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| Quote ="- Neil -"hes made a very valid point'"
Good job the ARL and Aus SL split up and we could win some games against made-up teams like Perth Reds and Adelaide Rams.
So even against only about half the strength in Aus at the time, SL teams here won a total of 8 games out of 60. 7 of these victories being at games played over here. |
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| Quote ="Wigan/Leeds Andy"Good job the ARL and Aus SL split up and we could win some games against made-up teams like Perth Reds and Adelaide Rams.
So even against only about half the strength in Aus at the time, SL teams here won a total of 8 games out of 60. 7 of these victories being at games played over here.'"
Even more concerning given we could spend what we wanted in assembling our teams aagainst teams that had been playing under a salary cap for 7 years.
But obviously, being able to spend more means better quality players, does it not BK? |
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| Quote ="Jukesays"????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What on earth are you on about??????????
Not developed properly in the late 80's early 90's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Conolly/Robinson/Offiah/Newlove/Hunte/Goulding/Edwards/Clarke/Betts/Dermott/Lee Jackson/Skerretts/Platts/Joynt/Curriers/Mike Gregory and I could go on for hours if you wanted!!!!!!
Most of them went and played in Oz at Top Level and were classed as successes!
Add to them established stars like Gregory/Schofield/Hanley/Ward and dozens more and I begin to wonder were you actually alive at that time!'"
And I begin to wonder whether you read the word "kids" in my post, seeing as though you're naming players who were already playing professional RL then.
No surprise that you miss the point though. |
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| Quote ="Wigan/Leeds Andy"If anyone with a short memory wants to see how close we were to Australia in this "golden age" of the 90s before a salary cap I suggest they study the following results:
Brisbane Broncos def. London Broncos 42-22
Auckland Warriors def. St Helens 42-12
North Queensland Cowboys def. Leeds Rhinos 42-20
Adelaide Rams def. Salford Reds 50-8
Canberra Raiders def. Halifax Blue Sox 70-6
Hunter Mariners def. Paris-St Germain 28-12
Perth Reds def. Castleford Tigers 24-16
Wigan Warriors def. Canterbury Bulldogs 22-18
Penrith Panthers def. Bradford Bulls 20-16
Adelaide Rams def. Leeds Rhinos 34-8
Hunter Mariners def. Castleford Tigers 42-12
North Queensland Cowboys def. Oldham Bears 54-16
Auckland Warriors def. Bradford Bulls 20-16
Canterbury Bulldogs def. Halifax Blue Sox 58-6
Canberra Raiders def. London Broncos 66-20
Sheffield Eagles def. Perth Reds 26-22
Penrith Panthers def. Warrington Wolves 52-22
Brisbane Broncos def. Wigan Warriors 34-0
Adealide Rams def. Oldham Bears 42-14
Cronulla Sharks def. Bradford Bulls 30-10
North Queensland Cowboys def. Salford Reds 44-8
Paris-St Germain def. Perth Reds 24-0
Brisbane Broncos def. Halifax Blue Sox 76-0
Canberra Raiders def. Wigan Warriors 42-6
Canterbury Bulldogs def. London Broncos 34-18
Auckland Warriors def. Warrington Wolves 56-28
Penrith Panthers def. Warrington Wolves 48-12
Leeds Rhinos def. Adelaide Rams 22-14
Oldham Bears def. North Queensland Cowboys 20-16
Perth Reds def. Sheffield Eagles 48-12
Auckland Warriors def. Bradford Bulls 64-14
Hunter Mariners def. Castleford Tigers 26-8
Canterbury Bulldogs def. Halifax Blue Sox 40-22
Brisbane Broncos def. Wigan Warriors 30-4
Cronulla Sharks def. St Helens 28-12
London Broncos def. Canberra Raiders 38-18
Auckland Warriors def. St Helens 70-6
Adelaide Rams def. Oldham Bears 18-2
Cronulla Sharks def. Warrington Wolves 44-0
Hunter Mariners def. Paris-St Germain 32-4
Perth Reds def. Castleford Tigers 24-14
Brisbane Broncos def. London Broncos 34-16
North Queensland Cowboys def. Salford Reds 24-14
Canberra Raiders def. Halifax Blue Sox 42-12
Penrith Panthers def. Bradford Bulls 54-14
Wigan Warriors def. Canterbury Bulldogs 31-24
