If players didn't move positions we'd have never had Hanley, Farrell or Lockers at loose forward (started life on the wing, 2nd row and centre respectively), Jason Robinson on the wing (started at stand off), Connolly at centre (fullback) or Sam Tomkins at full back (stand off). That's just a few notable examples but you could add Botica, Edwards, Platt and dozens more to that list.

To use the fact that he didn't go particularly well in an injury ravaged team last season when thrown in with little or no preparation is not really a fair argument. Let's be honest; he was never going to set the world alight under those circumstances. Doubly so as he was injured at the time too!

If he has lost a yard of pace, particularly as it seems to be as a consequence of increased bulk and power, then a move to centre might be worth a try. With an abundance of wingers, what have we got to lose?

Spot on!! And let’s not forget Tony Clubb - England centre to prop!!

Completely agree with you,great atmosphere while the bean counters wouldn’t agree it was maybe a case of less is more?

And Willie Isa, played the first half of his career at centre.

The attendance wasn’t great but it was only 500 down on last year when Cas were flying so the difference could be away supporters. We should still be aiming for 14k minimum though.

I don’t know what more the club can do. Maybe something like if you’ve had a season ticket in the last 5 years but not this year you get 20% off a half season ticket?

Moving games is not helping to retain or improve the sales of season tickets, im in walking distance and no longer have issues with shift working so im not affected but i know of mates that are.

Well said and not to mention the scores of players in other teams in both hemispheres. If we have a player who can bust a tackle he shouldn't be playing on the wing full stop.

Couldn't disagree more.
Jason Robinson made plenty of busts
Vainokolo
Ryan hall
Pat Richards
You could name hundreds.

Someone mentioned he made the busts from centre position , what if he made them down the centre do we turn him into a prop or 2nd row? Of course not.

He could do a job at centre in an emergency, but he's a winger.

Crowds won’t rise until there’s a different culture at the club. I know of many people who although they appreciate ‘winning’ rugby, have been alienated by the selling of players on a conveyor belt, teh style of play under Wane, the raising of prices, the reduction in home games, the movement of games and even the fact home games aren’t on Sundays.

Just watching the TV recording - really sad to see the East Stand look so sply populated compared to 10 years ago.

They shouldn't have to but hopefully the club can come up with some good ideas to attract some fans back.

There’s loads of new faces or empty seats around me now, a real shame a lot of regulars that have been going since we moved to the JJB have stopped in the last 1/2 years.

1) Selling players :- which players would you have kept that didn't want to leave and how? In one of Wigans most successful periods players like Hanley, Gregory, Bell, Edwards, Betts etc were allowed to leave. I don't know your age but I remember the great Wigan team of the 1960's (Boston, Ashton, McTigue etc) getting too old together, and look at Saints when they held onto Long, Cunningham, Scully etc.

2) Under Wane Wigan have been successful and even last year when some were complaining won the WCC, reached the Challenge Cup final and were 2nd highest try scorers.

3) Wigan are probably the cheapest side to watch in Superleague

4) It's 18 years since Wigan moved from Central Park, I think there have been four games that could have been played there that haven't, hardly a major concern. Similar has happened at Huddersfield and Hull and Saints had to play fifteen at Widnes.

5) When surveyed the MAJORITY of fans wanted Friday night RL partly because the funders of Superleague pick those Friday and Thursday night games for t.v. something that Wigan have no control over.

He's a winger at the moment but that doesn't mean it will always be his best position. Positional shifts often work for players as they go through their careers, especially in positions where pace is paramount. Darren Lockyer prolonged his career as one of the top players in the world by the simple expedient of switching from fullback to half.

I think it was telling that Gildart used the phrase "can't go the full length anymore" when talking about the two breaks on Friday. If that loss of pace is permanent, then a move to centre could most certainly be a move worth exploring. It really is a 'no lose' option.

That's not what he said though.
He said "if we have a player who can bust a take he shouldn't be playing wing full stop".
Is that correct?

I'm sure there are plenty of options available and worth exploring.
Lots have been tried this year.

Budgie can do a job at centre but currently he's a winger and making busts certainly doesn't change that or mean he isn't

Good answer, Rogues. Totally demolished his argument.

It infuriates me when so-called supporters come up with all kinds of painfully transparent excuses as to why they and their mates don't watch any more.

There's no rule that says you MUST watch Wigan RL. But if you don't, then at least have the good grace to admit that it's your own choice; don't try to put it on a club who, compared to 10 years ago, are one of the best in the competition.

