Hoffman, Lima and Finch don't play for us yet, and the probability is that Roberts won't be on that list for much longer.

Or does this 'get out' logic only apply to St Helens?

<referee walks over to a wobbly and clearly dazed 'FearTheVee'>

"One-aa, two-aa, three-aa, four-aa .........".

I see what you've done there.

Hilarious, and original to boot!

You stains must be ting it if your trotting out the excuses for next season already!

It isn't a "get out" simply an assertion that trying to make Saints' position look worse by rolling up overseas players over two seasons isn't very bright.

You'll note that when I was referring to your 2011 team, I didn't include Phelps/Feka/Bailey/Riddell which was the equivalent of what the poster did by adding in Perry but retaining Gidley/Maurie.

If you'd like me to prepare a list along similar lines it would read: Phelps/Carmont/Roberts/Richards/Tommy/Riddell/Feka/Hansen/Bailey/Finch/Lima/Hoffman - but that doesn't actually make much sense does it?

I actually hope you sign up as many back-door quota players as you can; it's detrimental to your club.

Saints must of used all there quota for next season due to all there fans saying so ,and mr IL says we ve still got room for 1 more quota player . You do the maths and every top team uses there quota including saints

You'll forgive me for not being obsessed enough with yourselves to know who's leaving at the end of this season, I'm sure. Had I been pointlessly trolling your boards, I'd have probably done some research first. Still, wasn't a million miles away in simple numeric terms.

You are usually pretty sensible.
Do you think that the RFL will allow Wigan to sign more than the allocated quota of overseas players?

Probably given past form

. But the way it was allocated was a cop out anyway.

IMO, they should have given an exemption for all the players already over here, even allowed a club to resign them to prevent restraint of trade, but not allowed a club to sign any additional overseas players until you had reduced your overseas players down to the required number. And if a player left a club then he lost his exemption.

I must be mistaken. Are you saying the signings of Finch, Lima and Hoffman are both "back-door signings" and "detrimental to our club"?

This really is a futile exercise, you know.

Everyone, including you lot, will sign overseas players if the quota allows it. Saints have never fielded a team in modern times that is completely comprised of home-grown talent, neither have Wigan, and neither has anyone else.

Wigan are not making any 'back door signings'. Hoffman, Lima and Finch are the first overseas signings they'll have made for two seasons - and they're all quality, which is supposedly the purpose of the tightening quota. It's not Wigan's fault that a residency rule was brought in to allow certain existing overseas players to be exempt. And I'm sure we're not the only ones who've benefited from that. Even so, a number of Wigan's overseas players - Phelps, Riddell, Bailey, Feka and next year probably Carmont, will all be leaving to make way for the new ones. You give yourself credit for that with Ridley, Maurie etc - so you should also give it to us.

With the best will in the world, not every place can be filled by a talented kid, though Wigan took a year off from making overseas signings to try and do that. And as they want to continue the improvement they've shown under Maguire, they've opted to fill spare places with top players from Down Under. Which is exactly what you lot, and Leeds and Warrington, have been doing. There's nothing for anyone to be ashamed of here, and trying to imply there is is petty point-scoring which should be below you.

4 definitely out and 3 definitely in, when two of the players going out weren't first choice anyway, actually makes the position worse in the Wigan 17 next year. If Carmont leaves you're standing still as far as the 17 is concerned, which really ought not to be the point of the "reduced" quota.



To be fair - you did have 9 on the books (8 is we exclude Hansen) at that point!



To be honest, it was the poster(s) mooting Fielden out and Ennis in as a positive that annoyed me. It wasn't point scoring, it just irritates me (having shelled out to go to Oz twice to support GB/England) that the club with the best youth structures in the sport looks likely to have half of their first choice 17 next year ineligible to play for England.

FWIW I'm actually looking forward to seeing Hoffman/Lima/Finch playing next season, it's just a shame that on the face of it there will only be about 50% of squad places up for grabs for the English lads.

I've seen nothing other than fan speculation to indicate that Ennis might be Wigan bound. Given the three big signings they've already made, I'd be absolutely amazed if Ennis came to Wigan as well.

When you say "strongly linked", is this just someone mentioning it on the Hull FC board? I just ask because, as an FC fan, I change my avatar to Fielden every year at this time in response to us being "linked" with him, but it has yet to have any substance at all.

Lima, Hoffman and Finch will need to perform or they will be dropped in favour of young players. The days of overseas players being automatic picks regardless of performances are over at Wigan. The strength in depth in the squad means that players with higher nos than 17 may well end up playing a big part in Wigan's season. Madge and Wane select their sides on merit, not reputation. I just don't follow your argument at all, it seems very 2009 to me.

To a point, I agree with you. But if in Carmont's case, he's being retained for 1 more season to help turn a local, Wigan produced lad in Charnley into a ready made replacement, is that not better for Wigan and England in the long run?

To be honest that is EXACTLY that sort of situation that is annoying.

You have a young lad in Charnley who has arguably played better rugby in SL recently than Carmont. It's average 30+ players like Carmont being given 1 year extensions when you have a lad on loan playing SL to a high standard elsewhere that seems daft to me.

Charnley should be playing at Wigan next year and Hull KR should be playing one of their own youngsters in Charnley's place. Result - one extra young English player getting SL experience. IMO of course.

Carmonts been as good as he ever was this season. Charnley has played 3 super league games his whole career, and yet is expected to start most games next season if Carmont were to leave?

A mixture of Carmont and Charnley next season will do us fine thanks, even though Charnley is actually a winger, so they don't even play in the same position.

I see your point, but I don't agree I'm afraid.

One of the main reasons our left wing over the past 2 years (be it Pryce, Ainscough or Richards) has been so prolific is because of Carmont. He's getting on, but he's still a classy player and is very solid (usually) in defence. Charnley's been playing well, but with all due respect to HKR he's in a smaller pool over there. If he is gradually introduced to the Wigan team throughout next season, is managed well and gets used to the style ready to take over the number 4 shirt for 2012 I think it's of more benefit to us. Quite a few centres in SL could still learn a trick or two from George.

Get real.....

LOL im a big fan of Charnley but no way is he playing better rugby than Carmont. Carmont is class and is one of the main reasons Richards has had so much success over the past few years - look how good he made Ainscough last year, Pryce this year! I wouldnt swap Carmont for any other in Super League and I wish we had signed him when he was 20.

Carmont has been one of the real successes of the IL era so far. Initially he came as a stop-gap, but has never been less than top quality for us. If he wasn't, you can be damn sure that MM and SW would drop him like a stone. His current contract was dependent on him maintaining form.

To argue that he's keeping a young talent like Charnley out of the first team, is really grabbing at straws - as will be proved next season.

Forgive me if I find the notion of a Saints fans getting 'annoyed' about this worthy of a giggle.