Perth Reds def. Paris-St Germain 18-8
Canterbury Bulldogs def. London Broncos 44-22
Cronulla Sharks def. Bradford Bulls 40-12
Auckland Warriors def. Warrington Wolves 16-4
Hunter Mariners def. Sheffield Eagles 58-12
North Queensland Cowboys def. Leeds Rhinos 48-14
Salford Reds def. Adelaide Rams 14-12
Canberra Raiders def. Wigan Warriors 50-10
Penrith Panthers def. St Helens 32-26
Brisbane Broncos def. Halifax Blue Sox 54-10
Auckland Warriors def. Bradford Bulls 62-14
Hunter Mariners def. Wigan Warriors 22-18
Brisbane Broncos def. St Helens 66-12
Cronulla Sharks def. London Broncos 40-16'"
Thanks for posting this. I welcome sensible debate. It makes a change for someone with pro-cap views to actually quote statistics/results or objective research.
You're right that the 1996 World Club championship was not exactly a great success for British teams. Many British teams in that tournament, Saints particularly, massively underpeformed - I don't recall that thrashing of Saints by Auckland but it was indicative of some shocking preparation for that tournament not just by Saints but by the other clubs. Only Wigan emerged with any credibility (I think we made the semis?) and we weren't great.
I have to say though that I dread to think what the scores would be if this competition were restaged in the UK say next year. Leeds were outclassed in the WCC this year in what was a pre-season warm up for their opponents. When the Aussies came over in '96 it was obvious they were taking it very seriously and I would expect them to do so again.
I would expect SDL sides to lose to NRL sides on average by 30 points at least and I can't see the likes of Saints and Leeds winning as many matches as Wigan did in '96. |
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| Quote ="Deano G"Thanks for posting this. I welcome sensible debate. It makes a change for someone with pro-cap views to actually quote statistics/results or objective research.'"
 Given the stats about the number of British players on this thread in support of the "CC" and the decline of "SDL", that's pretty funny.
Oh, and the expanded WCC wasn't 1996. |
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| Quote ="Deano G"Thanks for posting this. I welcome sensible debate. It makes a change for someone with pro-cap views to actually quote statistics/results or objective research.
You're right that the 1996 World Club championship was not exactly a great success for British teams. Many British teams in that tournament, Saints particularly, massively underpeformed - I don't recall that thrashing of Saints by Auckland but it was indicative of some shocking preparation for that tournament not just by Saints but by the other clubs. Only Wigan emerged with any credibility (I think we made the semis?) and we weren't great.
I have to say though that I dread to think what the scores would be if this competition were restaged in the UK say next year. Leeds were outclassed in the WCC this year in what was a pre-season warm up for their opponents. When the Aussies came over in '96 it was obvious they were taking it very seriously and I would expect them to do so again.
I would expect SDL sides to lose to NRL sides on average by 30 points at least and I can't see the likes of Saints and Leeds winning as many matches as Wigan did in '96.'"
No SL team came out of it with any credit whatsoever. Wigan won a grand total of 2 games from 7 (both against the Bulldogs) and was the only SL team to do so. 4 SL teams made the QF as it was set-up that way - all lost of course.
Would the same happen again? Probably in my opinion. |
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"What did that team win in 1996?
Saints did the double with a team that would get spanked by the 2006 Saints.
Paul Anderson (the rubbish one), Danny Arnold, Simon Booth, Dean Busby, Andy Haigh, Joey Hayes, Andy Leatham, Vila Matautia, Chris Morley, Jon Neill, Andy Northey, Julian O Neill, Ian Pickavance, Tony Stewart, Adam Fogerty, John Mcatee.
All these players would struggle to get a gig for Celtic these days, most would be Championship.'"