I wonder if it's ever occurred to these stay-away supporters that they themselves are storing up problems for Wigan. At present, we have a big squad because we are paying up to the Salary Cap. But how long can we comfortably do that for if we aren't earning revenue from the terraces?

Correct
And maybe that is the reason for some of the clubs innovations in taking games "On The Road"?
Arguments sake - Wigan kept Season tickets at last years prices (Which in effect is approximately a 7% increase due to 1 less game - Although we may get an extra game at home if we finish Top 4 which can't be predicted and something certain fans forget to mention when we got the "Extra" game previously in my view for "Free"icon_wink.gif.
We don't go to Oz and the fans moan at a 7% increase in prices!

I keep hearing the argument that IL should put his hands into his pocket more, I reckon he does enough.
I'd guess that over the last 10 years not including the purchase of the club he's probably put a few million quid in, but to me that's not the point.
Further down the line he leaves the club for whatever reason and the club needs to be viable.

What were the sponsorship deals in place at Wigan end of 2007 and how do they compare income wise to what the clubs done since? Have we increased it?
Turnover - What was it in 2007 relatively to 2017
Last thing I would want is IL leaving the club and the finances behind the scenes being a complete mess.

Final thing & something I've mentioned before and Rogues alluded to above.
I wished I'd have grabbed the exact details when I had a look pre-season but I compared my seat as an individual & my Family's seat as a group to the price of a Saints Season ticket.

For a similar seat/seats it was individually around £100 cheaper at Wigan - For a family in the region of just over £200 cheaper
Game day prices are generally cheaper by between £1-£5 a ticket

End of the day the Money has to come from somewhere - Pointing out the problems isn't going to help - Being a Part of the solution and helping wherever possible is.

Or to take it to the extreme Ray Mordt. I don’t think he ever scored a try by running round his opposite winger. Just ran over you!

This is why I hate stats or name dropping. For every player who has has success at changing position you could name a failed attempt, or a player who stayed in his position and really became outstanding. There's a lot of detail in positional play, a centre is a completely different position to a wing or SR.

Look at the names in the list mentioned, world class players who could pretty much play a number of positions with ease, not all players are to the standard of a Hanley or Faz. Hanley was a great 13, but would have also been great pretty much anywhere on the pitch.

Yes, but if we're being pedantic you said he's a winger full stop. If you'd said he's a winger as it stands, or he's a winger at the moment then I'd have totally agreed with you. Your implication was that he's a winger and a winger he shall stay. That's a completely different argument to the one you answered my post with.

No I didn't - I said "He could do a job at centre in an emergency, but he's a winger"
So I did say that he could play centre, I'll also tell you that he used to think he was a Full Back and still thinks he can do a job there (I'm not convinced but who knows with 12 months training to play either FB or Centre).

Someone else said " [uIf we have a player who can bust a tackle he shouldn't be playing on the wing full stop[/u."

That is what I disagreed with.

And to draw a similar parallel to the Budgie to Centre argument - How did switching Richards to Centre go?

Every situation is different

Connolly wasn't great anywhere on the pitch. He was a poor to average full back and didn't play anywhere else but centre. Robinson was a hit and miss half but a world class winger. Again he played nowhere else and, in all honesty, I can't imagine which other position he could have played with any distinction. There are a mix of players listed. Some multi positional, some outstanding in only one position. That's exactly the point. There is no 'one size fits all' when it comes to players. Hence the reason I said 'worth a try' rather than 'he'd definitely make it as a centre'.

The simple fact is he shows many traits of a top class centre: good awareness, great hands and the ability to bust a takle to name but 3. He's already an excellent winger. He wouldn't suddenly lose that ability if he tried his Hans at centre. I'm not sure why you think he would. Can you name me some players for whom that was the case?

As I said. If we're being pedantic (which you were) then you said he's a winger full stop. Well, if we're being very pedantic, you actually missed the full stop but we'll let that one go!



You're subsequent post regarding Richards proves this is actually what you think anyway so I'm not quire sure of your reasons for arguing unless it's just more pedantary.

For the sake of clarity, do you think it possible Budgie would make a good centre or not and, if not, why not?

And would you further explain how this went on to ruin him as a winger?

I don't actually see the point at all in making our best winger a centre.

PS, Connolly was an outstanding FB, just check out thew cc v Brisbane in Oz.
Robinson played a number of games at FB in both codes.

Let Joe be a winger, develop his game on the wing, this will come with game time and experience. He doesn't need messing around with positional changes, like Jack Hughes was etc.