The details will come out, Marwan Koukash has confirmed that Hock will issue a statement and his version of events today. The fact England didnt do this in the first instance shows just how poor the management set-up. We are 3 days away from the first game of a World Cup, rather than hiding behind a "serious breach of discipline" comment which will get supporters, press etc speculating and detract from what we should all be talking about, they should have sought immediate legal advice and issued a statement this morning detailing the exact reasons for their decision. Everyone can then move on and there is no obscurity.

Unless Gareth Hock has been taking drugs, going out on the p*ss or fighting I am struggling to see what warrants immediate explusion from the squad and a serious breach of team discipline. Then you have to ask if he has been fighting/out on the p*ss there must have been more than him involved.

The sooner we know what has gone on the better.

It's probably worth noting that the statement from the RFL is "serious breach[ues[/u of team discipline", ie [iplural[/i. So reading between the lines this looks like a last straw dismissal to me.
The RFL have already said they won't make any more statements on the matter, so we'll only have Hock's version this afternoon sometime.
Although no doubt the gossip will continue for a while (especially if we're hammered on Saturday).

I believe its just Hock.

We'll all be interested to know, because yes, it has badly affected the build-up to prestigious tournament, and heads should roll.

But understand, from a Wigan fan's POV, this is a very old story. The last time Gareth was in trouble at Wigan, we had people whispering all kinds of calumny about everyone from the head coach to the kit-man, in order to exonerate the guy. And this was AFTER Wigan had stood by him during the drugs scandal - so loyalty to a favourite player can run so deep that at some point it may become irrational.

By all means try to widen the blame - others must have been involved, etc - but even if that's true, it doesn't negate Gareth's responsibility, and won't necessarily mean that he wasn't the instigator, the ringleader, the worst of the bunch, call it what you will. He's the one who's been kicked out. Nobody else. Which is a pretty damning indictment.

By the way, it wouldn't surprise me at all if the England management were in some way culpable. They are pretty useless themselves. The mere selection of Hock was the first big error they made, at least with regard to matters of team discipline.

Don’t get me wrong, if when the details are released and Gareth Hock is guilty of a major indiscretion then I and I assume the majority of other Salford fans will condemn him and be seeking questions from our own owner and management as to how they propose to avoid such instances happening at Salford. I would however hope that should there be any issues with Gareth Hock whether it be drugs, alcohol or anger related Salford and the RFL assist him as best they can to help him in order to avoid a scenario we had with the late Terry Newton.

The blame should only be widened as far as it needs to, if other players have been involved and are guilty of the same breaches as Gareth Hock then they rightly should be publically named and punished as well. I think it all stinks of poor management from McNamara to be honest and I wouldn’t be surprised if reports are correct that the Wigan element of the England camp are unhappy and disgruntled at the manner in which Hock has been removed from the squad. If he thinks he is bringing the squad closer together doing this, McNamara could have potentially done the complete opposite and created a divide/rift. It could and should have been handled far more professional.

Bear in mind we also heard this when Hock was kicked out at Wigan - that all the players were really upset.

If so, it didn't show in public.

Gareth has a small minority of quite vocal supporters who will promote any bit of guff to try and create the impression that he is a guy more sinned against than sinning.

This is koukash (SP) twitter comment:He added: "I once went out with lads for a few drinks, overslept in the morning, missed work, got fined but not sacked from my job."


Might shed a bit of light on what's happened

If he had a brain a Hock autobiography would be an interesting read!

Awaits the "I am not a bad boy" story in the Daily Mirror.

No doubt it's Shaun Wane's fault again!

So we can't criticise Hock without all the facts but McNamara and others involved could and should have handled it more professionally. Right.

I dont get your point at all. How can you criticise somebody without knowing what they have done? Obviously McNamara and others are fully aware of what has gone on and have come to the conclusion he shouldnt play for England during the World Cup. I have no issue with that, but I do have an issue with how they have gone about it all. We are 3 days away from a World Cup, is there any need for issuing a statement to the media like they did? I dont think there is. By all means drop Gareth Hock and dont play him throughout the tournament, report he's injured if you like but I fail to understand what has been gained by all this unnecessary speculation and attention. It could and should have been handled a lot better.

sorry but we do know whats happened, he got ed after a match and didn't turn up the next day. Players have been sacked for less. we heard the same when he got dumped from wigan "we don't know the full story" blah blah.

Unfortunately (from the point of view of England's prep for Saturday) it looks like this story will widen to other players.

This tweet from a BBC sports reporter, apparently his interview will air on BBC NW Today at 1:30

#EXCLUSIVE Gareth Hock told me feels unfairly treated by England.Says wasn't alone in breaking the rules.Interview on @BBCNWT & BBC outlets

an ex-saints strawberry blonde prop, current leeds full back and current wigan number 9

Exactly, Hock gets no benefit of the doubt. He's done something that has lead to the management booting him out of the squad on the eve of one of the biggest matches of the last decade. The management may have been able to handle it better but this is typical Hock.