That's like a who's who of Leigh players of the past ten years  |
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"What did that team win in 1996?
Saints did the double with a team that would get spanked by the 2006 Saints.
Paul Anderson (the rubbish one), Danny Arnold, Simon Booth, Dean Busby, Andy Haigh, Joey Hayes, Andy Leatham, Vila Matautia, Chris Morley, Jon Neill, Andy Northey, Julian O Neill, Ian Pickavance, Tony Stewart, Adam Fogerty, John Mcatee.
All these players would struggle to get a gig for Celtic these days, most would be Championship.'"
Is that really your team from '96? E.g. wasn't Newlove playing for you in those days? |
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| Quote ="Deano G"Is that really your team from '96? E.g. wasn't Newlove playing for you in those days?'"
They were all in the squad. Of course there were some top players in there too (Newlove, Sullivan, Martyn, Goulding etc) but those other players wouldn't get near a top SL squad these days. |
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"They were all in the squad. Of course there were some top players in there too (Newlove, Sullivan, Martyn, Goulding etc) but those other players wouldn't get near a top SL squad these days.'"
Thanks. I'm not sure what point you're making with this - that Saints then had a massive squad including some players you didn't rate?I don't think many Wigan fans (myself included) know enough about the fringe players in the 90s Saints squad to say whether they were on were not up to top-flight RL, though if what you're saying is that you had a small no. of quality players but the vast majority of the squad was NL1 standard then I'd be extremely sceptical. |
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| Quote ="Deano G"Thanks. I'm not sure what point you're making with this - that Saints then had a massive squad including some players you didn't rate?I don't think many Wigan fans (myself included) know enough about the fringe players in the 90s Saints squad to say whether they were on were not up to top-flight RL, though if what you're saying is that you had a small no. of quality players but the vast majority of the squad was NL1 standard then I'd be extremely sceptical.'"
Whilst the bit in bold is a little harsh, that's kind of the point which I was trying to make when I asked you to compare the 1996 Saints team (which did the double) with the Leeds (or Saints) team of last year.
The difference in class is there for all to see and, given that now, on any given week you would be hard pressed to get seven correct predictions with any team capable of beating any other team on any given day, the standard of SL MUST have improved since 1996. QED. |
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| Quote ="Badwanger"Whilst the bit in bold is a little harsh, that's kind of the point which I was trying to make when I asked you to compare the 1996 Saints team (which did the double) with the Leeds (or Saints) team of last year.
The difference in class is there for all to see and, given that now, on any given week you would be hard pressed to get seven correct predictions with any team capable of beating any other team on any given day, the standard of SL MUST have improved since 1996. QED.'"
The point I was making was that I'd be extremely sceptical of an argument that Saints had a small number of great players and the remainder of what would appear to be a big squad were NL1 standard. I haven't yet seen a squad list and am trying to keep an open mind but it just doesn't sound plausible. |
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| Quote ="Deano G"icon_confused.gif:
The point I was making was that I'd be extremely sceptical of an argument that Saints had a small number of great players and the remainder of what would appear to be a big squad were NL1 standard. I haven't yet seen a squad list and am trying to keep an open mind but it just doesn't sound plausible.'"
Squad list from 2006 with ages at start of season in brackets
Prescott (22)
Arnold (18 )
Gibbs (25)
Newlove (24)
Sullivan (27)
Hunte (25)
Hammond (21)
Martyn (24)
Goulding (24)
Perelini (26)
Cunningham (19)
Leathem (18 )
Joynt (24)
Booth (24)
Busby (23)
Veivers (31)
Matautia (26)
Northey (23)
McVey (27)
Fogarty (27)
Pickavance (27)
Chris Morley (22)
McAtee (20)
Paul Anderson - not Baloo! (19)
I think that's everyone. |
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| Quote ="Badwanger"Squad list from 2006 with ages at start of season in brackets
Prescott (22)
Arnold (18 )
Gibbs (25)
Newlove (24)
Sullivan (27)
Hunte (25)
Hammond (21)
Martyn (24)
Goulding (24)
Perelini (26)
Cunningham (19)
Leathem (18 )
Joynt (24)
Booth (24)
Busby (23)
Veivers (31)
Matautia (26)
Northey (23)
McVey (27)
Fogarty (27)
Pickavance (27)
Chris Morley (22)
McAtee (20)
Paul Anderson - not Baloo! (19)
I think that's everyone.'"
