly that and more. Second row Farrell and Walters, loose Thompson.
Nsemba off the bench 2nd row and O'Neil off the bench to 9 or 13.
Some pack that is!

Still think O’Neil starts with Leeming off the bench after 25 mins.

He’s more suited to scooting and attacking fatigued players.

Possibly & that's what I'd go for too.

Isn't that what Leeming kicked off about at Leeds though? That being said, has anyone read the interview he's done with the Titans? He makes a point about saying he's the 80mins he's got as well as the 5 min stints too.

Hopefully he's changed his tune re not being a starter?

O’Neill should get the 9 shirt and the starting spot for me. I think he’s earned that over this past couple of seasons and for such a young lad, he’s showing a great level of maturity and leadership.

Leeming will know his role you’d imagine and will have said yes to the club based on that. I think we’ll see both on the field at times, with O’Neill at 13.

One thing I think we can be confident on - if Peet gets any attitude from Leeming regarding minutes he'll be heading through the exit door pretty quickly. He won't put up with any threat to the team culture.

Potentially O'Neill and Leeming could be a very good combo for Wigan but it would likely work best with Leeming coming off the bench. There's also Tom Forber waiting in the wings.

100% and like NK said, I'm sure those conversations will have been had. If we're going well, I'm sure it won't be an issue.

I’m surprised that Wigan signed Leeming, I thought we should have been promoting Forber.

It’s an interesting one.

I personally don’t think Forber is ready to be a first team regular yet but I think if he continues to be developed he may be ready in 2 years, but we will still have Leeming and O’Neil.

Forber is another that needs to be on loan to a SL club preferably.

I see the logic in his signing but for me its 2 years too long. 2 years with an option for another in the clubs favour would have been a smarter move. If he wouldnt accept that then he could have gone elsewhere