No we don’t. We’re just assuming and speculating. Don’t get me wrong it looks more and more likely that he has gone on the p*ss after a game and missed training, which if confirmed is pure stupidity on his behalf and warrants a disciplinary. It’s not the punishment (i.e missing the tournament) I am disputing, but the manner in which it has been handled. It can only have a detrimental affect on our build up not only to the Australia game but the World Cup as a whole.

It’s blatantly obvious if he has indeed gone out on the p*ss he wont have been alone, I therefore assume England will stick to their principles and the other players involved will be publically named and shamed with their punishments also made clear.

How can players drink before such an important game. I have paid for good seats and expect players to give their best which means not drinking alcohol. In fact, like tuigamala, Leuluai of Leeds and Hanley, I don't think they should drink at all. It just takes a bit of willpower.
When I went to watch the World Cup in Australia in 2008 I heard on good authority that alcohol was banned on the plane yet one player bought a bottle of Jack Daniel's in duty free and consumed the lot on the plane. Pathetic.

You don't like the assuming and the speculating, but you're doing an awful lot of that yourself with regard to the other players.

There are degrees of infringement. For example, some players may go on the lash the night before training and still turn up the next morning. They'll be reprimanded but as they were there for work, it won't be deemed as serious as those who weren't. Others may turn up but with the wrong attitude (as happened with a certain player shown the door at Wigan a few seasons ago).

Going on and on about others being involved is grabbing at straws. This scandal may widen, but that won't save Gareth, who will probably not get selected for England again as a result.

The other thing is - you're very concerned that the England management team have handled this badly because of the World Cup's proximity, but you still want all the other culprits publicly named and shamed as well (presumably to try and spare a Salford player's blushes). You can't have it both ways. We either limit the damage done to the WC to another colossal Gareth Hock brainfart, or we rope lots of others in and completely destroy our chances.

You have the perfect title for it there in your first part of your post

How am I speculating? Gareth Hock has confirmed to the BBC that other players were involved and he feels he has been harshly treated.

Also where did I say I want other players to be named and shamed? I said I assume England will release the same details of other players involved. I hope they don't, they have already made a pigs ear of all the whole thing already.

'[uIt’s blatantly obvious if he has indeed gone out on the p*ss he wont have been alone[/u, [iI therefore assume England will stick to their principles and the other players involved will be publically named and shamed with their punishments also made clear[/i.'

The first bit I've underlined is nothing but speculation.

The second bit, which I've italicised, doesn't say anything about you hoping this won't happen, but talks about principled behaviour and such, and therefore seems to imply that England SHOULD take public punitive action.

If you didn't intend it to read like that, fair enough. From your last post, we are clearly in agreement that making further examples of English players would be a disastrous decision.

But also ... and please understand that we at Wigan have been here so many times before. Gareth is telling the press it wasn't his fault. Gareth feels he's been harshly treated. Again.

You at Salford, will also, at some point, become quite cynical about all this.

From BBC Sport Website:

Gareth Hock has told the BBC that he does not think his breach of discipline was serious enough for him to be removed from England's World Cup squad.

The 30-year-old said he and some of his team-mates went on a night out after England's surprise defeat by Italy.

Hock overslept the next morning, missing a recovery session, and was informed of his dismissal in a phone conversation with coach Steve McNamara.

"For missing a 10 minute swim - I think it's out of order really," said Hock.

"I agree that it was wrong and we shouldn't have had a drink, but there were six or seven of us and we all did the same thing."

England have said they will make no further comment about Hock's removal. Huddersfield's Brett Ferres has been added to the squad in his place.

More to follow.

If it looks like a turd, smells like a turd and tastes like a turd it's usually a turd and Hock has a long history of turning his career into turds.

He can't keep his discipline in matches. God knows what he's like out of the public view.

It was like watching someone with frontal lobe damage when he turned out for Widnes at Craven Park this year. Lucky not be sent off three times for consistently trying to hit dale Ferguson and failing miserably. Gave away 5 penalties!

Talented player but serious personality problems. The people who manage him keep sacking him. This and Wigan bent over backwards for him in the past. They can't all be wrong.

Now he'll come out crying like all felons do 'It's unfair' 'Jammer made me do it' 'Mr. Wane didn't speak to me nicely'
'after blowing all my wages on medicine Wigan wouldn't give me anymore' etc etc.

He's out the joke was he was picked in the first place.

It's one thing to go for a few drinks after a game when you aren't supposed to, it's another to then not turn up in the morning. He is dragging other players (who did turn up) into it to try and save his skin which frankly tells you all you need to know about his mentality.

He has had enough chances, I just wish he would get his head on straight and realise his potential

Unfortunately, I think it's almost too late for that. Gareth has spent his career closing doors of opportunity on himself. Look how many major trophies his missed while at Wigan - four, at my count. He's now 30. Salford must surely be his final chance.