All of them good enough to get into the Saints team of Now individually without making you significantly weaker.
8 Backs & 3 forwards!
Where does that leave the Wipe the floor argument now ????
PS
Don't start with the Fitter/Stronger B0ll0x as that would mean that NO players of Yeteryear would ever be better than the players of now and that in 20 years time you can look back and say Every player of Now was Crap! |
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| Quote ="Jukesays"
Prescott (22)
Gibbs (25)
Newlove (24)
Sullivan (27)
Hunte (25)
Hammond (21)
Martyn (24)
Goulding (24)
Perelini (26)
Cunningham (19)
Joynt (24)
All of them good enough to get into the Saints team of Now individually without making you significantly weaker.
8 Backs & 3 forwards!
Where does that leave the Wipe the floor argument now ????
'"
Supposing you are right (even though you have included a 19 year old KC, Hammond and a player who is widely derided by Wiganers as "rubbish"icon_wink.gif, then what about the other 6 who take the field each week and what about the rest of the squad?
If you can't see that the Saints squad of 1996 is significantly weaker than the Saints squad of last year then it's utterly pointless debating this issue further with you. |
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| Quote ="Jukesays"All of them good enough to get into the Saints team of Now individually without making you significantly weaker.
8 Backs & 3 forwards!
Where does that leave the Wipe the floor argument now ????
PS
Don't start with the Fitter/Stronger B0ll0x as that would mean that NO players of Yeteryear would ever be better than the players of now and that in 20 years time you can look back and say Every player of Now was Crap!'"
Tbh, I think Sullivans defensive flaws would be exploited far more now than they were then. And Hammond wouldn't get anywhere near for me. |
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Quote ="Badwanger"Supposing you are right (even though you have included a 19 year old KC, Hammond and a player who is widely derided by Wiganers as "rubbish"icon_wink.gif, then what about the other 6 who take the field each week and what about the rest of the squad?
If you can't see that the Saints squad of 1996 is significantly weaker than the Saints squad of last year then it's utterly pointless debating this issue further with you.'"
Hmmm. The pro-CC people are being clever here, or at least trying to be. First they pick a year far enough in the past that we've probably now forgotten about much of the detail, but one in which their team was the stand-out side. They then attack the quality of their own squad, which makes them seem very reasonable and fair-minded and its difficult (as a Wigan fan) to resist the temptation to join in.
However, this thread - as has been stated repeatedly - isn't about Wigan or Saints but the SDL, so instead of joining the baying hordes of Saints fans attacking their own side I did a little research on a couple of the (allegedly) "NL1 standard" players listed above that I definitely did recall from the mid-90s at Saints, Pickavance and Matautia.
I was interested to see that "The Saints Heritage Society" (I'm tempted to note that "Saints Heritage" is an oxymoron, but will try not to provoke our friends from Merseyside!) don't agree with this assessment.
In fact they are both given great write-ups on their website:
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=16151
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=15913
You may remember that Matuatia - this top quality player according to Saints sources - was the third choice centre behind Newlove and Gibbs, a better centre pairing by far than any currently playing in SDL.
Trying to be as fair as possible, I even looked up Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson, who I admit I didn't remember at all. I was expecting him to be a dismal failure. I was surprised, based on comments in this thread, to see that he appears to have been a quality young player who didn't quite make it in the end but was a decent SL player in the mid-90s. It seems that a real disservice has been done to this player by fans of the St Helens club. I must mention in the interests of fairness that he did go on to play for Leigh, presumably seeking first team football, but Paul appears to have been a talented young player, certainly in the mid 90s. Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson was - according to Saints Heritage Society - St Helens' "Young Player of the Year" in 1996 - the year in question - and a "valuable interchange player" in 1997 and 1998.
