would most likely be in prison, or worse, if they were not exceptional rugby players.

If fans of other teams could just accept that if they signed Hardaker, they would be pleased with that outcome. Yes he has had issues, but he is also a world class player. You do not hear Saints fans decrying Barba's cocaine use, but you sure do hear it from all the other fans. But every single fan would have Barba in their team, and I count Wigan fans in that as well.

Think you are missing my point Jeff or I am not explaining myself properly.
I am not taking the high ground.
Zak was one of the best players in the Leeds team and the same applied at Cas.
I`m actually saying that yes he is a plank and needs to grow up but he is going to be a dam good signing to any team if he can get his head into gear and he is not going to disrupt the team ethics at Wigan or anywhere else.
Leeds stood by him and others just like Wigan, Cas, Huddersfield and others have done the same with players who have gone off the rails.
My argument is that some Wigan fans are digging up stuff from years ago that either isn`t there or is there but is no longer relevant.
All clubs have their problems and good luck to Zak if it works out for him.
No moral high ground from me. I just wished he had stayed at Leeds and sorted himself out.
And in answer why he hasn`t signed for Warrington.
One of his mates at Wire is there and is trying to get him to sign, Zak wants to but Warrington don`t at this stage.
Trust me this is true.

With all due respect here Chapylad (and I know you're a decent and generally fair minded poster, so no offense intended) but your comments on your board are in response to what some people were saying on this board which was, in turn, a response to what had originally been said on your board! So whichever way you shake it up your post was a pop at Wigan when it should have been aimed at your own fans. You can't have it one way on this forum and another on your own. The boards are only a click away after all! Enough on that score though as I don't want to get in a tit-for-tat argument with you. As I said, I know you're a decent poster. In the spirit of letting it go I'll even let making the distinction between young offenders and prison slide!



Can I ask where you got your info from regarding Warrington. I'm guessing the player trying to get him signed is Charnley? For what it's worth, if this is true and in light of other 'developments' recently I wouldn't sign him for Wigan, good player or no.

A YOI is Prison but for U20's, same staff same rules.

Is this Charnley then?

+ Daryl Clark, Kev Brown.

If Hardaker is as big a plonker as his record suggests, it does make you wonder about the judgement of all these *mates*.

I wonder how welcome he would be in our dressing-room.

Thomas Minns , Zak Hardaker, Ben Barba, Ben Johnson, Lance Armstrong, and a list of super athletes, in various sports, only one rule, drugs=out. No compromise rid sport of this cancer, no club politics, do drugs your finished. FOR ALL

Examples set problem gone.

I agree - But ONLY for the top-level PEDs and persistent test-avoidance.

Recreational drugs should be short ban (2-6 months) with enforced rehabilitation and monthly drug tests for the rest of career.

Lower-end PEDs (Salbutamol, Pseudo-Ephadine, etc) should be 6 months (accidental) to 2-years (deliberate or no reason).

Just my opinion, but there are too many levels of drugs for your simplistic approach to work.

No drugs? firstly you need to split the two into PEDs and not.

Then you need to basically end sport as we know it, as most top athletes are on something they shouldn't be.

Wake up.

Ben Johnson was allowed back after failing a drugs test for PEDs. It was only after he failed a second test that he was banned for life.

Lance Armstrong was well known as a cheat during his entire cycling career, especially during his TdF victories. There's no evidence for this, but it is understood that UCI looked the other way, due to his prestige bringing in fans.

The three rugby players you mentioned all tested positive for recreational drugs and not PEDs. You cannot compare these, since they are complete separate entities.

The IAAF did used to issue lifetime bans, but these were rescinded when they went to the Court of European rights, who overturned them.

Lifetime bans do not work. You are essentially calling for a life sentence for one indiscretion, which is far too harsh. Where humans are, bad decisions will be made.

I assure you sir I am very much awake, old perhaps, rude never.
As you are obviously in favour of snorting coke or other such chemicals which are totally alien to me, as I was in danger of a good hiding if I was caught smoking cinnamon sticks as a nipper.

Your assumption that most top athletes are on something they shouldn’t be, is alarming, could you perhaps, I will make it simple, name those who are not.

There’s no way you could give a life ban for recreational drug use. We may as well say ban alcohol at the same time in that case and ban lads who have a drink as well.

Performance enhancing drugs is a different matter.

Thank you Jeff a much more reasoned and courteous response to my post, but I will stick to my guns, as memories fade, the likes of Billy Boston, Johnny Whitley, Eric Ashton, Alex Murphy, as good if not better than any around, tourists and true greats, never a sniff of wacky backy, nor the white powder, or any such drug, placed in any orifice, was needed.

Drugs cheats out, no excuses.

Pie Eyed, your opinion is accepted and welcome, as I said as an owld git, I will state once again, drugs are not acceptable, whichever mode of chemical is being taken.

Hello Nicky Kiss, please forgive my ignorance, is Cocain not deemed performance enhancing? I will be very surprised if it isn’t, as on the odd occasion I’ve had it at the dentist, I sit there laughing as he extracts my teeth.

I doubt you’d want to play on it regardless of what they’re labelling it as. There is no way cocaine use should sit in the same disciplinary bracket as somebody abusing steroids for example. To say it should just be a life ban for any drug use would be ridiculous.

I’m all for bans for drug use but the punishment has to fit the crime. We all know these lads aren't trying to get any playing advantage out iof cocaine use but clearly it’s still not right. If a player takes drugs to try and gain an advantage on the field then that’s pure cheating and they deserve everything they get.

We are in the minority with this view and I suspect our ages and the environments that we were raised in drives our stance and thoughts.
Personally I find people accepting the use of class 1 drugs as ok somewhat sad. What if a player was caught using another class 1 drug such as heroin would people then say that this was also acceptable??
Although I know I am in the minority it wont change my views.

If a rugby league player was on heroin I’d be looking to offer him help bigtime before even moving on to thinking about bans. It’s chalk and cheese to what cocaine will do to a person.

I’m anti drugs of any kind when it comes to myself. I’m 34 and didn’t even try a cigerette until my mid twenties and haven’t even considered taking anything stronger then a paracetamol but I understand that some people do. If they do it for some sort of high away from the field and not to try and cheat then whilst I say ‘more fool them’, I do not think they should be punished in the same way as a drugs cheat.

Maybe time to put us out to grass “Itchy Arsenal”. The green variety.

As I’m obviously in favour of snorting coke? Are you high?

Cheers Phuzzy.
You almost lost me there with our board and your board! Yes I was splitting hairs with the YOI/Prison comparison


I would say you are pretty much close to your assumption on Charnley and throw in one more and you will be spot on.
My info has come from a friend of a friend sad yes I know but at least it isn`t from the blokes next door neighbours aunty who works in a chip shop that Zak goes to.
I would say the information is pretty spot on.

I wasn`t aware of Kev Brown but I`m sure you are right Richie.
And to the other poster who says why doesn`t Zak sign for Warrington.
Once again just because the players in their team want him to sign doesn't mean that the chairman does or they can fit him under the cap.
Zak prefers Wire but Wigan are prepared to take him so who knows where he will end up.

I see you have declined to answer your last missive, “ most top athletes are on something” then as you know this, pray tell me those who are not.


As for being high, probably was, at Wembley last year, but ‘‘twas the elixir of life”

Regards.

But taking cocaine is not cheating...

Also, you have no evidence that the players you've listed never took any illegal substances. In fact, since there was very little testing during that era, it's quite possible that some, or all, of the players you listed could have taken substances which would now be considered illegal.