But it ignores the stuff he does do well.

I'm not saying he's our next top HB, but if someone asked who'd been worse this year I'd be naming guys like both Leigh HB's, Kev Brown, Richardson and even Sneyd.

I just can't see how you can say that a 21 year old kid has been the worst HB this season.

I’d take all of them over Smith..

Does him being 21 give him some kind of exemption from performing poorly?

What am I ignoring that he does well?

No it doesn't. It does however make you put it into context and not write him the rest of his career off.

What does he do well Vs the others? He's got more assists, more attacking kicks and clean breaks.

No…what does he do well? That is the question.

I will wait.

Best thing I’ve seen him do this year is nearly get a 40-20 in the first 10 minutes today and shorty after he took the line on.

After that his kicking was awful, got dominated in contact, passing shocking etc etc etc last tackle plays embarrassing.

It's coming to something when you wished you been on a night shift, truly awful, yep, thank god it's over

Ponderous, clueless and rudderless just about sums it up. Just no oomph! Plenty of endeavour but that on its own doesn't win you many matches.

Not winning I can live with. More years than not we don't win the Grand Final, but this year is more serious because I've not been entertained either. That is a lot more serious because I firmly believe that it what drives fans away. I've been at many games in all three pro/semi-pro divisions this year and have yet to find a team less exciting to watch than Wigan. I was on a free ticket tonight and still felt short changed.

I thought the first half was brilliant. Really enjoyed it.

Game was on a knife edge and both teams going toe to toe.

Second half dire. Both teams played not to lose neither wanted to go for the win. One of the worst halves of rugby I’ve ever seen.

Fair enough, I respect your opinion but I just never thought either team looked like scoring even in the first half. I felt like we were as toothless as we were all year, strong in defence and lucky that they had a hooker at halfback which meant they lacked guile too.

I though the first half we were on top in a real battle and the second half we should have kicked on and dominated as we laid the platform.

Leeds first set in the second half set the tone for them to pick up the win.

Ran hard and with enthusiasm in the carries.


That’s when I knew we were in bother, I did expect some resistance though not just 5 drives and a kick.

I’m genuinely struggling to think of a team I’ve seen with less idea in attack than this Wigan team. If I were Lam I’d look for a new career after this season because whilst the squad isn’t perfect, it’s been an absolute embarrassment the attack and the loss of French totally found Lams lack of ideas out. I’m not sure what Lam is but he isn’t a rugby league coach. He certainly won’t get a head coaches job anywhere again but in truth I’m not sure who would employ him in any role after this spell. I could be assistant coach for the Aussie national team and any other jobs he gets must be because he’s a good lad on a night out.

Every time I hear the phrase ‘a great player doesn’t make a great manager/coach’ in any sport, I’ll have Adrian Lams face on the big screen (when the ref give the penalty for 8-0 tonight) in my mind and I will punch the nearest object. We’ll not have to worry about a great player becoming a poor coach next year because Matty Peet was cack. If he goes all Mourinho on us and becomes a great coach it’ll be happy days.

Funnily enough my brother from Dorset rang me at half time and he thought it was a good game. I thought he was taking the urine at first but he genuinely meant it.
He’s a football fan and Fulham supporter so after a while I could see where he was coming from.

Not taking the urine Jon as I always enjoy your your posts but what specifically was “brilliant” about the scoreless incident free first half?
I know you have a coaching background so was this due to technical efficiencies from both teams?

I thought both Half’s were boring and I’ve felt a better atmosphere in the Carnegie Library at the Half Way House and that’s been closed for +20 years. A game bereft of rugby, ideas, craft, variety, intensity, get you of you off your arris moments, pace, spontaneity and the main ingredient of simple joyfulness.

I watched the highlights of the U19 game against Hull KR just now (I'd seen the whole game earlier). Whatever you say about the standard of the opposition, I saw ideas, defenders being moved around, support play, some good skill (that lad Nicholson can play a bit), in other words, decent attacking rugby league, A good coach would take these youngsters on, and take them to next level, like Bellamy has done at Melbourne.Who has also, by the way, taken players previously considered mere journeymen, and found that extra 10% in them. That's what good coaches do, I guess, and Wigan need one badly.

Said this before but if Hardaker's kick goes over in Grand Final 2020 then Lam likely gets a three year contract. When I really think about that I'm genuinely in two minds about which result I'd have preferred with hindsight, particularly when we know IL doesn't sack coaches.

I couldnt have put up with another two years of that - I'd simply have disengaged from the club completely until he was gone.

I can’t be bothered to dissect that performance. It was a poor, boring showing. I’ll leave it there.

I’m glad we got beat in all honesty, relieved even. Roll on 2022.

Well I couldn't afford to do that, having only moved to Wigan [i<checks notes>[/i just under five years ago. But prior to that, I remember those 400 mile round trips down the M6 all too well. The rugby didn't always sparkle during the Wane era, but I never lost my faith.I certainly never saw as toothless an effort as this.

Exactly, The squad we have for next season is (based on what was said at the fans forum) currently going to cost £1,877,000.

That’s based on us having £73k left after recruiting a half back and the fact a half back can cost us a maximum of £150k on the cap.

That is after Hasting’s, Clubb and Gildart have gone and with recruits being the two Aussie forwards, Thornley and Miski with the latter two being championship standard players and completely uninspiring.

How on earth is that squad going to be paid £1.877m?

The answer at least in part was also given at the fans forum. The club has promoted several young players to the first team squad and decided to give them what it terms are first team contracts. I’d bet my house this is Rads doing modelling it on Leeds pay structure and the result is too many young players taking up too much of the salary cap to allow the club to recruit more experienced players to assist a fewer number of young players.

Yes this means you have to make hard decisions about letting several players go if half a dozen young players are in the frame for a first team contract but if you don’t you have no money for the experienced players you need. It’s also bound to happen sometimes you will let the wrong players go but that’s just the way it would go.

I called it earlier in the season that our attack was floundering on the back of no one passing at the line. I've never seen a more stark example of this than tonight when practically every pass was made 5m or more before the defensive line. Terrible. Just terrible.

Yep, first season since since 1971 I have seen zero live games. 4 hour return trip to watch that is simply not going to be done. We need some flair back.
Listened n Radio today from Antigua, 2 RU peeps in pool asking me about Wigan and what has gone wrong, hard to explain. Too much concern over cells in a spreadsheet. RL is a vocation, not a business.

Think you’re right. This is exactly our problem...too many average young players on silly salaries. Beyond KPP if any of our young players are on more than 40k then they are grossly overpaid and need to go. Byrne and partington are not even worth that.

If we’re serious about improving things I’d get them all on the transfer list and get what we can for them while they’re under contract...even if only 40-50k a player.

Huge clean out of the forwards needed...rather than looking at who I’d shift I’d look at who I’d retain....Farrell Bateman Smithies KPP...clear the rest off for me inc Powell unless he’s still cheap and you keep him for utility but he’s not a starting 9! Possibly still keep havard unless he’s on a stupid deal. With the rest of them were better getting rid and starting again

That hit me last night too! So transparent

Tbh I think if the coaching appointment is peet many will disengage anyway...not coming back for more of the same and probably worse next season, with an even weaker squad.

The fact that not one player of the present squad is not on the short list for the Man of Steel Award says it all about the season!

Rocky is out of contract wont cost the earth versatile fast player.

I've watched games this year from a sense of obligation, I haven't enjoyed a single game. It's been boring, awful rugby. Wins are a reflief, losses are to be expected - there's no entertainment at all.

If Peet is given the job, with a worse squad than this year then I will probably lose all interest.