Oh dear. Another pro-CC argument disintegrates under scrutiny.... |
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Quote ="Badwanger"Supposing you are right (even though you have included a 19 year old KC, Hammond and a player who is widely derided by Wiganers as "rubbish"icon_wink.gif, then what about the other 6 who take the field each week and what about the rest of the squad?
If you can't see that the Saints squad of 1996 is significantly weaker than the Saints squad of last year then it's utterly pointless debating this issue further with you.'"
Hmmm. The pro-CC people are being clever here, or at least trying to be. First they pick a year far enough in the past that we've probably now forgotten about much of the detail, but one in which their team was the stand-out side. They then attack the quality of their own squad, which makes them seem very reasonable and fair-minded and its difficult (as a Wigan fan) to resist the temptation to join in.
However, this thread - as has been stated repeatedly - isn't about Wigan or Saints but the SDL, so instead of joining the baying hordes of Saints fans attacking their own side I did a little research on a couple of the (allegedly) "NL1 standard" players listed above that I definitely did recall from the mid-90s at Saints, Pickavance and Matautia.
I was interested to see that "The Saints Heritage Society" (I'm tempted to note that "Saints Heritage" is an oxymoron, but will try not to provoke our friends from Merseyside!) don't agree with this assessment.
In fact they are both given great write-ups on their website:
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=16151
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=15913
You may remember that Matuatia - this top quality player according to Saints sources - was the third choice centre behind Newlove and Gibbs, a better centre pairing by far than any currently playing in SDL.
Trying to be as fair as possible, I even looked up Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson, who I admit I didn't remember at all. I was expecting him to be a dismal failure. I was surprised, based on comments in this thread, to see that he appears to have been a quality young player who didn't quite make it in the end but was a decent SL player in the mid-90s. It seems that a real disservice has been done to this player by fans of the St Helens club. I must mention in the interests of fairness that he did go on to play for Leigh, presumably seeking first team football, but Paul appears to have been a talented young player, certainly in the mid 90s. Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson was - according to Saints Heritage Society - St Helens' "Young Player of the Year" in 1996 - the year in question - and a "valuable interchange player" in 1997 and 1998.
Oh dear. Another pro-CC argument disintegrates under scrutiny.... | |
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Quote ="Deano G"Hmmm. The pro-CC people are being clever here, or at least trying to be. First they pick a year far enough in the past that we've probably now forgotten about much of the detail, but one in which their team was the stand-out side. They then attack the quality of their own squad, which makes them seem very reasonable and fair-minded and its difficult (as a Wigan fan) to resist the temptation to join in.
However, this thread - as has been stated repeatedly - isn't about Wigan or Saints but the SDL, so instead of joining the baying hordes of Saints fans attacking their own side I did a little research on a couple of the (allegedly) "NL1 standard" players listed above that I definitely did recall from the mid-90s at Saints, Pickavance and Matautia.
I was interested to see that "The Saints Heritage Society" (I'm tempted to note that "Saints Heritage" is an oxymoron, but will try not to provoke our friends from Merseyside!) don't agree with this assessment.
In fact they are both given great write-ups on their website:
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=16151
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=15913
You may remember that Matuatia - this top quality player according to Saints sources - was the third choice centre behind Newlove and Gibbs, a better centre pairing by far than any currently playing in SDL.
Trying to be as fair as possible, I even looked up Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson, who I admit I didn't remember at all. I was expecting him to be a dismal failure. I was surprised, based on comments in this thread, to see that he appears to have been a quality young player who didn't quite make it in the end but was a decent SL player in the mid-90s. It seems that a real disservice has been done to this player by fans of the St Helens club. I must mention in the interests of fairness that he did go on to play for Leigh, presumably seeking first team football, but Paul appears to have been a talented young player, certainly in the mid 90s. Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson was - according to Saints Heritage Society - St Helens' "Young Player of the Year" in 1996 - the year in question - and a "valuable interchange player" in 1997 and 1998.
Oh dear. Another pro-CC argument disintegrates under scrutiny....'"
You think that a player that you say was classed as talented in 1996, but wouldn't even get a look in today, is supporting your stance?
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Quote ="Deano G"Hmmm. The pro-CC people are being clever here, or at least trying to be. First they pick a year far enough in the past that we've probably now forgotten about much of the detail, but one in which their team was the stand-out side. They then attack the quality of their own squad, which makes them seem very reasonable and fair-minded and its difficult (as a Wigan fan) to resist the temptation to join in.
However, this thread - as has been stated repeatedly - isn't about Wigan or Saints but the SDL, so instead of joining the baying hordes of Saints fans attacking their own side I did a little research on a couple of the (allegedly) "NL1 standard" players listed above that I definitely did recall from the mid-90s at Saints, Pickavance and Matautia.
I was interested to see that "The Saints Heritage Society" (I'm tempted to note that "Saints Heritage" is an oxymoron, but will try not to provoke our friends from Merseyside!) don't agree with this assessment.
In fact they are both given great write-ups on their website:
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=16151
www.saints.org.uk/saints.org.uk/ ... &num=15913
You may remember that Matuatia - this top quality player according to Saints sources - was the third choice centre behind Newlove and Gibbs, a better centre pairing by far than any currently playing in SDL.
Trying to be as fair as possible, I even looked up Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson, who I admit I didn't remember at all. I was expecting him to be a dismal failure. I was surprised, based on comments in this thread, to see that he appears to have been a quality young player who didn't quite make it in the end but was a decent SL player in the mid-90s. It seems that a real disservice has been done to this player by fans of the St Helens club. I must mention in the interests of fairness that he did go on to play for Leigh, presumably seeking first team football, but Paul appears to have been a talented young player, certainly in the mid 90s. Paul (NOT BALOO) Anderson was - according to Saints Heritage Society - St Helens' "Young Player of the Year" in 1996 - the year in question - and a "valuable interchange player" in 1997 and 1998.
Oh dear. Another pro-CC argument disintegrates under scrutiny....'"
You think that a player that you say was classed as talented in 1996, but wouldn't even get a look in today, is supporting your stance?
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| Quote ="Deano G"Snip'"
Simple question, is the second team significantly stronger than the first:
1 S Prescott
2 D Arnold
3 S Gibbs
4 P Newlove
5 A Sullivan
6 K Hammond
7 B Goulding
8 A Perelini
9 K Cunningham
10 A Fogerty
11 C Joynt
12 S Booth
13 D Busby
14 A Northey
15 I Pickavance
16 V Matatutia
17 T Martyn
or
1 P Wellens
2 A Gardner
3 J Lyon
4 W Talau
5 F Meli
6 L Pryce
7 S Long
8 J Graham
9 K Cunningham
10 J Cayless
11 L Gilmour
12 J Wilkin
13 P Sculthorpe
14 P Anderson
15 M Bennett
16 J Roby
17 M Faasavalu
The 1996 pack would get absolutely mullered by the SDL communist capped 2006 pack, and there are players like Vinnie Anderson, Nick Fozzard, Jason Hooper and Paul Clough who don't make the best 17.
You could do a similar exercise with most teams, with the exception of freefalling Wigan (which is the reason why these Super League is rubbish threads always seem to appear on THIS board), and get similar results. The best team is better now. The mid table teams are better now. The worst teams are better now. |
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| Quote ="Billinge_Lump"You think that a player that you say was classed as talented in 1996, but wouldn't even get a look in today, is supporting your stance?
'"
You said these people weren't any good, despite what appears to be a good try scoring record at top level for Matautia (third choice centre) and a glowing reference from your own Heritage Society for Pickavance. One of the weaker players was Young Player of the Year in 1996, the year in question. Bizarre. |
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| Quote ="Deano G"You said these people weren't any good, despite what appears to be a good try scoring record at top level for Matautia (third choice centre)'"
Matautia was rubbish. Surely you remember him?!
Quote ="Deano G"and a glowing reference from your own Heritage Society for Pickavance.'"
Pickavance?! Are you seriously comparing him to the props of Graham/Cayless/Fozzard/Baloo in 2006?
Quote ="Deano G"One of the weaker players was Young Player of the Year in 1996, the year in question. Bizarre.'"
Young player of the year?! He played 2 games out of 30 in 1996! Maybe young player of the year in the reserves/academy or whatever it was then, but certainly not the first team with a 19 year old KC playing every week. |
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"Simple question, is the second team significantly stronger than the first:
1 S Prescott
2 D Arnold
3 S Gibbs
4 P Newlove
5 A Sullivan
6 K Hammond
7 B Goulding
8 A Perelini
9 K Cunningham
10 A Fogerty
11 C Joynt
12 S Booth
13 D Busby
14 A Northey
15 I Pickavance
16 V Matatutia
17 T Martyn
or
1 P Wellens
2 A Gardner
3 J Lyon
4 W Talau
5 F Meli
6 L Pryce
7 S Long
8 J Graham
9 K Cunningham
10 J Cayless
11 L Gilmour
12 J Wilkin
13 P Sculthorpe
14 P Anderson
15 M Bennett
16 J Roby
17 M Faasavalu
The 1996 pack would get absolutely mullered by the SDL communist capped 2006 pack, and there are players like Vinnie Anderson, Nick Fozzard, Jason Hooper and Paul Clough who don't make the best 17.
You could do a similar exercise with most teams, with the exception of freefalling Wigan (which is the reason why these Super League is rubbish threads always seem to appear on THIS board), and get similar results. The best team is better now. The mid table teams are better now. The worst teams are better now.'"
As I've said, I don't recall enough about the Saints team of 1996 to be able to comment in detail. I am deeply sceptical of your arguments regarding that team though, given the rubbishing you gave to some obviously talented players. Saying that the Matautias and Pickavances of 96 would not be able to hold down a place in SDL is ludicrous and leaves you with very little credibility I'm afraid.
Let's talk about more recent history which we all recall more clearly. I note you've picked the 2006 Saints side rather than the 2009 squad to compare against the 1996 squad. The current Saints side is much, much weaker than the 2006 side The Leeds and Hull KR 2009 squads are likewise much weaker than the 2006 Hull and Bradfords sides.
After years of predictions that the CC is "finally working", it does appear to have had some effect: we are now seeing the results of the "level playing field" strategy. Unfortunately the present and the future is the mediocrity of the Soopah Doopah League.
All those pro-CC supporters should have listened to the old adage, be careful what you wish for (because you just might get it). |
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"Matautia was rubbish. Surely you remember him?!
Pickavance?! Are you seriously comparing him to the props of Graham/Cayless/Fozzard/Baloo in 2006?
Young player of the year?! He played 2 games out of 30 in 1996!
Maybe young player of the year in the reserves/academy or whatever it was then, but certainly not the first team with a 19 year old KC playing every week.'"
Why you pivking the 2006 team???
What's wrong with the 2009 team????
Why pick Hammond at 6 when you know MArtyn was 1st choice 6????
At least 5 of the backs would get in over the Saints team of 2009!
And I would argue that 3 of the forwards are better as well! |
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| Quote ="FearTheVee"Matautia was rubbish. Surely you remember him?!
Pickavance?! Are you seriously comparing him to the props of Graham/Cayless/Fozzard/Baloo in 2006?
Young player of the year?! He played 2 games out of 30 in 1996!
Maybe young player of the year in the reserves/academy or whatever it was then, but certainly not the first team with a 19 year old KC playing every week.'"
According to the Saints Heritage Society Matautia scored 24 tries from 55 appearances (presumably a number of these appearances will be as substitute given the very talented centres Saints had at the time). But according to you he was "rubbish". I couldn't muster the energy to read any further into your post after that, I'm afraid. |
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Given the stats about the number of British players on this thread in support of the "CC" and the decline of "SDL", that's pretty funny.
